Do you mean Joseph Ellis? Viking
I’d say something about how it isn’t our place to decide how sincere an apology was except it would come back to haunt me were I to question somebody else’s sincerity. Which I’m likely to if, for instance, anybody from the current administration were to apologize for anything. 
And we were presumably fighting for her right to do exactly as she did. The Constitution doesn’t just protect those who act in a manner approved by bobbleheads. Freedom of speech is extended to ALL who wish to practice it. That includes airhead actresses, skinheads, political extremists, etc. As long as what they say doesn’t impact your rights, foment insurrection, or advocate the overthrow of the government, you only have the right to answer in kind. It’s not treason to sympathize with the enemy’s cause (as was shown in the McCarthy hearings). Joining their army and fighting against U.S. troops would be another matter, as would be selling secrets to the enemy. Fonda has been singled out because of her high public profile. Sure there are hard feelings because of her actions, but the vitriol heaped on her by some is unwarranted. It’s hypocritical to claim that we’re “fighting for freedom” and in the same breath to condemn someone for exercising that freedom.
I ain’t arguing that at all, I completely agree with you. If you go back and read, you will see that I was responding to the comment “What bugs me about the Fonda-hating vets and coservatives is that millions of people opposed the war in Vietnam just as vigorously as she did.”
Very few opposed the war as vigorously or took it to the extent that she did, certainly not “millions of people”.
And yet you eagerly buy the pronouncements of a man who wears a white caftan and a beanie and shill then like a Girl Scout selling cookies.
So, it’s evil and deserves permanent villification when it’s a clueless pampered star and an old man who knowingly sells lies gets a pass.
:dubious:
:rolleyes:
Opposing the war is one thing. Actually going to the enemy camps and posing for pictures, then calling American vets liars, and supporting the OTHER SIDE is entirely something else.
And I’m with Airman. Jane’s appologies are entirely self-serving and always sound like, “Ooops!!! Tee hee, I was sooo bad!” Ugh.
I had a colonel friend of mine email me a story about her, about how she met with POWs and they passed little notes to her in the palm of her hand. She then turned them over to their captors. Story was totally bogus.
Condemn her for what she did, sure. Just make sure she actually did it.
The story about the notes were bogus, however her cruel comments about the American POWs is fact.
I’ll take that bet. $500? That within one week, Michael Smith’s rank and service record will be made public and will show he served during the Vietnam War.
Just because statistics can be skewed and there are examples of mentally deranged people who lie about their service credentials, isn’t that rock solid a basis for your hunch.
Everyone who’s posted here has condemned the act - as most rational people did in the So is this what we can expect if leftists are allowed into Republican events? thread. It’ll be interesting to see what becomes of the tone of this pit thread vs that one in GD.
I have no opinion whether or not the guy is really an in-country Vietnam vet, but I do know that there are ways to verify military service regardless of how much a person lies or alters their documents. We’ve seen it more than a few times when a person tries to obtain veterans benefits that they are not entitled to. It doesn’t take much to verify service through records secured by the military.
Everyone is personally responsible for their own actions.
You being a vietnam veteran now this with all certainty. Mrs Fonda did indeed “spit” in the faces of a large group of patriotic individuals, for which she attempted to apologize for in the book she was attempting to sign for the disgruntled man.
While I cannot fault the man for thinking to gain retribution, neither can I fault you for thinking it was wrong of him.
She will forever be know as “the girl who sat on SAM’s taking photos” while we had soldiers dieing in the very same country. (This is the particular instant she apologized for)
She gets a “good show” for doing her due diligence to protest the war, as this man gets a “good show” for holding a grudge so long 
I’d heard about the whole Hanoi Jane thing for years, but I was just a toddler when it all went down and didn’t really have much interest in it. I know my uncle is a huge Jane F hater (he’s a Vietnam Vet) but still I never really knew exactly what she did to piss people off so…
…until I saw her on 20/20 or some news show. They showed video footage of her sitting on an enemy anti-aircraft gun and laughing it up with the enemy. Holy shit, no matter what her motivation was at the time (she claimed that everything else had been tried and she had to do something different and shocking), I can’t blame people for being hugely pissed. This is 30+ years later and I was freaking stunned by actually seeing it. I honestly think she was just really young and incredibly stupid, but unfortunately for her that’s the kind of stunt that follows you forever and ever.
The guy in question that spit on her though? What a tool. I doubt he did many vets proud by acting like such an asshole.
Which says more about you than about anyone else. What a remarkable conclusion to draw from zero evidence. And it neatly fits your worldview.
Dear God.
I can’t believe I actually agree 100% with Mr. Moto on something.
emarkp
Wow, and you are judging me by that one posting?
If you had read my other postings, my contention has been that the truly “pissed-off”, mentally disturbed Vietnam Vets are a small minority and some of these so-called “vets” are just screwed-up losers who NEVER even served in the military (let alone Vietnam) and they are just playing into the sterotypical Vietnam Veteran image which has been proven to be false.
To me it seems it is a candy-assed war veteran that spits in the face of a woman in her sixties and THEN runs away ???
If you’re going to do something that drastic, at least have the balls to stick around. If he were genuinely upset with Jane, why did he run? I don’t blame Vietnam Vets for being upset with Ms Fonda and many have expressed their disdain for her. I’d be disappointed to learn that this guy really turns out to be a Vietnam Vet.
Hold on. I may have to reconsider this.
I agree with you, too, Mr. M.
Damn, is there some Red State Kool-Aid in that Liberal Lockstep Liqueur[sup]TM[/sup] I just chugged? :dubious: :eek:
I also concur 100% with both Sol Grundy and Mr. Moto.
Whoever runs the ice skate rental concession in Hell is doing a land office business today.
I’d have thought it was worth it if she got some POW’s out. I do not, though, understand why she is criticized for stating that N.V. POW’s were tortured. That is just as true as a statement as that American POW’s were tortured.