What does "following your gut" feel like to you? How did you learn to "trust your gut"?

I think part of trusting your gut is knowing that it might be wrong. When I am caught up in my head, overthinking, it’s often because I want to guarantee I have the right answer, and I’m making the right decision. Sometimes, you just don’t know. You can’t tell the future, and you don’t know how things are going to turn out. Or there are competing values, and any decision is going to be at least partially unsatisfactory. Going with your gut means making the decision that feels like the best you can do right now, but accepting that you don’t know for certain.

Another thing I look at is if a decision doesn’t stay made. Like I decide “right, I’m going to do this” but I keep coming back to and trying to relitigate it, well, my gut isn’t happy, and isn’t going to let it ride. Then I try doing the opposite and see how that sits. That usually clarifies things.

I think maybe you have a decision to make between preserving the status quo, or changing it. If you preserve it, you figure you can always change it later, whereas if you change things now, you might not be able to go back to the way it was. That is always scary. But sometimes it’s not the decision that is hard, it’s facing up to the change.

This. So much this.

Yes this too.

The vast majority of decisions in adulthood are not between a good choice and one or more bad one(s). They’re between two (or more) bad choices that are differently bad.

If you face a good and a bad choice, you make the decision so automatically that it never even gets classified as a decision. You just do it and obviously so.

It is precisely the skill at picking least-bad alternatives that is the hallmark of a mature and successful decision-maker.

And one of the skills which is part and parcel of being a good decision maker is not persisting in the fantasy that there is a winning all-good alternative that either you have overlooked, or that some deus ex machina will magick into existence next week if only you wait it out a few more days.

That crap never works.

A lot of this thinking is driven by the book Impro by Keith Johnstone which is less a book about improvisational theater and more a life treatise.

So two thing you have to understand as very basic facts about the world are:

  1. Our reactions to any individual circumstance are beyond our conscious control and can only ever come from our gut. We hear a joke and we either laugh or don’t laugh, we don’t get to decide whether we find it funny. We go through a bad breakup or the loss of a loved one, at no point can you say, ok, time to stop being sad and be not sad instead and then be not sad. We get a dream job on paper and go into the job and find out we hate it, your rational brain cannot show the spreadsheet of pros and cons to our subconscious brain and have it be like, yup, that makes sense, I’ll stop feeling those feelings now.

  2. Our brains evolved to be massive prediction machines. That’s most of what the brain occupies itself with on a day to day basis. We have a slightly awkward conversation with someone, they think nothing of it but we replay that conversation over and over again in our minds gaming out different scenarios to see if it could have gone differently. We’re about to have a difficult conversation with someone close and we pre-prepare by gaming out every single response they could have and what our response will be and so on and so forth and we end up having the convo and it invariable veers into an area we hadn’t even considered. All of our prediction architecture is solely geared to your gut reactions, we are driven to act in ways that we predict will maximize or minimize pleasant and unpleasant gut reactions solely.

The basic tenets of Impro are that, as children, we emerge into the world as creatures solely driven by impulse. Why we feel drawn so much to “childhood innocence” is we see in children a purity of spirit in living a life that is unencumbered by the control of the conscious mind. He says that the act of development is one in which we receive psychic injury, that is, we act in a way that we expect one type of joyous reaction, then we are shocked to find a violently different reaction and we react with shame and submit our gut to our brain so it will never happen again. Like, a kid does something they think other kids will find delightful and they make fun of her for it instead and she learns that it’s no longer safe to be that free spirited youngster and she must hide that part of herself.

Keith calls the act of schooling, as practiced in the modern Western world, a systematic form of violence in that it was intended to take all of these fractally shaped pegs and cram them into industrialized square holes to serve as interchangeable cogs in a mechanistic society.

The output of such a system is “adults” where the primary skill that has been taught is that such a strong filter is placed on the conscious brain that what makes it from the subconscious to the conscious in the first place is only the thoughts we regard as “socially acceptable” and the job of the conscious brain is to pick from among the socially acceptable choices, which one best serves your interests.

His major thesis about Improv Comedy is that teaching Improv is an act of unlearning more than it is an act of learning. The reason we find Improv funny is different from the other comedic arts in that we find a catharsis from seeing other people let their impulses run wild within a safe environment and there is a comedic release that happens from the surprise of recognition.

His entire practice of teaching Improv centers around how do we get adults to first recognize that this filter is there and then be able to adjust this filter on a situational basis to let more of the gut instincts filter into the conscious brain. The rest of the book is then various techniques he has found to make this practice happen and produce great improv performers.

But it’s this act of unlearning which I think is the key message because many people are incapable of following their gut because their brain is so afraid of their gut that they aren’t even able to listen to what their gut is trying to say in the first place. They are confused as to why they act the way they do and why certain impulses seem to drive them regardless of their will because they don’t understand themselves enough to know what the gut is trying to protect them from.

But the gut is, not by any means, a perfect prediction machine, it’s the byproduct of several billion years of evolution and whatever life circumstances have impinged upon your life so far. The gut’s job is to predict what will make future you’s gut happy but it makes systematic errors, often grievous ones in its attempt to predict. This is “trauma” in the pure clinical sense of the word, it’s an experience that impinges upon your gut instincts so strongly that it sends your prediction engine haywire in systematically unhelpful way. PTSD or OCD, among other clinical diagnoses are trauma diagnoses and the therapeutic goal is how to repair the subconscious to bring it back into a more healthy state.

But regardless of whether you’ve suffered clinically defined trauma (and far more people in the world have than ever get diagnosed), your gut is prone to leading you in dangerous directions which is why we felt the need to protect ourselves from it in the first place. But the realization is that the gut can be trained and that the proper place for the mind is not to wrest control from the gut and scold it from going wrong, but how the proper place for the mind is there to train the gut and turn it into something you can increasingly trust.

So in my mind, it’s a three step process:

  1. Listening
  2. Training
  3. Trusting

Where the steps don’t happen in sequence, it’s a constant jumble/negotiation between them and there’s no end point, it’s a lifelong process in which you strive to get a little bit better every day than the day before but the output of such a process is a more “integrated” person who lives a life more authentic to their values and has a clearer sense of who they are, who they want to be, and a path to get there. And while it’s a simple process, it’s by no means an easy process and the act of doing so is a constant act of bravery within yourself to confront and overcome the things that you find most scary about yourself which is why so few people end up embarking down this road, despite the legions of self-help books that all dress this up in some flowery language.

So much this. I think I tend to fall into the trap of avoiding making decisions, out of fear of being unable to change things in the future. And that is where I get hung up. Your thoughts are helpful to me…

In addition, I read the following quote today that has been helpful for me in considering trusting my gut vs. trusting my head:

Is the situation actually complicated? Or is it really quite straightforward, but you are making it complicated because it requires a lot of courage to make the straightforward decision?

That hit me hard.

Thank you for sharing this. I get so caught up in my own head sometimes that I am like “oh, you’re just being irrational and unreasonable…look at all the “good” parts of the scenario…you’re just focusing on the negative and avoiding the positive because your brain is giving into confirmation bias.”

If the fear and stress are happening, then it is REAL.

Still, the fear and stress so often overpower the courage needed to take the step forward. It’s easy to think, “Just say it. Just do it.” but when it comes down to it, saying those simple words feels a lot like taking a step off the edge of a crumbling abyss, with no idea if there is a safety net to catch you down there or not. On the one hand, you may experience a brief period of free-falling and then land safely in the net that will help lead you to a better place…on the other hand, you may experience the free-falling sensation for a lot longer, only to end up smashing into smithereens at the bottom.

Either way, the free-fall sensation happens. But you don’t know the end result - and can’t find it out - until you take that initial step.

(I type all that out and in my head I’m like, “YEAH! That’s right! Do it! You gotta take that step!”…and I know that I am going to just get stuck in my head overthinking it and spinning my wheels out of fear, over and over again :frowning: )

On a broader note, I’m not sure if your dilemma is about that relationship you were telling us about last time, or some other huge decision/problem in life.

But a good way to make a decision is: What outcome makes me feel RELIEVED? The option that makes you relieved is often the right one.

If that’s not good enough, then try the, “Which choice will I be gladder that I made, ten years from now?”

Recently diagnosed high-functioning autistic here. My main symptoms are difficulty in accurately interpreting things (eg social cues, things that people say). I absolutely cannot trust my emotions or gut, unfortunately.

Not taking that step can have the same consequences. It may just take you longer to realize them.

Eventually, not making a decision is making a decision.

A little of both, if I’m honest.

Relief after envisioning one outcome over the other feels good…but it also feels fleeting. Because of the uncertainty of the unknown. I think I am really, mainly suffering from anxiety paralysis and just freaking out over all the different “outcomes” that could result from one decision. I am experiencing relief at the thought of one outcome…but then I think, “but along with that relief will come a lot of pain and/or other hard feelings”.

It does. But you’re being eaten alive by hyenas right now. Even a crumbly cliff offers the hope of survival. The hyenas do not. And you know it.

The worst thing that could happen is you find a new GF who’s not crazy.

I used to fly fighters for USAF. Which includes riding on an ejection seat just in case the situation gets too dire to fly out of. The seat comes with no guarantees either; it might maim you or kill you too. Or the situation might already be unrecoverable no matter what you do but you’re just now figuring that out too late.

Our sardonic saying was “Sometimes you have to commit suicide to avoid being killed.” IOW: better to jump and have a chance than ride the stricken jet to certain death at certain ground impact.

You’re sitting to a stricken jet plummeting to your doom at high speed. On the way down a wedding will occur and that explosion will seal your fate. You will die if you stay; it’ll just be a long agonizing awful experience getting there.

Or you can jump out now while it’s still plausible you come out OK once that insane gaslighting you’re immersed in goes away. Which it will the minute you walk out that door for the last time.

Jump Stupid! Jump!!! Meant with nothing but affection for you and your future success.

I can’t read the OP’s mind, but I suspect what’s going on in his mind is not, “My F-16 is about to crash, but I don’t want to pull the ejection seat handle.”

I’m guessing it’s more like, “I don’t know if this F-16 is going to crash or not, and if it is, then I should punch out, but if it isn’t, then I’ll regret punching out if I realize in hindsight that the plane was actually still flyable and could have been landed and now I wrecked my spine and an expensive plane for nothing.”

Maybe the OP could clarify. But it seems that he’s not just dreading the pain of breakup, but also trying to figure if breaking up is even the right call or not.

Did you read the OPs earlier thread? He’s engaged to a woman who’s probably a BPD who is making his life a living hell and he’s miserable but can’t bring himself to call it off. For reasons that nobody can fathom, not even him.

Yeah, all my best decisions have been logical, rational ones.

In fact, I could give you plenty of examples of “bullets I’ve dodged” by NOT going with my emotional reactions. From not taking that cool job in a remote mountain town, to not marrying that wild woman…

I think this kid has the answer:

Maybe you can read my mind…This hits the nail on the head. Bolded text is exactly it.