What is it about Asians and western music?

In My Humble Opinion
1

Now, please, if I am simply catreing to stupid stereotypes with this question please tell me and I will drop the matter.

But has anyone noticed that East Asian immigrants (or more especially their children) in the west seem to have some kind of “thing” going with musical excellence?

I don’t know where this young man on Youtube lives but he is obviously East Asian in origin and does a WICKED rock version of Johann Pachelbel’s famous Canon in D.

Or when you go to a piano recital of classical music in a high school, for example, have you noticed how young Chinese girls seem to be VERY heavily represented among the best?

As I recall, in the “Joy Luck Club” the daughter of one of the Chinese immigrant women was a musical super-achiever.

First of all, am I just imagining things or is there some trend here?

And assuming that there is, does anyone have any theories about why this is so?

I have a theory of my own. It is possible that East Asian immigrants very much want to be part of their new western culture, but some of it is hard for them to connect with until they have been here a long while?

For example, I think they may have trouble connecting (in the first generation or two) with the western sense of humour. Have you ever tried telling a western-style punchline-type joke to a recently-arrived Chinese immigrant, even if his English is good?

They may choose NOT to connect to things like Christmas and Easter because of their religious content.

Our open discussion of sexual matters in our literature and movies may embarass them.

But music is another matter. You don’t need to be good at English to be good at music. It crosses all cultural lines. But it is something clearly attached to western culture. A young Chinese girl who becomes excellent a Beethoven is connecting with western culture.

Also, it is something that requires discipline and application to become good at, which I suspect is something most East Asians want to inculcate in their children.

I would be interested to hear from East Asians especially. Is this a ridiculous stereotype I am painting here, or is there something to what I am saying?

2

As I recall, the girl wasn’t actually musically gifted, but was forced by her overbearing mother to learn, and one of her defining moments was when she finally screwed up a recital on purpose so badly that her mother gave up trying to force it upon her. Although I have only read the novel, and not seen the film.

Maybe that helps with the rest of your points too.

3

Now that I recall the film a little better, you are right. Part of the drama was the desire of the daughter to rebel against her mother who wanted her to be a musical prodigy.

But once again, that leads me back to my original overall question. Is wanting your kids to be super-achiever musicians a trend among East Asian immigrants in the west? (Mind you, a trend can be only 10 or 20% of a group — it does not have to be the majority).

And why music?

4

I’ve always been under the impression that Asian cultures put more emphasis on discipline than the American culture does (I do not know of other Western cultures).

Where an Asian parent tells a kid “you’re going to learn to play X instrument and you’re going to spend X hours a day practicing and you will be good at it” the kid accepts it and does it (one might suggest that this sort of pushing is considered an act of love).

In America the parents ask the kid if they want to be in band and if the kid says no, they don’t join. Or they do join and the parents don’t make them practice.

I don’t think it’s a bad thing, just a cultural thing. Asian parents see pushing their kid to excel at something as the best thing they can do for their kid. American parents see letting the kid make their own choices as the best thing they can do for their kid.

5

It’s not just music. I went to school with plenty of Asian kids who excelled in science and math (and some who excelled in other areas, and some who did not excel at all).

Music is pretty math-centric thing. Disregarding style, you can either perform stuff “right” or “wrong.” You can’t really paint “right” or “wrong,” or act or play sports or write op-ed pieces “right” or “wrong.”

If it’s important to you to be able to get your kid to excel at something starting at an early age, something with clear boundaries and rules is going to appeal to you.

6

What you say makes a lot of sense, Zipper. And to some extent (although I draw the line at beatings) I have to admire the attitude of Chinese parents that if you love your kids you will force them to apply themselves and try harder.

Homer Simpson telling Bart he is proud of him for having learned that “work is for suckers” is not so far from reality when it comes to western parents. I have to admire the Chinese on many scores.

But do you have any theories as to why they push their kids to excel in music rather than other pursuits? Does my theory that music crosses cultural lines more easily have any validity?

For example, a little girl who becomes excellent at classical piano can play for her grandparents who perhaps speak no English.

Also, music, like math, is precise and based on scientific rules that apply in all cultures.

7

Believe it or not, we both wrote about the same thing at the same time. I mean, our postings about music being like math in its precision.

Also, I imagine that things like western poetry would be hard for Chinese parents to judge. You don’t have to “practice” poetry X number of hours per day. It is hard to tell if the child has worked hard to become a good poet.

8

Western classical music has become a part of the culture of high-achieving children in countries such as Japan, and indeed part of their musical culture in general, so it’s not necessarily an observation of something specific to Asian immigrants in western countries.

9

It’s a well-established stereotype that all (East) Asian parents force their children to learn an instrument. It’s a stereotype because it’s generally true.

To overgeneralize, if American upbringing is about “be happy with who you are” and “we love you no matter what,” Asian upbringing is about “no matter how good you are, you can always do better” and “being average is to fail, and being excellent is to be expected.” All my Korean girlfriends had very similar childhoods - we were expected to excel at everything and were terrified of bringing home anything lower than an A- on a report card. All of us play the piano and one other instrument (violin for the most part, although for me it was a viola).

I think it’s more about cultural standards when it comes to bringing up children, rather than being directly influenced by a desire to be connected to Western culture. Although there is something to be said for Western culture = upper-class culture in Asian countries, I suppose.

10

It must also be said that most Asian music sounds like a cat being beaten to death with another cat: in Japan there’s a huge market for Western classical music, but practising traditional - and awful - music like the shamisen or shakuhachi has largely been relegated to the level of museum culture.

11

That was my upbringing too, and I’m not Asian. My father always said “Smart kids are a dime a dozen,” so to truly stand out (meaning to get scholarships for college), they got my brother and I into music lessons because we had no natural aptitude for athletics. My brother was a gifted musician (clarinetist) with a perfectly trained ear and a head for composition, but he hated every moment of it, and eventually quit completely. I played sax in school bands from middle school onward, but never had too much fun until I went to college and played in bands on my own.

12

Oh, I don’t mean to say that Asians have a monopoly on that kind of childhood - just that it’s more of a cultural norm for them.

13

I think it’s more that Asians push to excel at whatever they do. And it isn’t something that they do once they’ve arrived in the West - it’s something they do in their home countries, from childhood. It has nothing to do with “connecting” with an adopted culture. It’s all about “whatever you choose to do, do it well and do it right”.

It’s also not limited to “classical” music. I see and hear it in most of the Japanese pop/rock I listen to. Even when a band is imitating a Western pop style that is not noted for musical virtuosity (say, punk), you can tell that underneath what they’re playing, the musicians are insanely competent. They don’t pick up a guitar after deciding to be punk rockers; they learn to play the guitar, and master it, and then decide to play punk rock.

The key here is that in many Asian cultures, the individual is always subordinate to the group. This is indoctrinated in them from childhood. When, as adults, they become part of a team/group/company, their goal is to make a satisfactory contribution to the success of that team/group/company. Nobody wants the shame of being the one guy on the team who isn’t pulling his weight.

This should continue until the religion of “self esteem” gains a foothold in Asia.