Very basic Civilization 3 questions

Cafe Society
1

I just got Civ 3 complete. I’m having trouble with a few basic things in the game.

  1. How far apart should I build cities? Do the actual cities ever expand to more than the one original square? I know the boundaries expand, I mean the actual city square…

  2. I had civil unrest, and it was suggested that I build a temple or something to placate the citizens - but I couldn’t, because they won’t build anything in civil unrest! What do I do with that?

  3. I had an overpopulation problem - how can I fix that?

In general, help a COMPLETE newbie with some VERY BASIC tips, please :slight_smile:

George

2

I haven’t played Civ 3 in awhile, too busy playing Civ 4, but let me see if I can help.

  1. The max room a city can use is the “fat cross”, 2 squares in each direction, except the diagonal, its equal to the 2nd culture step. Normally when I build cities I try to give them as much as this as possible without overlapping. However, there is of course times when you would want to overlap (like it the 2nd city is trying to get that resource).

  2. When a city is in civil unrest, you can’t build anything. You need to stop the civil unrest first by turning some of your citizens into entertainers. You can do this by clicking on one of the squares that is being worked in the city screen, this will make one of the citizens a speciallist, and the default speciallist is an entertainer. To avoid civil unrest, you need to make sure that there are not more unhappy people then happy people.

  3. If the city is overpopulated, the only way to lower the pop is to build settlers, workers, to pop rush something, or to starve the people. Pick one :slight_smile:

Hope that helps

3

You can also increase the amount of taxes that go to entertainment, but that always seemed less effective to me. It does mean you can build faster/ get more food from each city, however.

4

The city itself only ever covers one square. All the squares two spaces in any direction (only one square diagonally) can be used to provide money, food, and production, provided you have enough population to work each square. A city has to be at least population 20 to work every single square around it. Any citizens after that become specialists: scientists, engineers, entertainers, etc. However, sometimes you’ll want to turn citizens into specialists before that. You do this by going into the city view and clicking on one of the squares around the city that’s currently producing resources for you. The citizen in that square will stop being a laborer, and become a specialist.

Cities also produce cultural influence, which is what that border you see on the world map is all about. There’s no real cap on how much that can expand, although I think if you break 10,000 culture in one city, you get the Culture victory.

Generally speaking, you want at least four squares between any two cities, so that all your cities can access all 20 squares around it. Practically speaking, there are times when you don’t have to worry about it: cities near mountain ranges or deserts are unlikely to reach 20 population, as they can’t produce that much food. You might also want to have cities closer together near contested borders, to focus your cultural influence in that area and hopefully convert enemy cities.

This is one of those instances where you’ll want to turn workers into specialist - specifically, entertainers. The easiest way to do this, especially for beginners, is to go into the city view and click on the city itself in the production screen. The computer will automatically re-distribute enough of your citizens into entertainers to restore order to the city.

You can also go to your domestic advisor and redirect money towards keeping people happy across your entire empire. However, this will take money away from your research. Unless you’re having riots in multiple cities at the same time, it’s a better idea to use entertainers, instead.

Lose a war. :smiley:

Actually, what you really need to do is build more settlers or workers. Settlers should always have priority unless you’ve run out of places to put cities. Workers are very important for building improvements on all of the terrain tiles around each of your cities, increasing those tiles outputs. You can also slow down your growth by limiting how many citizens are producing food. You do this from the city view screen, the same as making entertainers. The more food a city produces, the faster it grows. If you produce negative food, eventually the city will starve down to a sustainable level. If you produce exactly zero extra food, your population will stablize and stop growing.

5

My strategy is (I should say was) a little different… avoid overlap when possible, but plot the cities so that when they do become the “fat x”, they should completely cover the map. Normally I’ll settle the nearest area that will become a boardering city first; sometimes I’ll make a beeline for a resource or to build a city at a choke point on the map.

You can also take the settler you build and run it over to a city that you think would be more productive if it had just… one… more… person. Once the settler’s in the city, do a “join city.” Then you’ve lost two pops in the overcrowded city, and gained a pop in the undercrowded city.

Or you can draft citizens. I don’t remember what point you can start a draft (too busy with Civ IV, myself), but that does lower your population.

6

Except for the first couple of cities, I almost never put four spaces between my cities. 3 spaces (or moving 4 times from the original) is plenty. This gives you a maximum overlap of 3 squares. I also like to move 3 diagonal spaces away from a city as well. (You only have 2 overlapping squares when you do this). There really isn’t much difference between a size 13 and a size 20 city (less than between a size 12 and size 13 city for example). Putting less space between cities allows you to build more cities.

7

You can do it with Republic, I think. I don’t do it, because it increases unhappiness in that city for quite some time, I’m not sure how much.

8

Thanks for the help - I have a better grasp now, I think. It all seems so very complicated. I haven’t had a chance to play today - I’m roped into housecleaning - but I was having trouble simply using the interface. The manual is piss-poor, IMHO. On the city view screen, my cursor turned into a scrabble tile with the letter C on it - why is that?

George

9

And another thing - in the manual, it says that I start with a population of one, but it says right there on the screen, population 150,000. Am I missing something?

G

10

Just had the opportunity to play for 45 minutes or so. I’m just not “getting” the game. I’m trying to produce a settler. I have enough shields, but my advisor keeps popping up saying that I have to increase population before I can produce the settler. Why? And how?

How do I get more shields? Sometimes my workers, after clearing forest, send shields to Istanbul, sometimes not.

I have 108 gold in the treasury - why can’t I devote that to science? I seem to only be able to use income…

Is there a decent beginner guide somewhere? Everything I’ve found seems to assume I know something that I don’t. We all know, for example, in real life, what a gas pedal is, but if we’ve never been in a car, the term is meaningless…

G

11

:slight_smile:

That’s not a scrabble tile. It’s supposed to look like a book. It appears when you move your pointer over certain parts of the screen, because if you click there, an entry in the “Civilopedia” will open up to help explain what your looking at. Try it and see!

Well, not really, but you’re looking at two different values. A population of “1” means that you have enough population to work 1 tile within your city radius. That tile will produce some combination of shields, food, and/or commerce per turn. The food you produce will be “stored” until it reaches a certain threshold – you can see the amount stored in your city screen. Once you’ve filled in that box, your population will go up to “2”, and you’ll be able to start working two tiles within your city radius.

The actual population, such as it is displayed in the city screen, also increases as your city grows larger. It’s really just eye candy, though, and doesn’t affect the game as far as I know.

By the way, if you’re having problems with city unrest, you might want to use your governor. Hit the letter G while in your city screen, or right-click on the city (while in map view) and select him/her from the pop-up list. I always use the governor to automatically regulate happiness, so my cities never go into unrest. If you don’t use your governor, you’ll find it necessary to do a very great deal of micromanagement in the game, especially once you’ve got a dozen cities or so. It takes a while to get a feel for how to use him, so you’ll just have to experiment with the settings, although I usually set him to emphasis food and production, at least in the beginning of a game.

Also, you can pick up useful tip(s for beginners at www.civfanatics.com.

12

You can draft people once you get the “Nationalism” tech.

13

Making a settler reduces the population of the city producing it by two. Making a worker reduces it by one. If the city is so small that this would reduce the population to zero, the city won’t produce the settler.

Build mines. I usually put mines on hills and grasslands, and irrigate deserts and plains. This ensures that each tile is producing a roughly balanced amount of food and shields. Cutting down a forest only sends shields to a city if the forest was within that city’s production radius. Remember, a city can only work a number of tiles within its production radius equal to the city’s population., so building three mines around a size two city isn’t going to help.

If you go to your domestic advisor, you can set how much money you want to spend on science, how much on keeping your people happy, and how much you want to save in your treasury. Early in the game, the treasury isn’t hugely useful. I usually max out my science research right away, at least until I get a better government than despotism, and can use money to hurry production.

When you’re looking at your world map, you’ll see a number 1 next to your first city. That number represents how many hundreds of thousands of people live in the city. The city view gives you a more precise number, so you know when your city will increase to the next size level.

14

Okay, George, I’ll give it a shot.

First: producing a worker or settler costs your city population. If you produce a worker, your city will drop one population point. If you produce a settler, it will drop two points. This is done to simulate the idea that a part of your city’s population has up and moved out, to found a new city somewhere else.

This means that your first city must have a population of 2 before it can produce a worker. After producing that worker the city will temporarily shrink to 1, and then gradually go up again.

A city must have a population of 3 to produce a settler. It will immediately drop to 1 after the settler has been produced, and then gradually grow again.

Workers are necessary for tile improvement. At the beginning of the game they can perform four functions: build roads, build mines, irrigate, and chop trees.

If you build a road on a tile that is being worked by your city, it will usually generate +1 commerce. If you irrigate, it will produce +1 food. If you build a mine, it will produce +1 shield. So, to answer your second question, to increase shield production you should use your workers to build mines.

All of the above is modified, however, by the type of terrain you’re improving. So here is a general rule of thumb: mine grasslands (green) and hills. Irrigate plains (brown). Start by looking at your city screen and noting which tiles are being worked by population. Irrigate and/or mine those tiles first. A tile must be in use for its improvements to add to its production.

Roads are very important, because they add commerce, and commerce is the foundation of your society’s research speed.

Also, learn your terrain types. At this stage you need to at least have a vague idea their differences.

Chopping down trees generates a one-time 10-shield bonus to your city – provided the trees you’ve chopped down are within the city radius. Otherwise you’re simply wasting your chopping. Be aware as well that you can hack down jungle, but don’t get any bonus for that.

Regarding you science production: there are a number of so-called “advisor” screens at your disposal. One of the most important is the city advisor (F1). Use the city advisor to “macromanage” your civilization.

If you hit F1 you will find a luxury and science slider in the top right-hand corner of your screen. These sliders determines how you spend the commerce produced by your civilization. They can be set from 0 to 100%, but combined can never total more than 100%. The more commerce you produce, the higher you can set your science slider. This translates excess commerce into science beakers and hastens your technological advancement. The luxury slider affects citizen happiness: the more commerce you invest in luxuries, the happier your subjects become. But be careful to maintain a balanced budget! Always make sure your civ’s finances are “growing,” not “shrinking.” Excess money is saved, and can be used to purchase technologies from rival civilizations, or, at later stages in the game, to purchase city improvements.

Hope that helps.

15

A settler takes two population from your city, a worker takes one. If you build a worker in a 1 population city, or a settler in a 2 population city that would disband the city. Very very rarely would you want to do this. So don’t build a settler until your city is 3 population…or you calculate that the city will reach 3 population before the settler is complete.

If you open up the city interface, you’ll see a food storage bin, and a shield storage bin. These show how much food or shields you’ve stored up, as well as how much you add per turn. When your food storage bin is full, your city grows 1 population. Each citizen requires food, but can also do work. If the citizens are producing more food than they consume, the city will grow. If they produce as much as they consume, the city will be static. If they consume more than they produce, the city will begin to starve. You can increase food production by moving citizens to higher food-producing tiles. If you have citizens working on mountains they’ll produce shields, but no food. If they work floodplains they’ll produce food but no shields. The best tiles to work are special resource tiles…they give bonus food, trade, or shields. You can increase the value of the tiles with your workers…if you irrigate you produce more food, if you mine you produce more shields, if you road you produce more money.

When your shield bin is full, the unit or building is complete. If a worker cuts down a forest, that sends 5 shields to the nearest city. You should be adding a few shields to the bin every turn anyway, it should tell you how many turns it will be before the item you’re building is complete. You can rush-build by spending more money, or (if you have a despotic government) by making the peasants work harder. But that kills and drives away peasants and makes the survivors very angry at you.

Open up your advisor screen, and turn to your domestic advisor. You’ll see a slider where you can set your trade between money, science, and luxury. If you set it to 100% science you’ll get technology faster, but will probably start going broke. If you set it to 100% money you’ll get rich, but you’ll quickly fall behind the other countries. You probably don’t want to spend any money on luxuries until you’ve got a huge civilization, you’re better off keeping people happy by building temples and making citizens entertainers and connecting to luxury resources.

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Other beginning tips:

Connect all your cities by roads to allow you to move military units back and forth. If your roaded cities are 3 tiles away you can move a unit from one city to another in one turn. Also roads connect your cities to luxuries and strategic resources. Without a road connection to horses you can’t build cavalry units, without iron you can’t build swordsmen.

Always leave at least one soldier per city, even if it’s just a warrior. Never leave a city completely undefended or you’ll be sorry.

Explore as much as you can…the world is full of treasure huts that give you all sorts of goodies. Find them before the other countries do. Also exploring lets you contact other countries and lets you trade with them. Also exploring lets you know where the enemy cities are…there’s nothing worse than being attacked by the Aztecs and not knowing where the enemie soldiers are coming from.

Trade as much as you can, and try to keep a technological edge. If you’ve got a technology no one else has you can trade to every other civilization and make a lot of money. If you start to fall behind the other civilizations will look down at you and think you’re weak and easy to attack.

Go to www.apolyton.com, they have extensive forums for Civ3 and related games. They won’t mind if you ask newbie questions there either.

16

It’s been a while since I played, but generally speaking cities can grow as much as you want. There’s no upper limit on population, so the practical solution isn’t to reduce the population (which the others have indicated). When a city is overpopulated the actual issue isn’t the city size, but instead the facilities in place. IIRC, when a city gets to a population number of 8 you need to build a aqueduct to get bigger. When you get to 12, you need a sewer system I think.

Basically if the city is telling you that you are overpopulated, the solution is to add a improvement that allows that city to accomodate the extra population. A band-aid is to build a settler or a worker, that gets you down an increment, but thats only a temporary solution.

I can understand how the Civ manual is a little confusing since it generally speaks to you as if you played the original Civ games. The game is a little complex, no doubt, and one of the improvements that Civ IV has over Civ3 is that they automated some of these city management tasks. Keep with it, once you get the fundamentals there’s simply no more addictive game on the planet.

17

It’s six before you need to build an aqueduct, but only if your city is not adjacent to fresh water. To get past 12, you need to build a hospital.

That’s not entirely true. The larger a city, the more unhappy population there is in the city. A city that grows faster than your ability to pacify the citizens will riot, and cease to produce research or money for your empire. In the higher difficulty levels, keeping your cities to a managable population is an important challenge.

18

Ohhhhhhh, I see!

That actually explains several unasked questions of mine :slight_smile:

G

19

Wow! Some of these basic things are not clearly spelled out in the manual - thank you kindly :slight_smile:

G

20

wheresgeorge take heart. When I started playing Civ3, I had no idea either (I had never played any of the other Civ games). It wasn’t long before I was pulling 9 hour straight Civ3 marathons. You have stumbled IMHO into what the biggest drawback/limitation of the game is: the first few thousand years (i.e. the beginning of the game) are far and away the most important, easy to screw up, and dependent on geography and luck. So for a new player, it can be very bewildering and only after playing and playing can you start to make heads or tails of these first few turns. Unless you are playing on the very easiest level, expect to get pummeled a few times.

There are a number of things you need to accomplish right at the outset.

  1. Build a city which grows in population (maximize food production)
  2. Build workers, military troops, and settlers such that you can always expand.
  3. At the same time, make sure your city is building occasional improvements.
  4. Right from the start, exploration is far and away the most useful thing you can do. But you need either an extra military troop or a designated non-combat Explorer/Scout unit. Use hills and mountains to see more squares. Try to get as many freebies as possible – identify tribal villages, save your game, and see what they have in store. It is kind of cheating, but if it ain’t good (gold) or actively bad (they fight), load your game and try again. The best thing you can get is scientific advances (the Apache tribe has taught you Iron Working), next best is probably a settler. Military units and gold are not worth it.

Exploration will also help you identify the lay of the land, where your neighbors are, and importantly where the resources are. If you don’t get Iron Working and an iron source fast, you will certainly lose.

5)If you start in an area that is a) mountainous b) jungle c) small island d) polar, you may as well restart. Your best bet is to be placed in the middle of a large temperate continent. Hopefully with few neighbors to allow lots of room for expansion. Just like in Guns, Germs, and Steel.

In summary – expand, explore, exploit.