It was geared too high for my liking and I found it difficult in low speed maneuvers. It was like starting out in 2nd or 3rd in my bike.
For low speed maneuvers you should be slipping the clutch anyway.
This is probably the worst advice so far in this thread.
The bike was geared too high for normal slipping. Again, it was like starting out in 2nd or 3rd gear. In the other maneuvers that required 2nd gear the engine was dragging to the point of knocking. It was like driving a 3/4 ton truck with a VW bug engine. I’d leave the training session and have no problems with my bike.
Based on what? He actually got killed in Italy?
I haven’t seen anything convincing about noobs needing smaller bikes yet. In all such discussions it eventually comes down to some variation on " that’s how I did it" or " that’s how it’s done." As we move into full riding season, I’ll think of you guys every time I go down the turnpike and see somebody on a small bike, out of throttle just keeping up with traffic, and getting blown around his lane every time a large vehicle roars around him.
This isn’t supposed to be about ego, you know.
There is no ego in pointing out the facts of life on a small bike.
but I spent a year riding a small bike and disagree with everything you said. I wasn’t “getting blown around” nor was I ever “out of throttle just keeping up with traffic.”
and I’ve already posted a photo of my bikes. in terms of overall size, my 250 is just not that much smaller than my Dyna. The whole point of a “starter bike” is that one won’t let a novice bite off more than he/she can chew. you can’t really grab too much throttle on a 250. Grab too much on a Gixxer (especially if you don’t know what it’ll do) you’d better hope you can stay on the thing.
the only people who think getting a high-output sportbike for their first ride are 19 year olds who still think they’re indestructible. they’re the types that hang out on bike forums and brag about outrunning the police.
also keep in mind that I believe the OP (like me) is an older person, and we’re way past our prime learning years. something easier to handle is a lot more suitable whilst you’re getting comfortable on two wheels. Starting out on a bike that can easily scare you is just going to have you leaving it in the garage.
honestly, this is the single worst thing about motorcycling. The cliquish “your bike sucks!” mentality that infests it.
IMO Gus’s post #38 is the most complete and wisest one in the thread so far. Plus jz78817’s just above my own.
It’s BS to think small = unstable & large = stable. It’s also BS to think stable = good.
It’s also a mistake to think a 1000cc dressed-out cruiser is more performant than a 500cc sport bike or even a 500cc basic street bike. The big bike has more HP, but still has less performance due to its different power curve, greater weight, different gearing, etc. The big bike also slows less well.
No bike will reliably stay upright hitting a real pothole. You’ll crash damn near every time. A pothole is bigger and deeper than a mere pavement defect that most bikes, *intelligently *ridden, will handle. The key, as Gus said, is to see and avoid all significant road defects.
Any modern street bike from a 350 on up will massively outperform almost every car on the road in terms of top speed, acceleration, and stopping distance. The shortcomings of a 350 street bike on the freeway are not any of those things, but rather comfort. It’s important to understand that, as **Magiver ** said in post 34, comfort is not safety; in fact it’s a false sense of security.
You occasionally see folks riding 250-450 dirt or enduro bikes on the freeway. Those folks are the ones out of throttle, but that’s due to the bike’s lower gearing, not lack of raw horsepower. They’re also riding on really inappropriate tires for their mission. Don’t be like those guys.
Bottom line: the bike stays upright and you stay uninjured by avoiding *all *the stationary road hazards like potholes and slippery stuff, and all the moving road hazards like cars and trucks that will actively try to run over you because you’re invisible *and all *the handling mistakes like too much speed or too much throttle or too much braking that will lay you down. If you are ready to do *all *those things *all *the time you’re ready to ride.
In case I didn’t make it clear, IMHO nobody should ride a bike they can’t pick up unassisted from lying on its side. For a small-but-strong guy like me, that tops out at about a 650. Which can still hit ridiculous top speeds and accelerations.
yeah, this is one thing I was going to address. Just talking about a bike’s engine displacement doesn’t tell you much of the story. Big cruisers generally have long-stroke V-twins which make most of their power/torque down low in the RPM band, and run out of breath around 5000 rpm. The 1,690cc “big twins” in Harleys have about half of the horsepower that a 1,000cc sport bike will have. Cruiser engines are made to lug around a heavy bike around town and up to highway speeds. They’re in no hurry to accelerate, but give you steady pull. A sportbike is made to go fast, makes its power up at 7-10,000 RPM, has a razor-thin power band and a twitchy throttle.
The OP already stated in his first post that if he gets anything, it will be a cruiser.
1969 Yamaha Route 66.
Looks great.
Rides good.
Easy to control.
Gets my fat ass to 70MPH in level no wind conditions.
Cheap to operate.
Fun.
Good learning bike.
Real low center of gravity.
Wish I still had one.
Better than the Honda Rebel IMO.
In spite of having H-D permanently ingrained in my DNA, I still like the Yamaha Virago and the later V-Stars. At least for everyone except me. And while I never had a Virago over say 45/55,000 miles on the odometer, I never saw any of the starter issues some folks complained about.
Buy the bike that excites you the most.
Unfortunately, that bike typically depresses the hell out of your wallet.
Bottom line.
How to survive learning to ride a motorcycle.
- By a good 250cc bike for starters. BS on larger bikes. (I’ve had them all, small, large street, 250 to 400 cc motocross, 400 cc Husqvarna desert, etc.)
- Take a good safety course.
- Buy good safety equipment, helmet, gloves, jacket, pants and boots.
- Ride around town during less congested times to begin with.
- Go to a parking lot and practice figure 8s.
- Assume that every car in the left turn lane ahead of you is about to make a left turn in front of you.
- Assume that no cars see you.
- Learn to keep one eye on the front tire of a car in a lane you are passing. You’ll notice that tire turning into your lane before the car does.
- Assume that you are invisible to all cars.
10.Never ride without your safety gear on.
11.Assume you’re invisible to all cars. (important enough to mention several times)
After you are confident riding in city traffic, move up to the 600 - 1000 cc bikes. They will feel natural and you’ll be confident.
Also, those cars turning left in front of you…THEY never manage to see you so be very cautious when approaching intersections. Oh, one more thing. A green light doesn’t necessarily mean there’s no cross traffic coming, BE careful, pay attention and you’ll be fine.
I think the largest capacity you might even begin to consider is the 800cc Triumph Bonneville - the newer ones, not the old air cooled classic - easy to ride, not too much power, pretty tolerant engine even if you hit the wring gear, reasonable brakes without being too powerful, and a stable machine in most conditions.
…but, there is a reason why so many motorcycle schools use the Honda CB500 - Reliable, light controls, cheap to run and insure, not really attractive to thieves like certain machines - although thieves will eventually steal anything.
Its also fast enough and slow enough - which sounds a bit odd, until you get used to riding, then you will understand exactly what I mean, drop it and parts are fairly easy to come by. Its also a middle ground machine that will do until you decide what your heart really wants - do you want a cruiser or a sportster or a street fighter - well first get some experience and then you have a better idea.
↑ ↑ ↑ Good & realistic for what actually happens the most out in the wild, or at least should happen.
When you’re learning, you want hardware that forgives your mistakes and bad judgment.
I learned street riding as a teenager on my dad’s bike, a 1982 Honda 450CM. Only 37 horsepower, 383 pounds. This was a good bike for learning: light enough so I wasn’t struggling to cope with the weight while dog-paddling through slow parking lot maneuvers, and low enough power so that a moment’s stupidity with the throttle wasn’t going to land me on my back or propel me to dangerously high speed before I had a chance to understand what was happening. It was also cheap (Dad bought it used), so if I did drop it, the value wouldn’t take much of a hit. In other words, it was a forgiving bike.
The Kawasaki Ninja 300 has similar specs and is often recommended as a starter bike. The OP may wish to inquire at local motorcycle dealers for a cruiser with comparable weight and power, and then buy a used one. Maybe something like the Yamaha V Star 250. $4300 new, you can probably get a well-used one for half that price. Ride that for a season, then sell it for just about as much as you paid for it.
Get training, and wear good safety gear. A lot of riders get a cool-looking jacket and helmet, and think they’re done. These are the guys who end up in the ER with road rash on their legs because they were wearing ordinary jeans, and broken ankles because their cowboy boots came off as they tumbled down the road (or because their sneakers never covered their ankles in the first place).
Get in the habit of wearing earplugs. People who drive everywhere with their windows up and their radio on are often aghast at this advice, which I think is weird. The fact is that with earplugs, you will still hear the sounds you need to hear just fine, and when you reach retirement age, your ears will still be in relatively good working order because they will have been spared the cumulative damage of endless hours of wind and engine noise.
I recently bought one of these:
I unequivocally recommend.