You wanted to break into his house while he was gone?
There’s no one incentive. Sometimes doing good feels good. Sometimes it feels obligatory, if not always satisfying. Sometimes, we’d do bad but for the fear of retribution. Sometimes we do bad when we know we won’t get caught.
Overall, I think the biggest incentive that virtually everyone can agree upon (eve those with precious little conscience) is the notion that “if everybody behaves this way, we’re all up shit creek”. The major crimes, like murder, theft, abuse, simply can’t be committed unpunished or civilization comes apart at the seams. It’s beneficial to society to have rule of law and some ethical standards, and what benefits society benefits the individual. Most adults recognize that doing good is simply necessary for the survival of themselves and those they care about. Imperfect justice doesn’t fundamentally change this truism, so even in the absense of real justice, it’s worth striving for all the same.
I know I’m going to regret this, but…
Why did you follow this with an anecdote about someone doing the right thing for its own sake? And how is justice served by keeping the guy in jail for a week?
Bingo!
I’m a materialist, and I don’t only do good for fear of being caught if I do bad. I also do good, partly because I was raised to do good, and partly because I believe that doing the right thing is virtuous and right in itself.
I think evolutionary biology plays a role in our desire to be good. Throughout most of human history people had to cooperate and look out for each other or die and we still do to a degree. A group of 20 people with a dishonest, noncompassionate user would be seen as a threat to group survival instead of someone who was helping the group out, and would probably get kicked out or killed for it.
This is assuming humans lived in commune style arrangments and not just genetic family arrangements, which i’m pretty sure some did. Even family arrangements (parents, siblings & kids living together) has some incentive to be good.
I prefer to suppose that when I do the Right Thing, I do it for the good effects it will have on others. I think it is sufficient that others will experience good effects. It needn’t have some kind of benefit for me, as long as it simply increases the amount of good in the world.
false.
I have come to this exact point in the philosophical road so many times. Of course there are many injustices in the world, and so many times it leads us to conclusions that cannot work, but seem to be the only rational to counter the complete tilt of the playing field.
Good people must not simply be “passively” good, but they must be ready and willing to intervene even when the circumstances do not involve them directly. I have found that so many people define “good” as the lack of controversy or strife with others. Meanwhile, they appear to be oblivious when those same “others” with whom they coexist compatibly are engaging in abusive behavior towards third party individuals. It is here where simply “being good” does not suffice.
I have concluded that the"bad guys " are actually quite in the minority. When you really stop to think about it, if you asked the majority of people if they feel that their family and friends are by and large premeditatively evil, they would reply in the negative.
There are a very small number of sociopathic evil doers who aare able to wreak havoc on the society and this is for two reasons.
!. The “bad guys” are premeditatively and surrepitiously pursuing their agenda, and they are never sleeping or loving or really eating or concerned about family. They are obsessed with their evil intent. Also, they are recognizable to each other and imbued with ultimatel loyalty towards each other based on the common goal.
- Good people are much more passive and less driven . They tend to avoid controversy, which to many people is an evil unto itself. And although they are essentialy “not bad” people, they will not see their way clear to getting involved in the struggle on someone’s behalf simply for the pure justice that demands involvement.
And this lack of cohesive loyalty and the inherrent reluctance to intervene, ask questions, pay attention, and realize that it is a war between the forces of good and evil is exactly how the minority of evil people are able to make so much headway despite being so far outnumbered. Being in denial and avoiding the conflict will not make it go away. And that is what our lives are really all about.
Engaging in the immortal battle of good and evil, and hopefully being able to have left the world slightly more civilized and equitables
and virtuous then it was when we found it.
thanks for saying that.
Whats the old saying? “All that is required for evil to win is for good men to do nothing” Or something like that.
Isn’t it interesting that throughout most of this thread, “good” means doing things for other people at your own expense, and “bad” means doing things for yourself, at the expense of other people.
I don’t think most people really live in that kind of dog-eat-dog world. I think most people work hard and honestly, surround themselves with the things that make them happy, and develop relationships with people who have similar values. They don’t hurt other people, and don’t take crap from the people who do. This is totally ethical, and usually results in some measure of happiness. That’s the reward.
The bad people get banned from this board, or get frustrated and leave in confused disgust. 
Good people have problems, too , but they tend to have more resources to deal with them-- that is, loving friends who lend a sympathetic ear and will help out when needed. Bad people tend to get the finger when they’re down on their luck, something that perplexes and enrages them.
The bad people may be getting laid, but they’re not getting loved. They may be making money, but there’s a good chance they’ll end up losing it anyway. They never have anyone they can trust.
Hey, if making a quick buck and finding someone to fuck is all that a person wants out of life, the lifestyle of a creep may seem pretty good, but I actually feel a bit sorry for them. They’re victims of their own choices, and will never be really happy because being happy requires sharing, trust and kindness.
Curious, why is making money, and getting laid considered “bad”?
If someone works to make a ton of money to help support their family, and wants a little side action to deal with the stress of making money, why is this bad? :dubious:
My point is that there are a lot of people who are just pathetic losers. They blame their failures on “bad” people screwing them over and somehow believe their “good” nature hamstrings them in life. In reality, they just suck.
“Evil always wins because good is dumb”.
-Dark Helmet
I don’t think money or sex are bad-- depending on how you get them, that is. I see nothing wrong about having a good old fashioned fuck-for-the-fun-of-it, but if the other party has been emotionally manipulated or otherwise misled, it’s a bad thing. I also believe it’s wrong to cheat on a partner who expected fidelity. (Some folks have open relationships-- that’s fine if they’re happy with it. I’m talking about deceit.)
Money brings many joys in life, but not if it’s been bought at the price of inflicting suffering on others.
For me, the short answer is that being good is in the longer term self-interest of individuals and society. We do good in the hope that someday someone will return the favour when we need it; we give to charity because someday that person in need might be us or someone about whom we care; we obey the law because both the general and personal costs are less than if people break it (e.g. a shopkeeper who suffers theft will have to charge more, and thieves get sentenced). Society profits from people being and doing good.
Well, being bad or evil does not necessarily mean being psycopathic.
Sometime being bad does not even affect other people: embezzlement, dishonesty, secretly having an affair, etc. It’s a matter of choosing to do something wrong to advance or get something.
Other times, there is great evil that is done that even today goes unpunished: rape, molestation, domestic abuse, infidelity, etc. Even if some of these may be punished in the West, they go unpunished elsewhere.
After all, if one can get away with it, won’t it only help one; and if one does not take what advantages one has before one, is it not being foolish?
WRS
Have you read Plato’s Republic, WRS? That’s the OP, if you will, of the dialogue? I’m not sure if you’ll get the answer you’re looking for from it, though.
I’m not sure where that stray question mark came from.
Sorry, lately, I 've been throwing them everywhere. I thought I caught them all, but I guess not.