upgrading my pc.. help?

In My Humble Opinion
1

so my pentium3 667 (w/Geforce 2 titanium) is aging and world of warcraft is coming out, so maybe it’s time to get a new one. i’m really out of touch with the pc market and was rather surprised to learn that we’re still at pentium 4, i would have thought it would be 5 or 6 or whatever by now. anyway the pc man recommended the following parts for me to buy (i don’t need a new hard disk or monitor):

(prices in SGD)
$467 P4 3.0E and MSI 865PE NEO2-PLS SATA/Lan/DDR400 cpu and motherboard
$158 PC3200 Corsair DDR400 CL2.5 256M (2pcs) ram
$075 XP-7788 Kbs/Ksv/Kt 400W PSU +3 Fan casing

$045 LG 52x32x52 CD-RW -or-
$098 BENQ 16X DVD + RW (DW 1600) cd/dvdrw

$319 Forsa GeForce FX5900XT 128MB DDR TV/DVI -or-
$339 GeCube Radeon 9800 Xtreme 256mb graphics card

so total would be about $1064 (~ US$600 i guess), which will use up my budget and a little bit more. i’m aiming for a setup that would last me 3-5 years of gaming. i don’t understand what half of those things mean, so any advice/opinions will be appreciated. i’ll be reading up on whether to get a Geforce or Radeon. thanks.

or should i just get a whole new system from dell or something…

2

I just ordered a whole new set of computer components so I can play the next generation of games, and I pretty much disagree with all of your choices. :slight_smile:

Check out Ars Technica’s Buyer’s Guide. They have a recent one for gaming boxes which is really helpful.

I would pay an extra $60-80 to get a Geforce 6800 GT – much, much faster than either the 5900 XT or the Radeon 9800. I would also get an Athlon 64 over the Pentium – all the benchmarks I saw show the Athlons significantly outperforming the Pentiums, especially with games. The socket 939 chipset is a bit more expensive than the 754 chipset, but has dual memory channels, giving it better bandwidth and hence better gaming performance. (I read an article that showed the 939 w. 512 kb L2 cache performed about as well as a 754 with a 1 meg L2 cache, so that’s another option if you want.)

Anyway, here’s what I just bought, after much research. The overall total is a bit cheaper than what you have listed and will be significantly faster:

GeForce6800 GT with 256 megs: $400 (J&R Music/Computer World)
Athlon 64 3500+ (socket 939): $285 (newegg.com)
GIGABYTE GA-K8NS Ultra-939 motherboard: $116 (newegg.com1 )
1 gig (2x512 meg) Corsair PC3200 DDR400: $156

Total: $957 USD

Note: I just realized that your prices aren’t in USD. Doh! Oh well, I’ll post this anyway and you can take it with a grain of salt. (I thought your prices seemed oddly high…)

3

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Wow, that’s almost exactly what I bought (different motherboard) three weeks ago.

shijinn, check out these threads for some more advice:

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=280020

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=279398

4

Most gamers seem incapable of having a PC last six months before they feel the itch for something faster, so your hopes of making a PC last 3-5 years is highly optimistic. For reference, five years ago, a snappy system ran a Pentium 2 at 400 MHz, had 128 MB RAM and a 6 GB drive, and ran Windows 98. It was tired three years ago.

The faster video card will always cost $500 or more, and will be replaced by a faster card in two months.

As for the Pentium numbering, yes, Intel’s been rather emamored with the “4” for some reason. There’s been four or five huge architectural changes to the P4, (three different front-side bus speeds, and hyperthreading) so we really should be at Pentium 8 or 9. Instead, the new procs have an entirely new naming scheme as they’re trying to get away from raw speed as the indicator - right now, the hot proc seems to be the P4 560J

5

Your proposed setup will not last very long at all.

Your CPU should be a 64-bit AMD, 939 pin. They run cooler than the Intels and are faster in many tests and cheaper. For major cost savings, get a CPU 2 steps behind the current state-of the art. An A64-3500 is £150 whereas an A64-3800 is £380. You could save significantly by going for a 754-pin A64 - the A64-3000 is £85.

Video card should be a Geforce 6800 of some description.

I can’t recommend a motherboard but be prepared to chuck it in 6-12 months (as budget permits) if you buy a nVidia graphics card as the GeForce cards can do SLI (remember the Voodoo 2s?), but there aren’t any cheapish motherboards available that actually support it. Alternatively, look into getting one of the Small Form Factor systems like Shuttle - you’ll love the lack of size and the ease of portability, but the cost is significant - £200 - for the A64/939 model, though you get case, motherboard, and lots of stuff included. This will likely break your budget. Not sure if Shuttle do a PCI Express model though.

Get 1 GB (2x 512 MB) of memory - Windows will love it. Get 2 GB if you can afford it.

I recommend you do actually get a new HDD and a KVM switch and keep your old system running - there’s nothing actually wrong with it, and you could experiment on it.

6

I agree completely. Rather than buying a $1000 machine every 5 years, I figure I’m far better off buying a $500 every other year, and spending $100-200 on it in upgrades before I toss it for a new machine. This doesn’t let me play the most resource-intensive games (my year-old machine now probably wouldn’t do so well with Doom3), but it’ll let me play most games admirably.

I’d recommend getting the best $500 machine you can, slapping a $150 video card in it, and letting that be your machine for the next two years.

Daniel

7

Could you update it to a model with capital letters? Please?

8

Videocard budget considerations:

The sweet spot on videocards from a price/performance perspective is usually in the mid-range card.

For the current generation, that would be nVidia’s GeForce 6600. The GT version runs at about US$200. Sure, everyone loves bragging about their 6800, but the performance increase has not been equivalent to the price increase increase [mid range to enthusiast], and initial reviews say the same on this round. I think the ATI equivalent is the Radeon X700 Pro. Same story. These are PCI Express cards, and you would need a different motherboard to run these. AGP versions should be out shortly. However, if you are going to upgrade your mobo, there is little reason not to go PCI Express at this point in time.

I use an MSI board and videocard (which I will be updating when socket 939 goes PCI Express later this year). I haven’t had any problems with them, but I’ve read from many who believe MSI to be more performance-oriented, but less reliable. These people tend to prefer ASUS for reliability.

As Giraffe stated, AMD is the gamer’s choice. P4s are stronger where they can take advantage of hyper-threading, and do better in encoding tasks (writing CDs and DVDs) and Photoshop tasks. MOST users will not notice the difference, though. Price should be your decision-maker, and AMD wins here. That said, your CPU/mobo combination is very good for a non-PCI Express set up. I would take the savings from the videocard, and invest in a faster processor on a PCI Express motherboard.

Giraffe, NEVER buy anything from J&R. They are overpriced on everything. Check newegg.com for the same component, and you will likely get a better deal. I used to browse the store frequently (right across the street from work) but I realized that I will only ever make emergency purchases because of the markup there.

Anand Tech loves the new NEC dual-layered 16X DVD burner, and it’s around US$80. There is a Plextor model in the same price range that is also top notch. I haven’t heard anything bad about BenQ, but I haven’t heard anything good either. I just haven’t heard anything. The prices I’m quoting are OEM, as opposed to retail box. Rereading your post, you were probably quoted retail prices, which tend to be a little more expensive.

To conclude, the only items the pc man suggested that I truly take issue with are the videocards. If you want 3-5 years, go with the current generation, not the last. And then, log on to WoW and knock yourself out!

9

thanks for all the replies! i had much to read.

if i parse them correctly, AMD is the way to go, along with GeForce 6800GT and possibly PCI Express. this also seems to be a bad time to upgrade, since socket 939 will go PCI-E soon, and the 6600GT will get AGP soon… the 6800GT is abit over my budget. 6600GT looks nice, and i might hold off buying the graphics card till the AGP version is out (since WoW supposedly works on my old GF2ti). so tentatively, following Ars’ budget box specs:

(prices in SGD)
$333 MSI K7N2 Delta-L (nF2) 8X/USB2/ATA133/5.1
AMD XP (BOX) S2800
$158 PC3200 Corsair DDR400 CL2.5 256M (2pcs)
$233 ATI Radeon 9600 Pro 256MB
$045 LG 52x32x52 CD-RW
$135 Lian-Li PC7A+Aluminium w/2 Fan

$904

a P4 PCI-E setup with 6600 will cost $500 more, so i don’t know… i’ve adjusted my expectations and will look towards upgrading again in 2-3 years.

not so much an equipment problem as it is a virus of some sort, and it appears mildly widespread. the scanner’s whacked though, since this is the first detection after more than a thousand posts. :smiley:

10

It looks like your budget is around $550 - $600 US.

You will be upgrading CPU, motherboard, videocard, memory, optical reader, and case.

At that price point, 64-bit processing is out. Your motherboard/cpu is probably the best price/performance combo at that range. My advice would be to hold off on the videocard still, and wait for the 6600 (nonGT) in AGP. Should be around year-end. Lian-Li cases, which are undoubtedly nice, high-end cases, are expensive. You might look at the Antec Sonata (very nice finish) or Antec Solution Series, both which include a decent power supply (380W and 350W respectively). The savings could be added the the money you are holding aside for your videocard, or if you absolutely must have a videocard now, upgrading to a 9800 Pro.

11

I recently upgraded to an Athlon 64 2800+ & an Asus K8N motherboard. Total cost was $140 for the CPU, $89 for the motherboard. (USD) So far they have been running really great - I overclocked the 2800+ by 450mhz without a single problem as well. Doom 3 and CS:Source now run much smoother. Then there is the Sempron 3100+ to consider; unlike the other Semprons, it is based off the Athlon 64; it should run about $124 and is quite quick (2.8ghz ->3ghz Pentium 4) in games.

If you got the Sempron & this motherboard, and a $150 Geforce 6600, and $160 for a gig of memory, that should leave enough for a decent case & CDRW drive.

12

Good to know for future reference, although that was not true in this case. The card was the same price as newegg, and ended up being cheaper because I don’t have to pay sales tax at J&R. Not to mention the fact that newegg was completely out of stock on all the 6800 GTs.

I’m a huge fan of newegg, though, which is why I cough up the sales tax to buy from them. I highly recommend them to anyone and everyone. Case in point: I actually first bought a Geforce 6800 GT from them, and it died after a few months. (We may have had a brownout which killed it, actually.) They took it back even though it was more than 30 days after I bought it, and because they were out of stock on that card, they gave me a full refund. What’s not to love?

13

Returning computer gear at J&R is a nightmare. You literally need to visit the bowels of the earth (ok, you got me, the basement of a different building) which is staffed by people who were too slow to work at DMV :eek: and wait to get a receipt which will permit you to return to the store and beg for your money back. Newegg has them beat there, too, hands-down. And I don’t need to pay sales tax at Newegg, while I do at J&R. :cool:

14

i don’t think the shop stock those. actually all that matters in a casing is the power right? so i’ll just get something cheaper with at least 350W?

is a gig of memory necessary? i’m thinking 512mb is enough, will add another 2 sticks if needed.

the prices at newegg looks good, i would save a couple hundred dollars (not considering shipping and tax) were it accessible to me.

15

Well, I like a handsome case (and all the Lian Li’s are handsome), but many cheap cases with power supplies have really cheap power supplies, which can be bad for components. Antec is also a power supply manufacturer, and they manufacture good power supplies, so their cases with power supplies tend to be better.

As you will need a new power supply rated for a P4/AMD (I don’t think any Lian Li cases come with one, but your seller may bundle it himself), look for a case without a power supply and get a power supply separately. Lots of good, not to expensive 350-400w power supplies. Enermax, Antec, Sparkle (very inexpensive but reliable) are good brands that won’t break the bank.

16

Don’t buy an AMD XP - that’s the old 32-bit chip.

17

an update, in case any one is interested…

i haven’t got around to upgrading yet because blizzard’s ‘coming soon to the rest of the world’ is still in effect since november.

anyway i’m not waiting anymore and here’s the new specs with PCI-E:

(prices in SGD)
$440 MSI RS480M2-IL
AMD SC 939 3000
$160 1GB PC3200 Corsair DDR400 CL2.5 (2pcs)
$339 Leadtek PX6600 GT TDH
$109 Pioneer DVR-109 16x DvD Writer
$100 some kinda casing

$1148