What are they teaching our kids these days?

This fact free and purely anacdotal OP might have been better off in the Pit, but I thought I’d see if it makes a debate first.

I own an IT company in New Mexico that does a lot of pro-bono work for the schools (as well as a lot of contract work for the schools which we get paid for). This requires me to be in the classroom frequently for various schools fixing computers, verifying connectivity, troubleshooting network problems, etc. Recently I’ve been paying more attention while I was in the class room and have been appalled by some of the things being taught there. Some examples:

Today in a social studies/history class a movie was being shown about Native American’s. It was a historical piece talking about basically how misused and abused the Native Americans were by the US Government in the past. Hey, no arguement there, as I’m part Indian myself (of the Mexican variety, but still). However the main commentator goes into a very long speech stating as fact that the US government had official policies to distribute small pox laden blankets to the Indians in an effort at genocide…and that this policy was followed through on numerous occations. I was like…say what?? I’ve seen this brought up before (I think Cecil himself did a piece on this subject) and debunked…yet its being told in class as fact. Not only that, the teacher then went on to discuss this (again as fact) citing…the movie just shown as proof. I couldn’t believe my ears, and it was everything I could do not to speak out.

As another example, in another class at a different school a week ago the teacher was again showing a movie (this seems to be pretty common these days, showing ‘documentaries’ or even movies in class) about the history of nuclear testing in New Mexico. I was kind of half paying attention as they went through a bunch of the dippy things the government did in the 50’s (drilling for natural gas with nukes appearently, trying to dig large holes with them, etc etc) when I suddenly heard the commentator say that the government had deliberately released tons of radio active material on one of the Indian Reservations in an effort to force them off the land, and had deliberately not given protective clothing to Indian workers mining Uranium on the reservations. Again, this was told as fact (with no cites, no proof, nada) to the kids…and again, after the movie the teacher focused on this one aspect to discuss how horrible the US government is…even though, to the best of my knowledge, this also has been debunked.

Anyway, there are a ton of examples of stuff like this I’ve seen recently in various schools…errors in science classrooms, errors in history (this seems to be the most prevelent for some reason with a lot of myths or psudo-facts coming into play). The debate is, is there nothing we can do about this?? I mean, I’m all for teaching the grim facts and truths about things, especially about US history. I’m certainly a science oriented guy and am all for a heavy science program in school (I feel this is probably the most important subject for our kids…a good grounding in science and the scientific method).

But is there no screening practice that makes sure the teachers are actually teaching something resembling the facts? I’m not just talking about history here either, but science too. Science teachers teaching ‘facts’ that are just plain wrong (like Phobos orbits Jupiter, or mind bogglingly stupid things about physics, and the stuff they were talking about re:Evolution almost made me cry…or just plain psudo-science, like talking about UFO’s in a science class). What kind of education are our children getting in the public school system these days?? Why is it so bad?

-XT

I feel your angst… though I haven’t seen such bad examples. In order to understand better this issue one must ask oneself certain questions:

  • Do parents really care about what is being taught to their kids ?
  • Has critical thinking ever been part of the curriculum ?
    (if it were the kids would google up and contradict the teachers you were mentioning)
  • Is education a priority for the US govt or any govt in fact ? How much is being invested ? How good are teacher’s wages ?
    I would venture the answers as: Parents don’t care, critical thinking is not taught, education is not a priority and school teaches us very little practical stuff.

I think you summed up my feelings exactly RM. I just don’t understand why…why its not a priority, why we don’t teach critical thinking in school…hell, why the teaching in the schools is so poor to begin with. As to the federal government, I know they pour billions into the school system, especially in technology. There is a thing called E-rate (Clinton/Bush’s “No child left behind” program) that any school can apply for. Basically it allows a school to purchase technology for networks and internet connectivity and pay either 10 cents on the dollar, 20 cents or 30 cents depending on need. Even at 30 cents on the dollar (the government picks up the tab on the rest btw) its a great deal…and the schools piss the money away on stupid stuff mostly that doesn’t work or doesn’t do what they really need it to do. From my perspective its money in my pocket to fix their mess, but I have to think…isn’t there a better way??

It makes me heart sick to see some of whats being taught in school to our children…and to think how truely ignorant they are going to come out of school and into the real world. It doesn’t surprise me at all anymore some of the psudo-science non-sense that goes around in this country if this is what the teachers at teaching…hell, they are helping perpetuate some of the ignorance themselves!! For myself, my kids are in public school…not because they have to be but because I always felt that they should get the same shakes as others get (same as I got for that matter). But now I’m really starting to think that I’m a fool…I have the means, maybe I’d be smarter to send them to a good private school. Thats a cop out on my part, but the public school system seems to be in a total shambles to me atm, and while I work with my kids daily on lessons and have done my best to instill in them critical thinking, I can’t but think that they would be better off in a more suitable environment.

-XT

Horrible errors in primary education are noting new, unfortunately. The specific errors change from generation to generation, but they remain a fact of life. The root cause is not that teachers are lazy, or that political correctness/conservative retrenchment/pick your problem is run amok(*).

No, its just a human institution. It’s far, far easier to digest and regurgitate “facts” without critical thinking. Easier for the state Education Departments to prescribe, easier for the school boards to review, easier for the superintedents to monitor, easier for the teachers to push, easier for the students to accept. And with the increased testing, there less and less time for anything but “Here’s what the standardized test demands.” Students are taught more or less to regurgitate X set of random facts.
*[aside]One of the most fun words in the English language. It’s a shame that it gets used so infrequently. I defy you to say “amokamokamokamokamokamokamokamokamokamokamok” and not smile[/aside]

XT:

Having witnessed what you thought were clear factual errors being taught, what have you done to correct it? If nothing, then that answers your question.

I dunno about New Mexico.

In Texas, we are required to teach specific topics covered in the TEKS, Texas Essential Knowledge And Skills, stuff which is picked out for specific coverage by the state board of education. It is my understanding that most states have something like this.

As far as social studies go, though, only specifics are covered… stuff like basic geography, specific points in history that any halfwit grownup should know, basic economics, basic American government (three branches, bicameral legislature, checks and balances, and so forth.)

Theoretically, it should be possible to assemble a perfectly good history curriculum out of the state standards. In practice, it can be done; I’ve done it myself.

…and in practice, there is plenty of room for any given teacher’s agenda.

No one specifically goes around checking for such things. Schools do insist that complete lesson plans be printed out and turned over to administration, but I’d be amazed to hear if anyone actually read mine. Principals and veeps wander in occasionally to audit my class, make sure I’m doing what I’m supposed to do, but that’s about the extent of it.

As a professional, I am expected to teach the truth. Or, at least, as much of it as can be shoehorned in when we aren’t prepping the little devils for one of the horde of standardized tests required by the government, these days…

Is there a cite for the debunking of the “indians got blankets infected with smallpox” bit? I thought Unca Cece said it was legitimate.

I’d blame the prevalence of image based rather than text based learning. It’s too easy to nip and tuck information and history when you present it on a computer screen or with a class movie. Even if the presented facts are reasonable accurate the medium dig into you with emotions. You immediately empathize with the tear streaked peasant having her baby taken away. The underlying context that a text based learning could provide gets swept away by feelings.

I’d blame the prevalence of image based rather than text based learning. It’s too easy to nip and tuck information and history when you present it on a computer screen or with a class movie. Even if the presented facts are reasonable accurate the medium digs into you with emotions. You immediately empathize with the tear streaked peasant having her baby taken away. The underlying context that a text based learning could provide gets swept away by feelings.

Honestly I have no idea what to do. I did speak to the teacher about the Indian Blanket thing, but she basically didn’t want to hear about it…said I was a US appologist. On the bigger picture part of your question, I have no idea what I CAN do. Do you have any suggestion? All I’ve done is to try and instill in my own kids a love for reading, a desire to do well in school as a way to succeed, and a skeptical/critical mind set (I had my oldest son read Demon Haunted World as a first step).

Here is Cecil’s take on it. Maybe I was giving that teacher too much credit if a long time SDMB member also thinks this. :frowning:

Basically Cecils article boils down to the ‘fact’ that a British officer (not US) MIGHT have given infected blankets to Indians based on some correspondence. Certainly, at least as far as Cecil’s article is concerned, it was not a wide spread policy heavily implemented by the US…which is exactly what the file stated (it wasn’t even implied…it was stated as fact). If you have something better on this that shows it happened that way rjung I invite you to bring it out…I’m completely unaware of anything that even comes close to verifying this thing.

-XT

Good point about the emphasis on images. I attribute much of it to schools accommodating what is perceived to be today’s shortened attention span, and a desire to compete with sexier media.

We have been presented with more instances that I can count, where our kids were given flat out misinformation, not to mention incomplete or biased stuff. Unless you have tried, I don’t think you can appreciate the difficulty involved in trying to correct such stuff. Generally, the teacher takes it as a personal affront, and you run the risk of alienating them.

So we have taught our kids that their teachers are not always right, but they are always their teachers. And perhaps the most important thing they will have to learn is how to deal with fallible if not incompetent teachers/supervisors/bosses. As long as our kids’ grades are not suffering, they are able to discuss their schoolwork with their mom and dad. Unfortunately, not all kids enjoy such family support.

As a parent I find it frustrating that so much of the creative, “image” based and experiential learning seems to take place at the loss of school time spent on less sexy basics. So your kid will know the government gave smallpox to and nuked Indians, but he will not be able to multiply in his head or diagram a sentence.

For generations, American schoolkids were taught that the USA was the greatest nation on the face of the earth and the more unsavory aspects of our history were written off or glossed over.

Nowadays, American schoolkids are taught that the USA is the most wicked nation on the face of the earth and the more laudable aspects of our history are written off or glossed over.

Slight Hijack/

I think the worst thing is the DARE classes taught to elementary schools. One “project” consisted of a 2nd grade class drawing pictures of “bad” drugs with the big red slash through them. This included…a coffee pot!

I realize caffeine is a drug. But, telling a second grader that your parents are “druggies” because they have a morning cup of coffee is silly.

End Hijack

by xtisme

Not that you don’t have a point, but I’m not sure of what you are expecting. Do you want teachers to supply a bibliography for every assertion they make in class? Do you want them to verify the validity of all facts prior to teaching them? The problem is not that teachers don’t support their lessons with “proof”. It is that they don’t know the right thing in the first place. It is easy to provide a cite, even for incorrect ideas, so a reference in and of itself means little.

Some misinformation dissemination (such as the kind described in the OP) could be prevented if teachers were only allowed to show documentaries that are pre-approved by the administrators. Of course this approval should only be granted if the information is accurate and as objective as possible. Maybe this policy already exists in most places, I dunno. It would make sense to put one in place if it isn’t already.

Regarding stupid, monumentally STUPID things like D.A.R.E., I have nothing but loathing and much spittle for that miserable joke of a program. One time, at a farmer’s market in Ithaca, my wife and I sampled a taste of a local wine. My oldest son (eight at the time) threw a full-blown screaming fit–I kid you not. We were touching ALCOHOL!!!
D.A.R.E. morons had been propagandizing at his school. From that point, onwards, I kept a very close eye at the propaganda the school spewed at my children. At first, the damnuttermorons (aka school administrators) tried to defend D.A.R.E. Then I informed them that I was an Orthodox Christian, and taking wine every Sunday was a sacramental practice of my religion–therefore, their anti-all-alcohol-no-matter-what propaganda (yes, I used the term “propaganda”) was violating my First Amendment Rights by claiming that my religious practice was innately vile, should I call a lawyer?

D.A.R.E. got less emphasis after that.

I agree that perhaps media is used a bit too much in school, but if the movie (or other media) has good information, it isn’t necessarily bad. Unfortunetly, you can’t get rid of it completely because some kidsd learn better that way. Not to mention that if a teacher lectures all day and assigns reading each night the students won’t learn much that way. They’ll find shortcuts or just outright skip parts of it.
paperbackwriter brings up a very good point about standardized tests as well… i have seen far too many classes focus far too much on test prep… some of them even admitting that a lot of what they teach will be useless after school, but they don’t have much of a choice.
Dalej42, i understands that… similarly, at least in New Hampshire, driver’s education classes (which lasts for 15 classes) has 3 days devoted to alcohol. While i do not think that teaching kids that alcohol and driving are bad together is a bad idea… i actually think it’s a very good idea. However, i don’t think they should be taking out 1/5 of the driver’s ed class to do it… they should be teaching how to drive, not that alcohol is illegel…

Plus, the kids could easily think that a diabetic friend was injecting heroin. The pain pills that their father got from the dentist proves that daddy was a “drug user” who “skipped” work to do drugs.

I guess my point is that teachers should be fairly consientious about what they show to their classes and what they decide to teach. No, I don’t expect them to cite stuff like here on the SDMB. :slight_smile: I’ve actually never seen anyplace (outside of peer review journals) that cites like the folks here.

It just struck me as so irresponsible not only to show the movie (which wasn’t so bad, and I think movies and documentaries are generally good as teaching tools), but to then point out that part in particular and to even harp on it as an example…to go into it in great detail in fact. I give only the best motives to the teacher in question, but I have to wonder at how ignorant those students will be when they graduate, and what myths, psudo science and other falsehoods they will be saddled with later in life…and what kind of citizens they will be with all that crap in their heads. And ya…it worries me.

-XT

I think that would be a good start. Certainly, a teacher should be able to provide citations for any “fact” that is presented should the teacher be challenged. (I actually think the bibliography would be an excellent idea–beginning by scrapping the textbooks and teaching from a bibliography.*)

(Yes, I am aware that the logistics of teaching a class that way would probably be insurmountable. I still think that the idea is praiseworthy.)

I started school in 1928 and from my earliest recollection I remember adults asking each other this question. As far as I can tell the eternal question is not, “Why are we here?”, but rather “What on earth are they teaching the kids these days?”.