What about this guy John Edward ( passing over)

Firstly I hereby claim I am not using a computer to communicate with this message board. I have the psychic power to influence machines, such as the Straight Dope server.
Luckily for you, anyone can be taught how to do this.
But beware, such knowledge is powerful and must not fall into the wrong hands.
Send me $500, and I will teach you how to do this. (You must promise only to do good with your new power.)
Of course I COULD be using a computer and simple trickery to make you think I wasn’t. But you should send me the money anyway.

Secondly Randi can do anything these psychics do.
He can teach people how to do it, for goodness sake.

Thirdly he offers psychics (and for any other paranormal power) $1,000,000 to do a demonstration.
None have accepted.

Hmmm.

If you had a genuine power, wouldn’t you like $1,000,000?
Wouldn’t you be proud to show scientists like me that you’re not a cynical crook who preys on victims (victims who have lost loved ones)?

Apparently not.

If, on the other hand, you were a complete fraud, you’d steer well clear of any testing.

Yes, that’s exactly how cold reading works. The victim tells you things, you repeat them and they give you money.

If, in real life, I get a telephone call for you, I will tell you who called and what they said. I won’t say “Do you know someone whose name begins with a J?”

Remember, if you only answer a psychic with yes and no, their act always fails.

John Edwards, like James Van Praagh and Uri Geller and others like them, are frauds and two-bit scam artists. The fact that so many people fall for it never ceases to amaze me.

The great skeptic Michael Shermer explains it best:

***Deconstructing The Dead: Cross Over One Last Time To Expose Medium John Edward

By Michael Shermer**

History is not just one damn thing after another, it is also the same damn thing over and over–time’s arrow and time’s cycle. Fads come and go, in clothing, cars, and psychics. In the 1970s it was Uri Geller, in the 1980s it was Shirley MacLaine, in the 1990s it was James Van Praagh, and to kick off the new millennium it is John Edward. Edward’s star is rising rapidly with a hit daily television series “Crossing Over” on the Sci Fi network and a New York Times bestselling book “One Last Time.” He has appeared, unopposed, on Larry King Live and has been featured on Dateline, Entertainment Tonight, and an HBO special. He is so hot that his television show is about to make the jump to network television, as he is soon to go opposite Oprah in CBS’s afternoon lineup.

Last month Skeptic magazine was the first national publication to run an expose of John Edward in James “The Amazing” Randi’s column (in Vol. 8, #3, now on newsstands and bookstores or at www.skeptic.com), a story that was picked up this week by Time magazine, who featured a full-page article on what is rapidly becoming the Edward phenomenon. There is, in reality, nothing new here. Same story, different names. In watching Edward I’m amazed at how blatant he is in stealing lines from medium James Van Praagh. It reminds me of entertainers, commedians, and magicians who go to each others’ shows to glean new ideas.

Time’s reporter Leon Jaroff, quoting from the Skeptic article, wrote a skeptical piece in which he reported the experiences of an audience member from an Edward taping. His name is Michael O’Neill, a New York City marketing manager, who reported his experiences as follows (quoting from the Skeptic article):

“I was on the John Edward show. He even had a multiple guess “hit” on me that was featured on the show. However, it was edited so that my answer to another question was edited in after one of his questions. In other words, his question and my answer were deliberately mismatched. Only a fraction of what went on in the studio was actually seen in the final 30 minute show. He was wrong about a lot and was very aggressive when somebody failed to acknowledge something he said. Also, his “production assistants” were always around while we waited to get into the studio. They told us to keep very quiet, and they overheard a lot. I think that the whole place is bugged somehow. Also, once in the studio we had to wait around for almost two hours before the show began. Throughout that time everybody was talking about what dead relative of theirs might pop up. Remember that all this occurred under microphones and with cameras already set up. My guess is that he was backstage listening and looking at us all and noting certain readings. When he finally appeared, he looked at the audience as if he were trying to spot people he recognized. He also had ringers in the audience. I can tell because about fifteen people arrived in a chartered van, and once inside they did not sit together.”

Last week an ABC television producer flew out from New York to film me for an investigation of Edward they are conducting. The segment began as a “puff piece” (as she called it), but a chance encounter in the ABC cafeteria with 20/20 correspondent Bill Ritter, with whom I worked on an expose of medium James Van Praagh a few years ago, tipped her off that Edward was, in fact, a Van Praagh clone and that his talking to the dead was nothing more than the old magicians’ cold reading trick. After waching the 20/20 piece the producer immediately realized what was really going on inside Edward’s studio. She began to ask a few probing questions and was promptly cut off by Edward and his producers. ABC was told they would not be allowed to film inside the studio and that they, the Sci Fi network, would provide edited clips that ABC could use. The ABC producer became suspicious, and then skeptical. She has been trying to get an interview with Edward to confront him with my critiques, but they continue to put her off. In fact, she just phoned to tell me that Edward’s publicist just left a message on her voice mail (with a date and time) stating that Edward was not available for an interview because he is out of state, yet the producer just caught him on television live in studio on CBS New York! Something fishy is going on here and I know what it is.

The video clips I was shown make it obvious why Edward does not want raw footage going out to the public–he’s not all that good at doing cold readings. Where I estimated Van Praagh’s hit rate at between 20-30 percent, Edward’s hit rate at between 10-20 percent (the error-range in the estimates is created by the fuzziness of what constitutes a “hit”–more on this in a moment). The advantage Edward has over Van Praagh is his verbal alacrity. Van Praagh is Ferrari fast, but Edward is driving an Indy-500 racer. In the opening minute of the first reading captured on film by the ABC camera, I counted over one statement per second (ABC was allowed to film in the control room under the guise of filming the hardworking staff, and instead filmed Edward on the monitor in the raw). Think about that–in one minute Edward riffles through 60 names, dates, colors, diseases, conditions, situations, relatives, and the like. It goes so fast that you have to stop tape, rewind, and go back to catch them all. When he does come up for air the studio audience members to whom he is speaking look like deer in the headlights. In the edited tape provided by Edward we caught a number of editing mistakes, where he appears to be starting a reading on someone but makes reference to something they said “earlier.” Oops!

Edward begins by selecting a section of the studio audience of about 20 people, saying things like “I’m getting a George over here. I don’t know what this means. George could be someone who passed over, he could be someone here, he could be someone that you know,” etc. Of course such generalizations lead to a “hit” where someone indeed knows a George, or is related to a George, or is a George. Now that he’s targeted his mark, the real reading begins in which Edward employs cold reading, warm reading, and hot reading techniques.

  1. Cold Reading. The first thing to know is that John Edward, like all other psychic mediums, does not do the reading–his subjects do. He asks them questions and they give him answers. “I’m getting a P name. Who is this please?” “He’s showing me something red. What is this please?” And so on. This is what is known in the mentalism trade as cold reading, where you literally “read” someone “cold,” knowing nothing about them. You ask lots of questions and make numerous statements, some general and some specific, and sees what sticks. Most of the time Edward is wrong. If the subjects have time they visibly nod their heads “no.” But Edward is so fast that they usually only have the time or impetus to acknowledge the hits. And Edward only needs an occasional strike to convince his clientele he is genuine.

  2. Warm Reading. This is utilizing known principles of psychology that apply to nearly everyone. For example, most grieving people will wear a piece of jewelry that has a connection to their loved one. Katie Couric on The Today Show, for example, after her husband died, wore his ring on a necklace when she returned to the show. Edward knows this about mourning people and will say something like “do you have a ring or a piece of jewelry on you, please?” His subject cannot believe her ears and nods enthusiastically in the affirmative. He says “thank you,” and moves on as if he had just divined this from heaven. Most people also keep a photograph of their loved one either on them or near their bed, and Edward will take credit for this specific hit that actually applies to most people.

Edward is facile at determining the cause of death by focusing either on the chest or head areas, and then exploring whether it was a slow or sudden end. He works his way down through these possibilities as if he were following a computer flow chart and then fills in the blanks. “I’m feeling a pain in the chest.” If he gets a positive nod, he continues. “Did he have cancer, please? Because I’m seeing a slow death here.” If he gets the nod, he takes the hit. If the subject hesitates at all, he will quickly shift to heart attack. If it is the head, he goes for stroke or head injury from an automobile accident or fall. Statistically speaking there are only half a dozen ways most of us die, so with just a little probing, and the verbal and nonverbal cues of his subject, he can appear to get far more hits than he is really getting.

  1. Hot Reading. Sometimes psychic mediums cheat by obtaining information on a subject ahead of time. I do not know if Edward does research or uses shills in the audience to get information on people, or even plants in the audience on which to do readings, but in my investigation of James Van Praagh I discovered from numerous television producers that he consciously and deliberately pumps them for information about his subjects ahead of time, then uses that information to deceive the viewing public that he got it from heaven.

The ABC producer also asked me to do a reading on her. “You know absolutely nothing about me so let’s see how well this works.” After reviewing the Edward tapes I did a ten minute reading on her. She sat there dropped jawed and wide eyed, counting my hits. She proclaimed that I was unbelievably accurate. How did I do it? Let’s just say I utilized all three of the above techniques. After the show airs on ABC New York this week (Wednesday, Thursday, or Friday I’m told) I’ll reveal the details in another posting.

Most of the time, however, mediums do not need to cheat. The reason has to do with the psychology of belief. This stuff works because the people who go to mediums want it to work (remember, they do the readings, not the mediums). The simplest explanation for how mediums can get away with such an outrageous claim as the ability to talk to the dead is that they are dealing with a subject the likes of which it would be hard to top for tragedy and finality–death. Sooner or later we all will face this inevitability, starting, in the normal course of events, with the loss of our parents, then siblings and friends, and eventually ourselves. It is a grim outcome under the best of circumstances, made all the worse when death comes early or accidentally to those whose “time was not up.” As those who traffic in the business of loss, death, and grief know all too well, we are often at our most vulnerable at such times. Giving deep thought to this reality can cause the most controlled and rational among us to succumb to our emotions.

The reason John Edward, James Van Praagh, and the other so-called mediums are unethical and dangerous is that they are not helping anyone in what they are doing. They are simply preying on the emotions of grieving people. As all loss, death, and grief counselors know, the best way to deal with death is to face it head on. Death is a part of life, and pretending that the dead are gathering in a television studio in New York to talk twaddle with a former ballroom-dance instructor is an insult to the intelligence and humanity of the living.*

HEY where do I send the money??? I totally believe you and I totally want to do this!!! Can you send it to me telepathically???
:smiley:

Fingolfin-Shermer is a great author in my opinion. I love his book, why people believe wierd things. In it he goes into this phenomenon to expose the fraud.

Hustling the Dead

some highlights:

To me that shows he’s a fraud. It’s not a simple mistake. He passed off something that he had as knowledge as something he channeled. I’d think that if this stuff worked that the mediums would know the difference between something they know and something they are being “told”.

Splendid - another sucker … errr … subject.

Now you understand I don’t want this money for myself. It’s to cover expenses and to pay for my pet Blue Whale which has a skin disease. (And that’s a lot of skin!).

Just send $500 (or more if you can spare it) to:

Toetell Frawed,
Crooked House,
Good Intentions Road,
Exploitation.

You will indeed receive instructions telepathically.

If you don’t hear anything, your cash probably went astray.
Please send it again.

Note that if you are not a complete believer in everything I say, then the method will not work, because you are giving out negative psychic energy. *

*I’ve actually had a dowser tell me this was why dowsing always failed when tested.

You can make out the cheque to the Centre for Acomplishing Spiritual Harmony (the acronym is sufficient).

Your llama is jealous. She wants a hat…

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. If John Edward or any other “psychic” agreed to be tested in a scientific way, with the experiment set up so that any possibility of cheating is eliminated, they would not pass the test.

In one of James Randi’s books, he describes an experience with a pair of female Russian psychics who failed to read him because he consistently refused to volunteer any information to them, thus thwarting their cold-reading techniques.

So far, some psychics have contacted Randi about his million dollar prize, but when they realize how rigorous the testing will be, they back out. This doesn’t sound like self-confidence to me.

Ok, I’ve sent out 10,000 dollars to both of your fine organizations. I figured that the first couple will be lost in the mail and that the rest of my family will also want such skills…

Wait…I’m recieving something telepathically…

It’s a narrow bown hole…

My head is going up it…

OH GOD NO!!!

“They told us to keep very quiet, and they overheard a lot.” A lot of what? Weren’t they being quiet?

  • I think that the whole place is bugged somehow.”* Oh. Well, I think Santa Claus can get into my house through the chimney - SOMEHOW.

“Also, once in the studio we had to wait around for almost two hours before the show began. Throughout that time everybody was talking about what dead relative of theirs might pop up. Remember that all this occurred under microphones and with cameras already set up.” Hmm. Weren’t they all supposed to be quiet?

My guess is that he was backstage listening and looking at us all and noting certain readings. When he finally appeared, he looked at the audience as if he were trying to spot people he recognized.” Maybe his spirits told him who to look for. And your “guess” is as good as mine.

*"He also had ringers in the audience. I can tell because about fifteen people arrived in a chartered van, and once inside they did not sit together." * Well, that’s conclusive. They OBVIOUSLY all knew one another - after all, they took the same bus - and OBVIOUSLY, you’d want to sit with all the people you traveled with. No one would take a chartered van to a psychic show taping unless they were all in on the scam. Come ON. When you take a chartered van from the airport to your hotel, do you then share your room with everyone who was on the van with you?

The above is POSSIBLE - but not PROOF. For the record, I think Edwards is entertaining to watch, and I think he’s very good at what he does. At no time have I said “I believe he is legit.” Just because I think Randi is a goofball does not mean I think he’s WRONG.

Some of my coworkers are really big on Edwards. I was expounding on why he’s such a moral leper one day and their response was “…but I read his book. He’s a really nice man.” :rolleyes:

If you ask a studio full of people to be quiet while they’re waiting, what will happen is that they won’t all sit perfectly silent; they’ll have conversations in hushed tones. Perfect for electronic eavesdropping. In any case, giving Edward’s mastery of cold reading techniques, any information he can pick up ahead of time is gravy.

Even if I thought somehow that Edward was genuine, I’d have to ask: Why would receiving actual messages from the spirits of dead people look exactly like cold reading?

Peter Popoff, a televangelist, used to have his wife feed him information through a radio in his ear while he did his mentalist tricks. He was exposed by Randi. (Steve Martin’s character in the movie Leap of Faith was partially based on Popoff.)

I’m getting a name. Does anyone have a connection with the name “David?”

You do, ma’am? Ok then. Is David your son or your uncle? Neither? Are you sure? Do you have a neighbor named David? No? Does your neighbor have a son or uncle named David? No?

No wait … I’m not hearing the name David. It’s Henry instead. Is there a Henry in your life? No? Have you ever known a Henry? No? Have you ever heard the name Henry before today?

Yes? Ok Henry says that you should pay me 50 bucks so he can speak through me and tell you an important message.

Now I’m hearing “Visa or MasterCard only,” from Henry. “No personal checks,” he says. Now he’s saying cash is acceptable also.

Ok, joking aside …

I think he’s a con artist.

However … I do think some people can communicate with spirits in the spirit realm. If he is, I do not believe he is speaking with the dead. I believe the dead are either in heaven or hell and that’s pretty much it.

I don’t know what he is talking to if he IS talking to something, my personal opinion is it is probably demonic. Thus I want nothing to do with him; I turn him off whenever he comes on.

LifeOnWry,

Given that the audience consists of people who have lost loved ones and are desperate to hear from them, do you still think Edward’s fraud is entertaining?
Remember he charges money for this - and does expensive personal consultations as well. Are those ‘entertaining’?

Your problem with Randi seems to be that he is serious about exposing obvious frauds. This takes far more dedication than cold reading.

Agreed.

And your evidence for this is?

And your evidence for demons is?

Believe me, if the dead could communicate with us, my grandmother would have been yakking my ear off ever since she died in 1988.

Every time I see John Edward’s book in the library, I surreptitiously move it from “nonfiction” to “fiction.”

LifeOnWry,

Given that the audience consists of people who have lost loved ones and are desperate to hear from them, do you still think Edward’s fraud is entertaining?
Remember he charges money for this - and does expensive personal consultations as well. Are those ‘entertaining’?

Your problem with Randi seems to be that he is serious about exposing obvious frauds. This takes far more dedication than cold reading.

Agreed.

And your evidence for this is?

And your evidence for demons is?

Ok LifeOnRye, chew on this for a while:

*From a Crossing Over episode that aired on July 5, 2002:

John Edward appears in his Gallery and explains to the studio audience that he has been a psychic medium for 15 years, and that anything can happen during his readings. After that simple introduction, he asks the audience, “Are you ready? Ok. I’m over here,” as he walks to a particular section of the Gallery and begins to bait the audience by slowly rolling out the following:

John Edward: They’re either trying to tell me someone has a name like Celine [no immediate bites from the audience] … or they want me to acknowledge a name like Celina [still no bites] … but they’re telling me to say Celine [as he motions the letter “C” with his index finger].
Female Guest: I have an Aunt Zia Lina.
Finally! Someone bites. An Aunt Zia Lina’s name is volunteered by a female guest who appears to be in her 40’s, attractive with auburn hair, wide open brown eyes, and dressed conservatively. Well … Celina and Zia Lina sound close enough don’t they? But what about John’s rather adamant spelling of the letter “C” with his fingers? Maybe this was an illiterate spirit.

John Edward: Ok. Has she passed?
Female Guest: Yeah.
John Edward: Ok. We’re going to start there.
At this point, ask yourself “What does John know so far?” He knows that this particular guest is willing to go that extra mile to help him connect his guesses with her answers. He gathered as much from the stretch from Celina and Zia Lina. John also knows this guest has an aunt who has passed away. Based upon the age of the guest (40’ish) and that the average life span of people in the U.S. is their mid-70’s, John can assume that both her parents have also passed. Also, based upon the aunt’s name John can determine that the family is of either a Latin or Greek descent.

    Time to get the ball rolling. This next part is done at such speed, that the guest doesn't have time to respond, and that's the way it's suppose to be. Who would dare be rude enough to interrupt John while on TV. He knows this, you don't. Now, with lightning fast speed, John delivers the following: 

John Edward: They’re telling me to acknowledge November or the 11th of the month having some type of meaning because there’s some kind of connection. They’re making me feel like there’s some type of mom vibration that’s has passed because there’s an older female coming through and I feel like [pause] … is it your mom that’s passed?
Female Guest: Yeah.
Ahhh! As expected, John is dipping into some of that information derived from what he gathered above. Based upon her age, odds are that the guest’s mother has also passed but even if this guess is wrong, John can fall back on Aunt Zia Lina as the older female coming through. John continues with the following:

John Edward: Ok. She’s making me feel like …
She, as in the “mother,” is making him feel? If John is already in touch with the mother, why did he previously have to ask if she had passed? As you noticed above, John did the same thing with the aunt, asking if she had already passed.

John Edward: She’s telling me to say “R” … there’s an “R” connection so I don’t know who the “R” is. [The paternal side isn’t getting any positive response from the guest, so John switches to the maternal side] I think it’s like on dad’s side of the family …
Female Guest: [The female guest is seen thinking hard, then appearing dumbfounded she finally shrugs her shoulders to signal John that she hasn’t a clue what he’s talking about].
John Edward: … and I actually think it’s a name like Reginald … Regina … there’s like an “RG” sound or a last name “RG.” I don’t know what this means but they’re telling me “R” and it sounds like with a “G” connected to it.
This is the second time is as many minutes that John has said, “I don’t know what this means.” John likes to use this statement when the guest isn’t reponding well (or is that when his guesses are so far off?). He most often uses it in heated exchanges where the guest isn’t given the opportunity to respond. If he’s wrong, no one ever says anything. If he’s right, when he finishes the exchange, the guest will most often pick out a single statement and comment on it. This gives John the opportunity to spit out dozens of guesses and the guest will only comment on the one which is right, making him look like he’s actually communicating with a spirit. John continues guessing names:

John Edward: … like Reg … Raj [pause] … sounds like Reg …
Female Guest: [The guest just shrugs her shoulders to show a negative response].
John Edward: … Reggie … Roger … there’s an “R” sound … Regina … but there’s something about … like the name Regina they want me to acknowledge.
Thank the spirits it’s only a half-hour show! We’d all hate to see John guess every name beginning with the letter “R” just to finally get it right. Frustrated, the guest herself voluteers a name, any name.

Female Guest: Virginia?
John Edward: Who is this?
Hey John? You’re the psychic. You tell us!

Female Guest: My father’s aunt who passed on.
In this particular instance, John just decides he’s had enough and quickly moves on to another subject with no further explanation for the people behind the “C” and “R” names. Wrong guesses? You bet!

    What separates John from other cold readers, is that John works with a sizable audience (the Gallery) and when his readings go like the above, as happens far too often, he will just say that he's picking up the "energies" of two different or distinct families which is suppose to explain away wrong guesses. Enough wrong guesses or if the guest isn't cooperating, he will just claim the "energy" is pulling back and then move on to someone else he hopes this time will be more volunteering of information. 

    It's rather ironic that a person who alleges to be in touch with people who have crossed over can't even identify them nor discover if they had in fact already passed over. This isn't by mistake that John does this. If he doesn't have enough information and guesses wrong, he is exposed. Rather, he just simply asks, "Has this person passed over?" Which is phrased as both a statement AND a question, and which is almost immediately followed by an affirmative nod of his head and a statement by the likes of, "Because he or she is telling me ..." His inquiry to determine if the person has in fact passed over is posed almost like he is asking the question of himself and outloud. But don't be fooled, John is reading every expression on your face and as soon as he sees your response, he is quick to interject something further and hopefully before you answer verbally. In this way he is perceived as communicating with the spirits rather than with you. Remember, speed is everything to a cold reader. 

   In the end, you are ultimately left to decide for yourself, cold reading — fact or fiction.  However, keep in mind two very important things: (1) John Edward's Crossing Over show originated on the "Sci-Fi" channel along side of the likes of "The Twilight Zone", "The Outer Limits" and other science "fiction" shows; and (2) what P.T. Barnum, the circus magnate and carnival game master, is quoted as saying, "A sucker is born every minute."  Don't let it be you!!*

It’s just good to know the dead can add such value to our lives as “Timmy used to have a red baseball cap”

or

“Someone with a B name crossed over from a thing in here <moving hand across entire sternum>.”

Wow…Such powers that come from crossing over…“I see an older man who crossed over…and cars - something with cars…for someone in this area”

I draw the following conclusion: the dead are worthless and/or Edwards is worthless.

I’m glad I’m a card carrying member of the Randi.org club and a fan of Michael Shermers.

Hey, I believe in talking to the dead-I just don’t think they can respond back.

I mean isn’t it a bit absurd that the dead can communicate with John Edwards, but not have the ability to give him concrete knowledge?

"Given that the audience consists of people who have lost loved ones and are desperate to hear from them, do you still think Edward’s fraud is entertaining? "

I sure do. I know what he is doing and how he does it which makes it that much better. He does it well and has enough editors and such to make it come across well.

He has no moral obligation to tell anyone how he does it either. The people who want to “hear” from their dead relatives are typically relieved to hear that the relatives are “at peace.” They believe it and it gives them some piece of mind. Who is anyone to argue about what makes others feel better?

For what it is worth, I find John Edwards’s show to be the psychic equivalent of Jerry Springer. Quite a guilty pleasure, you are sure a lot of things are staged, nonetheless, it is still entertaining.