I’ve thought about this, and I’m not really sure what else to call them. Prog metal it is!
Progressive metal, of course, is first and foremost metal, but it’s been heavily influenced by progressive rock.
“Metal” is short for “Heavy Metal”.
The term “Heavy metal” was coined by a music reporter (for Rolling Stone magazine, I believe), who tried to describe the music of Jimi Hendrix (of setting-his-guitar-on-fire fame). He described Hendrix’s music as sounding “like heavy metal falling from the sky.” Lord only knows what that reporter was smoking when he wrote that.
I’ve heard several ‘origins’ for this term. The most popular, though not necessarily the correct one, seems to be a line in a Steppenwolf song: ‘I like smokin’ lighting/Heavy Metal thunder’
I just recently read about another so called origin of this terms here on the boards but it is escaping me at the moment.
I disagree with some of the summations here, which is certainly not surprising. I’m sure there are as many definitions of these styles as there are bands.
Acid - to me this means Acid House, which is like House (dance music, four on the floor beats and usually an acoustic element) but faster and more synth based.
Alternative - Began in the early 80s with bands like R.E.M., The Pixies and Hüsker Dü in America and The Smiths, Echo and the Bunnymen and The Cure in England. The title obviously comes from the sound being an alternative to the mainstream - listen to the direct sounds of these bands and compare it to the twitty flourishes on Sultans of Swing or the “rock out with your cock out” machismo of Welcome to the Jungle (apologies to Knopfler and Axl fans respectively) to understand this. When Alternative bands began gaining mainstream success in the late 80s, and particularly with Nirvana in the early nineties, the definition and the etymology parted ways, since Alternative was paradoxically no longer the alternative. The genre now consists of contemporary mainstream rock music with a slightly grittier edge, although other non-pop rock based music is often included under the umbrella term, such as nu-metal, punk, hard rock and metal.
Examples of modern alternative include Incubus, Limp Bizkit, Red Hot Chili Peppers and the Foo Fighters. As a contrast, the slightly more polished Matchbox 20 are usually considered pop-rock, although the line between the two is blurred to such an extent that trying to differentiate is often a pointless endeavour.
What was once known as alternative roughly corresponds to today’s Indie music, however there are some differences.
AlternRock Alternative rock music, as distinguished from other sub-divisions such as punk, metal etc. Foo Fighters and Incubus are both altern-rock.
Christian Rap - note: not all rappers rap about cash and hos. As the name says, rap with Christian themes. KRS-One’s more recent stuff, maybe?
Hard Rock - Kilt-wearin man got this one fairly well. In my mind, the term has become fairly redundant of late, since most bands that could be classified as this tend to be alternative or metal, however Queens of the Stone Age are a notable contemporary act that could be described as such.
New Wave - began in the eighties, following on from punk. It used punk’s simple song structures but gave them a pop edge. The songs were less intense, used a wider range of instrumentation and were often keyboard heavy. Examples of such include The Police, Adam Ant, Depeche Mode, The Cars and Talking Heads. (Kilt Wearin Man - although I’m not an expert on Bowie, isn’t he considered to be Glam? Or did he have a new wave period as well?)
Pop - simple meaning is whatever is popular at the time. However this confuses etymology with definition and isn’t entirely accurate. The Beatles are pop and they were popular. Britney Spears is pop and she is popular. However, The Promise Ring are pop, and they’re not very popular at all. And to confuse matters even more, System of a Down are popular but they aren’t pop.
Pop can be better thought of as rock based music that has a strong sense of melody. It’s hummable. It can vary from Weezer’s guitar-punk, to Pavement’s alternative-pop to Aimee Mann’s folk pop to Britney’s R+B/dance pop to Hanson’s bubblegum pop. The label is often used in a derisory fashion, but some of the most respected music is pop music. The Beach Boys, for instance, were pure pop and the critically acclaimed Built to Spill are pop.
Progressive - annoying music from the 70s which was based on overbearing posturing, bad keyboards and masturbation. (You may be able to see some bias from me here)
Punk - Aggressive, fast music, often seeking social change, yet just as often reactionary - rebellion for the sake of rebellion, or simply to annoy. Snotty attitude, guitar driven and simple. There is much argument about what is considered punk and what isn’t, so I’ll avoid all that and just give you examples of what is commonly referred to as punk. Trying to distinguish what is and isn’t punk is fraught with danger - Elvis Costello used complex songwriting techniques and didn’t sound anything like his contemporaries but is still labelled punk. The Clash threw in any form of music they could and are still considered to be punk.
Punk can be broken down into different periods and scenes, including the original old school punk of the late 70s, (the Ramones, Clash, Buzzcocks, Sex Pistols), the 80s DC Hard Core scene, the LA 80s scene, the late 80s-90s skate-punk scene, and the much derided So-Cal sound (Green Day, Blink 182, Unwritten Law) which was less about political upheaval and focussed more on personal issues. Punk is limited by some people to only one or two of these scenes, but it can include all of these. Never get into an argument with someone about what constitutes punk music; it makes the Israelis and the Palestinaians look friendly.
Techno - Fast, completely electronic dance music. Usually uses 4/4 beats and is pretty upfront, danceable music. It is often used to generically describe all dance music/electronic music, however this is not very accurate. Hint: Moby isn’t techno. Neither is Fatboy Slim or the Crystal Method.
I thought he was considered psycho-billy. 
The John Coltrane “Love Supreme” might be an example of Christian Jazz, but I hardly think you could label him that in general. I think some of the other jazz greats have written Masses and other works for church (and, of course, been influenced by gospel) but are not defined by it.
I would suggest some of the vocal jazz groups would be more likely labelled Christian Jazz, such as Take Six – sort of a Manhattan Transfer with a Christian message.
David Bowie was considered Glitter rock, T-Rex (with Marc Bolan) was glam.
Just to clear up a few things:
avante garde (I believe a French term) literally means “advanced guard”. I believe it was originally a military term for the front line of an attack or military operation. Not quite sure about the particulars of the origin of the term beyond that, but with regards to art it basically refers to anything experimental, different, against the the grain, unusual, etc. just as the frontline in a military situation was the first to do their thing and pave the way for those who followed. There is avante garde classical music, just as there is with rock, electronic/computer music, or just about any other musical or artistic genre. (e.g. avante garde poetry, visual art, dance, etc.) Probably the only exception is pop since that would be a direct contradiction.
John Coltrane’s later stuff (like “A Love Supreme” e.g.) is indeed part of the avante garde jazz world of its time but is more concisely likely to be categorized as free-jazz (made popular by Ornette Coleman) in that it is improvised to a much greater extrent than the Jazz of the preceding era. In Free-jazz often there are no prescribed chords or any progression, nor is there any prescribed melody, scales to use, and sometimes not even is the rhythm fully established. Understand though that, as with nearly all the genres discussed in this thread, descriptions are only rough approximations.
Christianity and spirituality in general played a big part in Coltrane’s music and life and I guess it could thus be considered Christian Jazz (though I’ve honestly never heard of that as a genre label. I generally think that any more familar genre with the label “Christian” preceding it just refers to the same musical style as said genre but with a religious bent. Christian Rock is simply rock music but with pro-Christian lyrics).
Rockabilly was sort of a blending of country and rock 'N roll (which came out of R & B). I tend to think of Elvis and Chuck Berry, but I’ll admit I’m a little unclear myself as to the exact boundaries that define the genre.
BeBop is the style of jazz that emerged post WWII, most notably with Charlie Parker. Compared to the Huge big bands of the previous era (e.g. Duke Ellington and Benny Goodman), which were like mini-orchestras (i.e. not just single players on an instrument but woodwind and brass sections with 3 or 4 players on each instrument), in the bebop era groups were small (drummer, bass, one or 2 rhythm/melody guys like a piano or a sax). The music became much more virtuosic allowing players long solos to show what they could do. Virtuosity replaced complex arrangements and catchy tunes.
Reggae - just find some Bob Marley and you’ll soon know it. It’s a pretty easy style to identify once you hear it.
ska - like a very fast reggae with a sort of rock energy. see The Mighty Bosstones.
Industrial/Gothic - As I understand it “Gothic” refers to the social scene itself (black nailpolish, lipstick… well, come to think of it black everything), while “Industrial” is the music most often associated with the scene. I haven’t read the debate cited by one poster here, but I generally think of the genre as somewhere between the heavy grunge rock of the 90’s (e.g.Nirvana, Pearl Jam) and techno. It’s a very agressive sound with lots of machine-like sounds, usually very fast with complex beats. I think Nine Inch Nails and Ministry are the most representative examples (But I sure wouldn’t say that to these debaters).
Acid rock was a 60’s term which referred to rock music inspired by psychedelic drugs (e.g. Jimi Hendrix, The Who).
Acid Jazz, AFAIK, is a more recent term (early 90’s?) for a fusion of jazz-like improvisation with the techno/trance music of the rave culture, though I think it’s more complicated than that. A lot of it involves a guy spinning records while other live instrumentalists jam with it. But I don’t think it necessarily involves someone spinning records.
Remember, ALL genre labels are huge generalizations (Umm… mostly). They may emerge and catch on for any number of reasons (e.g. a lyric in a song, a witty DJ on a radio station, an article in a hip magazine, etc.), and they often take on a life of their own.
Rock e.g. is a huge, huge label which can be broken down into an endless number of subgenres. Elvis, The Beatles, The Sex Pistols, Ozzy Osbourne, and Nirvana can all be considered Rock!!!
I’m confused about the more minor distinctions. I remember hearing a conversation between two punk fans about bands i’d never hear of… they were throwing around phrases like “emo-core,” “grind-thrash-core” and other seemingly random, seemingly minor distincitons. Anyone have more info?
Lon, I think that punk fans sometimes just like to make up genres where only the bands they like fit into the category - all you have to do is come up with a word, and put ‘-core’ after it. eg, Krishna-core, Skate-core, Apple-core (Beatles influenced punk … OK, so I made that one up).
Far be it for me to even suggest what emo-core is (I know bands who use that term, and I don’t like any of them, so I’m the wrong person to ask). Grind-core isn’t really a punk style so much as a brand of heavy metal, which in the early days (ie mid-late 1980’s) became known as ‘crossover’. Heavy metal fans listening to punk records, and punk fans listening to heavy metal records. To outsiders, both these styles sound like a bunch of noise, but to afficionados, there is a huge difference.
Thrash is a generic term used to describe either punk or heavy metal that is very fast or, errrr … thrashy. Again, it’s the sort of thing only fans can really distinguish between, but to a trained ear, the style used by early Metallica in 1983, and by Iron Maiden at the same time, are clearly completely different.
Some of these terms (used before -core) refer to the lyrics (eg Krishna core); some refer to the music (eg grind core), and some refer to the philosophy or lifestyle of the band (eg crust core or straightedge).
(BTW, if you didn’t figure it out, the ‘-core’ suffix is from ‘hardcore’, a term used in lots of genres, including rap, but when it’s used on its own, it mostly seems to refer to punk played faster, louder and meaner)
On the question of ‘Avant-garde pop’, it could be argued that any pop music that stretches the boundaries of what has come before could take that term - eg The Beatles, Lee Hazlewood, Bjork.
All of this is why I just like to use the simple term ‘music’, occasionally with the prefixes ‘fast’ or ‘loud’ or ‘soft’ or ‘slow’.
The more familiar you are with a genre of music, the finer the distinctions you are able to draw within the genre. The more important the genre is to you, the more major those minor distinctions become. Also vital to an understanding of subgenres is that they often reflect extra-musical differences. It’s not something you can derive from comparing how two bands sound… it’s something social, and you just have to know. Remember, what kind of music you like is a badge of identity for a lot of people, especially kids.
There isn’t really a consensus about most of it either, since it’s fun to argue about what bands are and are not… that’s part of the fun of being a record geek. The value of genres is how they provide a structure for interesting discourse about music. As an objective and accurate means of categorizating music, they have limited value.
That said, I would never call Bowie or Kate Bush new wave (although Bowie is something of a godfather to most new wave bands), Enya is not New Age (99% of all record stores to the contrary), Alternative doesn’t really exist anymore, and “punk” and “pop” tells me almost nothing at all about what a band sounds like if I don’t know who is calling it that.
-fh
While Goth is generally more of a lifestyle than anything, there actually is a very real genre of music called Goth music. There are really two kinds of Goth music out there: Goth Rock and Ethereal Goth. To tell you the truth, I don’t know what the hell they have in common. Goth Rock is typified by dark rock music (often with added synth) and deep vocals (sometimes). The very first Goth rock song is generally considered to be Bela Lugosi’s Dead by Bauhaus. I’d say that the most famous Goth Rock band is Sisters of Mercy, but many other bands are out there, such as Lestat, Switchblade Symphony, Sunshine Blind, and so on.
Ethereal goth is more classical in its musical base. Most of these bands are usually signed to Projekt records for some reason and the big names include Black Tape For a Blue Girl, Lycia, and Love is Colder Than Death.
The industrial music described above by Moe is one of the many definitions by various people as to what that genre can encompass. This is the definition that most people would associate with the genre and many really good bands fit that mold.
And there’s goth metal, too, just to confuse y’all even more.
Those styles tend to have similar lyrical themes, and the songs often have a very somber feel to them. But really, it’s like punk: goth music is what goths listen to.
As someone who still loves ska (yeah, some of us still exist ;)), I thought I might clear up this definition a bit.
Ska actually preceeds reggae- the latter is an offshoot of the former, rather than the other way around, as is commonly assumed. Both ska and reggae are heavily based on the rhythm guitar play on the upbeats, but ska does so significantly faster than reggae normally does. Ska bands also often include horn sections, although this is not strictly necessary (i.e. Rancid or Goldfinger).
The first wave of ska began in the 60s in Jamaica, and it was from this that reggae evolved. The second wave, which occured in the 70’s and 80’s, moved over to the United States and Britain, where the term “twotone” became synonymous with ska, describing how many second-wave ska bands wrote horn lines that matched the upbeats of the guitar parts. Second-wave ska bands such as The Specials and The Toasters also incorporated some punk elements into their music, which would be heavily expanded in the third wave.
The third wave of ska is the most recent, and includes fairly well-known bands like The Mighty Mighty Bosstones, (early) No Doubt, Mustard Plug, and Sublime. Also known as “ska-core” (just to induce confusion), third wave ska is heavily punk-influenced, and as time progressed, many skacore bands moved further away from their twotone roots and became what were essentially punk bands with horn sections (i.e. Less Than Jake, Five Iron Frenzy, Reel Big Fish, and The Mad Caddies).
Ack… some horrid grammar errors in that post… and I notice this forum doesn’t allow edits. 
Most definitely. Off the top of my head, I can identify probably about ten subgenres of metal, and I can divide a few of those even further. With some thought, I could come up with a better classification system.
To the layperson, there’s listenable, not listenable, and really weird.
Well, you learn somethin’ everyday (and some days even 3 or 4 things:))
Just wanted to say that gex gex’s descriptions were excellent - not that I thought anyone else’s were bad.
Well, I would tend to agree. However, if you MUST categorize some “rock” as alternative, I would make the case that the entire category of Modern Rock has undergone Harvard-esque grade inflation of at least one degree, if not more.
You see, bands like Korn and Tool are sometimes classified as Modern Rock. I dont hear them called Alternative a lot, but some call them Modern Rock.
However, I dont see much Modern about them, they are just Rock.
Now, bands like Blink 182, Smashmouth, Green Day, etc., are called Alternative a lot. However, I dont see what’s alternative about them. However, their style is different from “classic rock”, enough to categorize them as Modern Rock.
Artists such as the Promise Ring, Sonic Youth, and Archers of Loaf are sometimes described as “Indie”, meaning they are both artistically independent and part of a small “independent” label. However, I dont really see the point indrawing this classification: labels are labels, period. “Major” labels would make good music if they COULD: however, they simply lack the ability (being too top-heavy), not the desire.
However, these artists are sufficiently avant-garde and un-pop that they can be classified as “Alternative”.
Finally, artists that are classified as “Underground” cannot hold onto that label for long, what with the popularity of the Internet. However, they are sufficiently DIY that they can be classified as “Indie”. (The artists formerly known as “Indie” actually have usually signed actual record contracts, mind you.)
In short, when I hear a pop culture talking head mouth the phrase on the left, I translate it into the phrase on the right:
WHAT THEY SAY:-----------------WHAT I HEAR:
Classic Rock --------------------|Oldie
Rock--------------------------------|Classic Rock
Modern Rock----------------------|Rock
Alternative------------------------|Modern Rock
Indie--------------------------------|Alternative
Underground----------------------|Indie
Emo-core is harder, more intense emo music. The emotion is communicated through harsh, jarring guitars, screaming vocals and distortion, rather than the softer, sweeter pop sounds of more recent emo artists (I like both.) Emo-core has more in common with the hardcore music from which it was derived. Fugazi is probably the best known example of emocore.
www.allmusicguide.com has a fairly good definition of emo if you’re interested in that (I don’t know how to link to their pages, so you’ll have to search for it yourself, sorry).
ludovic: As I said above, etymology and definition are different things. Indie artists don’t necessarily have to be on indie labels. Sonic Youth are on a major, I believe.