I thought this episode was quite good, an excellent way to start the season.
I’d give a more thorough analysis, but I’m going to bed.
Thoughts? Comments?
Spoilers?
I didn’t QUITE set my VCR. I’ll PayPal a dollar to the first person with analysis. 
Wow. I’m 180 from you, Max. I thought it was utterly banal. Possibly the worst episode I’ve ever seen. Certainly the worst script. I think the future looks bright, what with the infusion of new people and the shakeup of old ones. But on last night alone, I’m just… blech.
I tried to watch the episodes last night, but between fatigue and some compelling baseball games going on, I just couldn’t do it. One thing I noticed last night, and it could well be about the topic than the series, is that it seems everyone is always grim and serious in the West Wing now. Do they ever have any levity at all these days? Even in rough times humor helps defuse situations.
And what’s going on with Donna? Anyone? Was she hit by a mortar shell?
She was in the convoy that drove over a mine in the Gaza strip at the end of last season.
Last season, Donna asked Josh for more responsibilities. A delegation of congressmen and Admiral Fitzwallace went over to the middle east, and Josh asked Donna to go along in his place. Their motorcade was bombed, Donna was severly injured, and the Admiral and a couple of congressmen were killed.
It was interesting to see the conflict between the President and his staff over the use of a military response. Everyone except the Pres wanted an immediate huge bombing to be done, and someone even said to go ahead and start bombing Iran while we’re at it, and we’ll find some connection later. (What does this remind you of?) The Pres wanted to look at the long term picture of peace in the middle east, and want the players to come together at the peace table. And he was also more concerned than anyone else about the civilian casualties that would result. (There are a lot smarter Dopers around here who can give a good analysis of what went on).
After a somewhat disappointing last season, I thought last night was excellent. (There didn’t seem to be much room for humor in this story line, though).
I really enjoyed the episode, if only for the development of Leo in this one.
To add to vertizonal’s recap:
Everyone wants Bartlet to blow something up. The Israelis, Leo, Toby, Will and Congress (a small bi-partisan delegation came to the White House to “urge” Bartlet, but Bartlet walked out on them) want him to blow up the Palestinians. The military wants him to blow up everyone (including Iran for some reason). Bartlett stalls, wanting to find the peace. However, the Israelis won’t sit down with the Palestinians, because they know they’re harboring the terrorist responsible.
He holds a brainstorming session, and some intel woman comes up with a suggestion:
Get a cell phone to the Palestinian PM (who’s holed up in a beseiged hotel). Tell him that if he turns over the terrorist to the US, they get invited to the peace talks. Since the Palestinians would then have made a good-faith effort to cooperate, the Israelis could be pressured to the table.
So they get the Pal. PM on the phone with Bartlet - but he balks. A last second suggestion gets Bartlet to say, “If you secretly turn him over, we’d be willing to say the CIA uncovered him.” He says he consult his government.
That night, Leo and Bartlet have a huge shouting match. Leo wants action - he wants something blown up. Anything less, and you give terrorists a reason to strike again, you show weakness to Congress (who’s already pissed off at you), the military doesn’t respect you, etc. In fact, the USS Lincoln has already been restationed into position to begin bombing. Bartlet shuts him out (literally - he’s out of the room for discussions at that point).
The next morning, Leo comes to say that it’s been 7 hours since they last talked to the Pal. PM, he’s stalling, etc. An aide comes in to say that the CIA just reported that the terrorist is in their possession. Leo’s face, meet egg.
They call the Israeli PM, who is still hesitant. There were peace talks before, and the Palestinians screwed them up. Bartlet says that if the Israelis join the talks, and the Palestinians still back down on the agreement, then the US will throw its full support behind building the separation wall. Israel agrees.
In a nutshell, that’s about it. There’s some state formalities of dignitaries arriving, but the actual talks are left for next week.
QUESTION: There was some sort of military action that Barlet agreed to as he boarded the helicopter, and Leo was overseeing while everyone was at Camp David. What was going on there? I think I switched over to basebal at that point.
Bartlett ordered a strike at a terrorist camp in Syria (but rejected the recommendation to hit something in Iran, on the grounds that there wasn’t enough evidence tying the Iranians to the terrorists involved).
Basically, he said that as soon as the Palestinian have landed in the USA, launch the strike against the training camps in Syria.
Is it my imagination or did John Spencer look rather gaunt and frail? Not his usual chew-'em-up-and-spit-'em-out at all. Has he been ill?
I was also meh. Quite frankly, with two dead Senators, a dead admiral, and a seriously injured staffer, there could have been a bit of bombing. Then talk to them.
It reminds me of certain conspiracy theories with respect to Bush and Iraq.
I don’t really recall much about concern over civilian casualties. I thought his concern was about a negative global diplomatic reaction. Anyway, you’ve hit on pretty much what I didn’t like about it, and why I said the script was bad — too much Deus ex Machina.
Deus I: Our famously bumbling CIA managed to penetrate an Israeli security net to slip the Palestinian Chairman a cell phone, which Israel didn’t block after already cutting off his other phones and supplies.
Deus II: Bartlett managed to turn just the right phrase to convince the Chairman, a lifelong criminal and supporter of terrorism, to capture his own operative and surreptitiously turn him over to our famously bumbling FBI.
**Deus III: ** The Chairman managed to do this despite having no communications (other than the miraculous cell phone) and being surrounded at his small compound by crack Israeli troops.
Deus IV: Leo’s new nemesis, Whatsername, managed to come up with the self-procalimed craziest idea at the end of a brainstorming session (with horrible editing, by the way) whose declared intent was to find ideas that were as crazy as possible. Yes, I understand that that was the whole point, but it is a bit disconcerting that the President is asking for crazy ideas rather than solid analysis. Plus, a sudden lightbulb over the head from the rookie is just too much.
Deus V: Bartlett managed to turn just the right phrase to convince the Israeli Prime Minister to talk to his lifelong enemy without any prior negotiation or diplomatic prep. This time, we found Whatsername (who is apparently the Mother of God with lightbulbs instead of halos) scribbling a quick note that provided the key.
Deus VI: Either the editing was wildly asynchronous, or else all the principals came together in a matter of mere hours to meet at Camp David, with the press having not so much as an inkling of what was going on. I mean, where the hell was Danny? Too bad he’s no longer around, because he would have sniffed this one out in two minutes flat.
Deus VII: The President’s closest advisor, confidante, and lifelong friend — having been muscled out of the picture by a snot-nosed newbie (Whatsername) with crazy ideas — creates exactly the sort of chaos that Bartlett has always hated. He undergoes, without explanation, just the personality shift necessary to accomodate this bizarre new storyline.
But aside from all that, the naivity of believing that peace between the Palestinians and Israelis will come about from a meeting at Camp David is utterly head-smacking. The writers are turning Jed Bartlett into Jimmy Carter.
Uh…whoosh? It’s a typical brainstorming strategy to suggest to those involved that they allow for even the craziest of ideas to be offered. The only thing that was unrealistic about that scene was the amount of discussion and criticism that other ideas received. Bartlet wasn’t looking for a “crazy idea”. He was looking for a “crazy idea” that would spark an “unconventional but good idea” from someone else.
Additionally, the “horrible editing” conveyed the passage of time quite well. Therefore, the “sudden lightbulb” wasn’t so sudden - it may have been Idea #241 of the session.
I think you’re just looking for reasons to not like the show anymore.
Whoops, wasn’t done.
You mean other than the comment Leo made to CJ about Bartlet wanting to keep the press at the White House instead of in Camp David? How CJ will be recounting the daily schedule, but not allow further access? What’s difficult to understand about that?
Was this a 2-hour episode that I missed the second half to, or did you just make up that whole sentence? Seems to me that the episode ended with that entire plot left hanging, to be picked up later. It also seems that Bartlet made it readily apparently that he considered the possibility that at least Palestine could certainly reject the proceedings after the fact.
A guy walked into the Chairman’s compund with the phone. Someone says words to the effect, “The Israelis won’t mess with an ambassabor”.
Hardly. See my posts in this thread. I’m the one saying the show is just as good overall as ever even with Sorkin gone. I was looking forward to this episode.
And yeah, like I said in my post above, I understood what the process was about. It just didn’t work for me.
I don’t know why you’re being so aggressive. I never said anything was difficult to understand. I just don’t like the way it was done. Get it? I can simultaneously understand what happened AND dislike it.
It was, to me, a stupid idea even to try. Meddling in other people’s business is too often fraught with unintended consequences, especially when that business goes back a hundred generations. I just thought it was a bizarre reaction to the murders of two US Congressmen, Fitz, and others, and the maiming of Donna and God only knows who else — especially when he knew exactly who did it. These are my opinions. I don’t think they’re any better or worse than your opinions. I don’t think I deserve to be considered stupid or clueless for holding them. Thank you very much.
Wow, overreact much, Lib? I didn’t intend any sort of aggressiveness, nor did I imply ANY sort of cluelessness on your part. If it appeared that way, I apologize.
The point is, you cannot accurately call any of those points I responed to a deus ex machina, as they were all adequately explained.
I thought he looked kind of sick as well - like he’d lost a lot of weight.
I’ve got to chime in here to agree with Liberal.
The reaction seems out of character for Jed Bartlett, given his reaction to a similar situation involving Captain Morris Tolliver in “A Proportional Response.” You can make the argument that he was a younger, less experienced President at the time but what happened to the President who wanted to “blow them off the face of the earth with the fury of God’s own thunder?”
Not to me they weren’t. I don’t have to accept the same standards of adequacy that you do, and in this instance I do not. I do, however, accept your apology.
Oh, and I agree that Spencer looks gaunt and sickly.
Leo set him straight.