I am a lesbian mama. My son has another lesbian mama but we are not together. We maintain co-parenting as though we are, though–everything has gone smoothly for years, even holidays together.
Our son, Asa, has been with the Scouts since Cub Scout days and is now one of the mid-level Boy Scouts, with his eye on attaining Eagle Scout. He loves Boy Scouts.
So do we. I participate in everything our Scout Troop does. I work bottle drives, I visit gravel pits, I even spend nights at summer camp every year as an acting Asst Scoutmaster.
We knew before that the Boy Scout policies were anti-gay, but it was an “old” position and as an “older gay,” I had long come routinely to accept that in many organizations in which I took part.
Now the boy scouts come out with their big, public, no-gays allowed policy. Eagle Scouts are turning back in their positions in droves. Straight parents as well as gay parents are pulling their boys out.
I just feel such a loss for Asa, his mamas, our Troop and its Scoutmasters (who are appalled and embarrassed–at troop level it is such a different thing). I can’t see a reasoned explanation for staying, though. “Working within” has been tried for a long time, and has resulted in this “new” ruling.
What does your son think? If he’s “mid level” in the Boy Scouts, he’s probably about 13. That’s old enough to have an opinion, plus he’s probably had to deal with the whole anti-gay thing his whole life.
Also, what’s his troop like? I imagine that many of them are not so openly anti-gay.
Come on. The Boy Scouts are a publicly funded organization that nevertheless manages to discriminate on age, gender, sexual preference, familial status, and religion. That’s almost half the federally protected classes. They’d probably discriminate on color if they thought they could get away with it, and they’re notably hostile to the transgendered.
Why would anyone have anything to do with them? Their oaths and such always claim the high ground, doing what’s right and civic duty and all–but you don’t see many troops rejecting the BSA and going independent.
There exist similar organizations that don’t have all the baggage. Or start a movement to get your local troop to dump the national organization and go independent.
It’s all just such a damned shame. I loved being in the Boy Scouts, and it was a valuable part of my growing up. I thought they would grow with the times, but . . . it’s just such a damned shame.
Discuss with your son. Discuss with the other people in your troop - obviously, if they’re all embarassed, then they should understand your position.
Possibly you can all migrate to a different organization collectively. Perhaps if the Boy Scouts see enough of a drop in numbers around this issue, they’ll at least take pause for thought.
I agree. He is definitely old enough to have an opinion. If it were me, I’d probably let him choose, but if he decided to stay, I would not be as heavily involved.
Regardless of whether or not you continue, I believe you should let your son decide if he wants to continue in Scouting. There are plenty of people who have religious-nut parents who say that they were or are not allowed to do <something> because their parents objected. As a mature, comfortable lesbian who probably has dealt with disapproval before, you should think about it the other way. Do you want your son, as a college student, to go around saying that, "My mom is a jerk. She made me quit Scouts because she didn’t like their policies. Now I bet she’s gonna disapprove of me (voting Republican, joining a church, not going to the gay rights march, or something that is within his rights to do). Don’t do that to him.
Your troop clearly understands your position and don’t care. Having some people fighting the good fight from the inside is a very important thing too. You are proof that the BSA can’t deny (that you are good members of the troop and of the BSA and that their decision affects you.)
I am stealing the words from a Catholic priest I met some years ago who had joined the priesthood at the age of 54 after having owned a coffee shop in Greenwich Village (NYC) for years and then lived in San Francisco for even more years. He joined the priesthood “to fight for the rights to acceptance and love of gays, lesbians, and women from within the Catholic church.” His experience, intelligence, life, and choice made him a person that was impossible to ignore (he didn’t go around preaching his life, but rather he simply gave the homily and lived his life truthful to who he was). I think you can do the same thing here- don’t run away and don’t hide it.
Oh, we’ll let Asa continue if he wants to. Actually, we’d prefer it. I don’t though… He’ll be quite torn. He has a good social conscience, but he IS 13 and he really likes Scouts and all the things they get to do.
Separate from that, I’m debating (gnashing, really) over whether to quit my own participation. It would seem only to hurt the troop. (I am that good–no, just kidding. But I do a lot.) It seems morally inconsistent to continue, gnash, gnash…
Also, do we tell the troop why we’ve dropped back. (Or, really, the troop leadership and parents. The scouts we’ll leave up to troop leadership, of course.) Our contributions have been active and longterm, and when we don’t show up for something, the boys ask Asa, “Where’s your moms?”
Asa is at climbing Mt. Kathadin, with his troop, at the moment. When he gets back Sunday, we’re going to talk to him about it. I don’t know what he’ll think.
Yes, I’m clinging to this idea. It may be something we can all come around to as a family when Asa gets back. I would be happy with that: if we could derive some understanding that let us continue in scouts, despite the policy and our misgivings on a moral consistency basis. Hmm, interesting… I can tell how I feel while writing this that I’m looking for a way to reconcile continuing.
It’d probably be better to scale back or eliminate involvement with the organization. I’m sure you are fully informed as to what happened to Jennifer Tyrrell but for those who are not, she was loved and embraced by her troop, but the Boy Scout Council for the region told her she had to resign because she is gay.
Seems like letting Asa decide what he wants to do is appropriate, but if he decides to stay the course and then the regional council decides to push his mom around down the line, he could be hurt.
It’s sad you have to make this kind of choice. Frankly, it pisses me off that someone who is trying to be a good parent has to make this type of choice, but someone who might be less than an ideal parent who happens to be hetero doesn’t…
Like what? I’ve sometimes thought that my boys would like to do scout style activities but I would never encourage them to join such a socially conservative and religious group.
Our town’s (Oak Park IL) Boy Scouts were kicked out of the organization 11 years ago. It was straightforward. The Boy Scouts said no gay troop leaders; we went out of our way to state that while we were not aware of any current gay leaders we would not discriminate if there was one, heck it would be against the law of the village; they said in that case you are out. Some of us formed CampFire groups instead. They were fun.
11 years and not much has changed.
I am sorry that you and your son have so difficult a choice to make. Our town’s packs made a choice to take a stand knowing what the result would be, even knowing the impact would not be enough to change the minds of the BSA leadership. We felt we were teaching our kids something important, something more important than they’d learn by earning a bunch of badges. Our values. If enough packs across the country do what we did back then now it might have more impact at this point in time.
I would think that the time has come for as many packs across the country as possible to all sign on in unity that they will not follow the policy and to dare the BSA to kick them all out, to make an example of all of them the way they thought they were doing with us.
I was thinking about Campfire and the Boys/Girls Clubs of America, but when you asked, I Binged* “Boy Scouts Alternatives” and got a fair number of hits I’d never heard of, which might be worth a look. On the less formal level, when I was in high school, there were a couple of “woodsman” clubs that were basically just excuses to go camping.
Yes Binged. Look at my location. And it is so a real word!
Do the folks in your troop know you’re gay? If so, why not stick it out and offer them a good reason to think the policy is bunk? If you have to pretend you’re straight, then maybe I could understand.
Easy for me to say, maybe, since I have no connection to BSA, but I just can’t imagine supporting such a bigoted organization. The kid can learn a tough but accurate lesson about how sometimes it hurts to stand up for your principles.
On the other hand, it could be considered kind of arbitrary, as no doubt I give my money to several places that do things I would find objectionable. But when they’re so upfront about their unadulterated bigotry and it’s a supposedly an organization that aims to build moral character…well, I just couldn’t do it.