The state would have to prove the baby was at significant risk of being without proper nutrition, and 2.5 hours without food does not pose a significant risk of harm, IMHO. If flailing was a problem for babies strapped in a car seat, then I would think car seat manufacturers would have serious problems. So, I guess I have a hard time seeing flailing as a significant risk of harm.
I don’t know, Bearflag…I think just leaving a child that young unattended is enough to consider it child endangerment. There was no supervision, and no indication of how much longer the baby was going to be unsupervised.
There was a similar case in my area, where the mother was convicted.
Maybe, as the other poster said, it’s that times have changed.
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:u73GMN5UKl0J:www.13wham.com/news/local/story/Reaction-to-Allen-Verdict/wSfz7H7UBkeXvgeEdT1vmg.cspx+Nicole+Allen+rochester&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a
OK, but to convict, the prosecutor will likely need to explain why it’s such a risk. I don’t think the court or the defense will let the prosecutor get away with saying “it’s just dangerous” without explaining why it’s dangerous in this case.
Again, I’m not trying to defend these creeps, but I see huge pitfalls for the prosecution. I’m trying to think if I was a prosecutor, what would I need to argue to hold these jerks accountable, but the facts are tough here.
That’s what I’m saying, I’m not sure if they will have to do that. I think it could be considered the standard of care, so to speak, that a newborn infant is supposed to be supervised by an adult. It’s illegal to leave children unattended, so they could be convicted of breaking that law.
Ah … maybe times have changed.
Not really. There is no doubt that the child was actually left unattended for a fairly long period of time, essentially at the mercy of any passing stranger. Crime statistics for that and/or similar locations could possibly establish an increased risk to an unaccompanied child.
It was 54 degrees outside, the child was dressed in only a thin cotton garment with a blanket. In and of itself, that’s a risk to the child’s health.
Also, the casino likely has large signs posted all over the parking area warning people not to do exactly this, because it is a crime.
For giggles, you could probably get the casino to cough up video of the parents laughing, joking, drinking, etc. That’s probably enough for a misdemeanor conviction. Also probably enough to get the local version of what I’d call Youth Court/DHS involved as well.
Here’s the article, by the way. They told officials they were in the casino just long enough to use the restroom, but video cameras proved them wrong.
Hmmm. That article indicates they are apparently charged under the felony version of the statute. Bond set at $50K each. I agree it might be tough to make a felony charge stick on these facts, but the misdemeanor version seems simple enough. May also be liable for some sort of charge for lying to the cops during the investigation.
If I were the prosecutor I would argue the 54 degree temperature was a danger to the baby’s health. I’m not readily finding information online about what temperatures can cause hypothermia in infants older than neonates at the moment, but there must be information out there.
One thing they have going in their favor is that their names are fun to say:
Thuan Nguyen
Panfila Phan <---- sounds like a drug
In my decidedly unlegal opinion, I don’t think there actually is an onus on prosecution to prove that there was an imminent danger to the infant; just being alone for two and a half hours in a fairly uncontrolled situation is enough to endanger a child that young, as far as I know.
As a prosecutor, I could go into court a argue that letting a 10 year old make a baloney sandwich by himself is extremely dangerous, but if I can’t prove the danger in it beyond a reasonable doubt, I doubt I will get very far.
The prosecutor must prove the situation in this case either
(1) … “causes or permits the life or limb of such child to be endangered, or the health of such child to be injured … or causes … such child to be placed in such situation that its life or limb may be endangered, or its health likely to be injured.” (PENAL CODE 273a)
or
(2) there are conditions that present a significant risk to the child’s health or safety. (CVC 15620)
Here are a couple of interesting cases in the Sacramento area in the past week:
1. Mothers leave kids alone with burning candle. Kids die in fire. Police recommend involuntary manslaughter and child endangerment charges.
2. Father, an off-duty cop, fails to notice kid near loaded gun in house. Kid shoots herself and dies. Case forwarded to DA but no recommended charges. :dubious:
FTR, I am appalled by the behavior of every one of the parents cited in this thread, and believe they all deserve prosecution. The so-called “tragedy” of accidental abandonment is every bit as much of a crime as the deliberate abandonment in the OP.
That said, I did notice this,
You don’t really think you’d be wrong to be next door for a couple minutes, right? You’re just describing a visceral feeling?
Because… you have a monitor, you’re obviously leaving the room while she’s asleep. Presumably you would move between floors of your house, or answer the front door, right? Would you step outside onto a porch? Walk out to the curb with a bag of trash? (Obviously I don’t know your arrangement, but “I share a property line” implies you own a single-family house.)
Meh, according to my mom I started sleeping all night pretty much immediately [it was my brother who was a hyperactive little git and wanted to eat every hour on the hour]
I am more than sure that I woke up either my mom or the nanny if I was wet or hungry, and since I seemed to have slept for significantly more than 2.5 hours as a newborn, constantly ramming a nipple in my mouth didn’t seem to be in order, and I was never a skinny child.
There is a warning tag on car seats to not leave children unattended in car seats. They are not to be used as infant seats and pose an inherent risk of strangulation from the straps.
That could be something the prosecutor could use.
Anyone who has had a baby for 7 weeks should know how rearranged they can get in a car seat and should worry about that even if they don’t bother to read or pay attention to warning tags. Babies are like liquid at that age and manage to mold into all sorts of weird configurations when forced to be in the upright angle of a car seat. Mostly they kind of pour downward placing the straps against their neck.
I don’t think anyone would claim that leaving a baby in their own crib, in an occupied house/apt. is “leaving them alone” in the sense of “leaving them unattended”. Heck, by that logic, my 5 year old is “left alone” for 12 hours every single day.
That case was for a manslaughter charge, wasn’t it? And in the present case, we have child endangerment. Perhaps the two crimes have different degrees of mental culpability? Simple negligence might be enough to support child endangerment but is typically insufficient for manslaughter.