That makes sense, since most of the ones I’ve met have been. Thanks!
She obviously didn’t get disciplined enough as a child. If I had a 12 year old daughter dating a 23 year old man, I’d ground her for a couple years and get a restraining order on the the guy.
There is quite a bit of speculation that her parent’s efforts to prevent her from seeing the 23 year old prompted the murders (at least in part), so I’m not sure that discipline was the problem. I think that “Rotten to the Core” was the problem.
Or perhaps the discipline thing should have started 12 years earlier.
Like all things, it was probably a combination of things that led to this horrible outcome; parents too lax, girl too difficult, girl too messed-up in the head, messed-up girl met other messed-up boy, parents tried to discipline too late; it’s a rich tapestry. Take any one of these factors out and it might not have gone the same; she might have just grown up to be a borderline personality who spent her life making her parents’ lives miserable.
Regarding the legal aspect, this board is based in the United States, and we are required to follow their rules while we participate here (an example of that is sharing music files, which is still legal in Canada but illegal in the U.S.). Isn’t that a two way street? Do our Canadian laws regarding publishing the name of the young offender apply here in spite of the fact that we are not on a Canadian message board? The wikipedia article I linked earlier has her name on it front and centre.
Right on. Call me crazy, but a 12-year-old who manages to have a relationship with a 23-year-old with coke dealer friends may not have been getting quite the amount of care most tweens deserve. Not that that’s an excuse, but 12-freaking-years-old- I don’t care how they’re dressing or how adult they’re acting these days, that’s a child. I can put myself back into my sixth grade mindset, and I really hadn’t developed a full understanding of the xconsequences of my actions, or even a high level of empathy for others. Sure I wasn’t a murderer, but I also wasn’t screwing a 20-SOMETHING.
This verdict makes her Canada’s youngest convicted multiple murderer, ever. I mean… wow.
If you are posting/publishing to the Boards from Canada, then you are subject to Canadian law (in addition to whatever countries might have jurisdiction as your post zips about the internet).
We don’t normally edit posts except for more mundane stuff such as removing NSFW links (at least, I try not to), but a poster here has accidentally violated Canadian law while posting from Canada, so I’ve gone ahead and removed the offending links and name upon request.
This is not meant to be a prohibition against, say, Americans, posting the same information. In this case I’m just trying to help a neighbor up north.
Thanks, Skip. I still think the law is bullshit, but I’m not willing to be prosecuted for it.
Yeah, good luck with that. You and the other people in this thread who think discipline is that easy obviously haven’t met anyone who really is that nasty to deal with.
This girl reminds me of my sister in some ways. My sister obviously didn’t go to the same extremes, but there wasn’t a whole lot my parents could do to control her. She was a pretty decent kid, but turned into a total piece of shit when she hit puberty. Eventually, she grew out of most of it, but from about age 11 she was hell for my parents to deal with.
An illustration: She was grounded as a 12 year old for coming home too late, back when my parents still attempted to have a trust-based relationship with her. That didn’t suit her. On the third day of her week-long grounding, she sneaked out the window of her room in the middle of the night, met up with a friend of hers that she probably worked out a plan with at school — because she sure as hell wasn’t allowed to make any phone calls during her grounding — and toilet-papered a neighborhood house. She didn’t come home that night.
My parents called up all of her friends’ parents the next morning when they found out she was gone. No luck. My mom, who couldn’t afford to be gone from work because she was the owner, manager, and main person at the business, nevertheless took most of the morning to canvass the neighborhood looking for her. No luck there either. My parents called the police because she didn’t show up for school and wasn’t home by that evening.
The police picked her up at school the next day when her home-room teacher informed the principal of her attendance. She spent 48 hours in the system before my parents could get through the paperwork needed to spring her. At that point they weren’t all that enthused about getting her back, so it’s not like they were trying to speed things up any. She blamed my parents for having to spend two days in Juvie. My mom told her to be thankful they hadn’t left her there for a week. My mother wasn’t exactly a shy retiring type.
That wasn’t the first, or the last time my sister caused trouble, but it wasn’t due to my parents’ lack of oversight. They did everything possible to prevent her from becoming a total hellion, but she was determined to do what she wanted when she wanted to do it. Nothing short of non-opening bars on the windows and a lock on the outside of her door would have prevented her from sneaking out sometime when everyone was asleep, and for obvious reasons, that couldn’t be done. Nothing short of an escort to, from, and during school would have been enough supervision to prevent her from ditching school, going AWOL, or making plans with her cronies during the day.
Grounding did nothing but make her the most unpleasant person in the world to be around, and she’d sneak out whenever she could. Social measures meant nothing to her. Parental disapproval was desirable from her point of view. Yelling made no impression, and she was better at it than any of us more civilized family members. Physical punishment wouldn’t have worked even if my parents had wanted to use it; she would have used Child Services against them. Counseling, truant officers, nothing made any difference at all.
So yeah, go ahead and think that discipline was the problem. I know from growing up with my sister that some teens are just fucked up, and no normal measures that parents can legally and morally take will prevent the kids from doing what they want. My sister managed to keep herself out of jail, but that’s because she was smart enough to see that it was in her best interest to keep out of that kind of trouble, not because she had any compunction against doing stuff that could put her there.
Some people just aren’t bound by the same strictures that most people will follow to get along in society. If you’re lucky, they acquire some restraint over time, usually when the hormone rushes of youth start to balance out, and they may even become halfway decent human beings if you’re really, really lucky. If you’re not, well, you get stuff like this happening, or early death from violence, drug addiction, or plain old stupidity mixed with extreme risk-taking behavior. Crime and war are about the only two environments these kinds of people flourish in.