He is, clearly, spectacularly loathed abroad. Even my most right-wing friends in this country have little good to say about him, and even before the whole war on terror thing kicked off this was the case.
However, he appears to have quite a cachet in your country, and I was wondering if this had anything to do with (presumably) well-publicised fact that ‘we’ all think he’s rubbish. A bit like when a stranger starts insulting a cousin of yours that you dislike yourself, but you’re damned if you’re going to let an outsider say it.
[Conversely, I’m under the impression that Clinton was rather unpopular domestically, yet internationally he was very popular]
I admire Bush and opposed Bill Clinton. The world’s antipathy toward Bush doesn’t make me like Bush more or like him less. However, it does reduce my respect for world opinion.
Of course, people from other countries have an excuse. They naturally know less about the US than Americans do. They don’t live here. They’re not directly concerned with our leadership. And, they are at the mercy of their media.
Still, the world’s wrong judgment of Bush and Clinton makes it easier for me to believe that they may be wrong about other things as well.
Bush isn’t as unpopular as you may think. I suspect most countries don’t think much about him at all. He’s certainly a disagreeable character, and he tends to say what he means. I like that. Politics may be all lies, and diplomacy certainly is, but its nicely refreshing to have someone who who doesn’t follow every passing whim of the electorate.
Well, yes we are, but so are you to yours. And anyway, our media in the UK is quite pro-US.
Obviously we don’t really care that much about your internal politics, and are overwhelmingly concerned with your international policy, but that is a topic on which I expect the world is on an even keel with the US.
You said ’ The world’s antipathy toward Bush doesn’t make me like Bush more or like him less. However, it does reduce my respect for world opinion. ': are the two things not rather tied together? Like it or not, people do veer toward creating binary opposites out of issues.
The worlds opinion of Bush means crap to me. He’s the president of my country and I’ll judge him on his record, what he has done for my country, and what he has done for the world. What someone in Nigera thinks about him will have no bearing on my vote. Why should it?
I can’t see voting for him, for a variety of reasons, but I’ll not give a rat’s ass what citizens of other countries’ opinions of him are when I step into the voting booth. I’d hope that, say, my opinion of John Howard would not have any bearing on his judgement day. JH does not represent me, and GWB does not represent other noble citizens of the world.
Yes, but they know way more about the rest of the world. (It is also somewhat debatable how much less they know about Americans than Americans do, especially since their media often report well-researched facts about the U.S. that the American media ignores.)
Since, of course, we all know that the U.S. media is “fair and balanced” (just like Fox says they are) while other media in the world is all biased in the same direction. (In other words, “Look, everyone is out of step but my Johnny!”) :rolleyes:
Short answer: in practical terms, it doesn’t much matter what Europeans think of GWB, for good or for ill.
Oh, left-leaning Americans sometimes get embarrassed when they have to listen to European friends rail against the President, and conservative Americans get irritated or angry when they hear the same thing. But foreign hostility to the President doesn’t change anyone’s opinion here in the States. Whether an American loves or loathes GWB, he’s not going to change his opinion because of what outsiders think.
Certainly true - but we do know a lot about the rest of the world; this is what we’re concerned about. WE don’t care about US tax rebates or welfare reform. We do care about strategic machinations and international trade practices. It is largely on outward-facing US policy that we make our judgement.
smiling bandit. When I first joined the boards, I made a similar sweeping statement about Bush’s popularity in Europe. I was rightly pulled up on it by (I think) Gary Kumquat, who said that I shouldn’t tar with such a broad brush.
Since then, I’ve been doing more asking around. And, with the exception of Gary (who didn’t specify whether he did or he didn’t loathe Bush - just that I didn’t speak for him) and a Mr T. Blair of 10, Downing Street, London, I have found no foreigners whatsoever who like the guy or his foreign policy. None whatsoever. I’m not just talking liberal Euro-weenies: people I know from all shades of the political spectrum, and from all over the world - from Botswana to Hong Kong. It’s not a scientific survey, I know, but then I don’t think the stats exist - I doubt the international media takes approval ratings on other countries’ leaders.
But of course, none of this matters really, does it?
Those damn foreigners, never know what’s good for them!
By the way, I should point out that I am largely in favour of Bush’s Roadmap initiative in the Middle East, and my opinion of the gentleman in question will indeed rise if a reasonably fair and balanced settlement is achieved.
I think no more or less of Bush and his largely bad policies based on what the opinions of him are overseas.
When I hear foolish stereotypes spouted in the international press (the “cowboy” sneer is typical, giving the impression that the writer’s knowledge of Bush and America stems mainly from old John Wayne movies), I think less of those sources, but my opinion of Bush doesn’t change.
I suspect Bush is not nearly as internationally loathed as some non-U.S. Dopers believe. “I and everyone in my circle dislike him” is not a reliable gauge of foreign opinion.
Ditto jjimm - especially after the comments I quoted in the settlements thread. Here’s a big hope that it isn’t just hot air, empty promises and electioneering.
What an ignorant, stupid statement. The average US citizen knows less about the world than the average non-US citizen? What, pray, do you base THAT on?
What an ignorant, stupid statement. The average US citizen knows less about the world than the average non-US citizen? What, pray, do you base THAT on?
