I just meant that I find it extremely likely that, among voters, only 25% on either side actually felt like Hillary or Don were a good choice; and that the middle half–and everyone else who just didn’t vote–saw the choice as a matter of which sort of corruption you prefer. The shit sandwich. I really think a large handful, but by no means a majority, of people think Trump is just what we need. I think the actual problem is half of us are disengaged from the election process, whether through hopelessness or inability to feel relevant in something as massive as a national election. But every state had enough nonvoters to crush either candidate had they simply been motivated.
I agree 100% that he is a symptom, and that he serves as a pretty good indicator of what we need to do to improve ourselves as a country. My less generous side wants to look at your situation and deride your propensity to enjoy it here while things were relatively good, and now that madness seems to reign supreme you’d take your winnings and leave the table. But I think that may not be fair, so I’m trying not to be a dick. By some standards I’m a rich white guy (rich, meaning I could probably miss three whole paychecks before being completely fucked–and just forget about retiring) and I’m also not directly targeted by Trump. But I have a problem with what I see as abandoning my targeted countrymen when they are at their most vulnerable. Just because the attack is coming to people who are not me doesn’t mean my standards and dreams are not being attacked.
Situation #1: You live in US. You move to a more liberal area. Don’t turn on the news. But you are still in same country as Jim Bob (2000 miles away) who voted for Trump.
Situation #2: Go through all the trouble of moving overseas. Don’t turn on the news (Trump is still on). But now you are in different country and Jim Bob is 4000 miles away.
Maybe I am overthinking it, but I don’t understand why Situation #2 makes your life drastically better than situation #1. Maybe it can’t be rationalized.
That’s a fair view. I do struggle with the idea of walking away and leaving others behind. But for fucks sake, if we can’t beat Trump by a huge margin in 2020, is there really any chance we can fix this? I’m willing to overlook 2016 as a perfect storm of a variety of complex factors, but if it happens again I really can’t fathom what to do about it.
I honestly think Trump will not run in 2020 IF he can get a blanket non-prosecution deal for himself and his family. I can’t believe he’s having anything like a good time and sleeping easily these days.
I made my choice after the election not to move back to the US, but stay in Canada. Now I’ve bought a retirement condo which I plan to leave feet-first. But I don’t think it is very easy to retire here, for a number of reasons, taxes included. But it is generally a nice place to live and you don’t have to listen to the news. And the medicare is awesome. But that is part of the reason they don’t encourage retirement immigrants.
I’m impressed with how the people of New Zealand responded after the recent mass shooting at a mosque in Christchurch. From what I’ve heard about overall that would be a good place to consider.
As others, like CairoCarol, point out, there are a variety of things to consider. Do you live alone? How strongly do you interact with friends and relatives and will you miss them?
Are you hoping for a lower cost of living? You’ll lose Medicare, I guess; that and periodic visits back to U.S.A. may eat up much of the savings from the lower living cost.
Do you see major change of culture as an exciting opportunity? Or as a nuisance? (I’d love to move to France or Portugal, not because I think they’re “better” than USA, but for the novelty.)
With all its faults, the USA is still superior in important ways to most countries. The political issues you speak of argue against my return to USA, but that’s because I’ve become peculiarly obsessed with, and disturbed by, American politics. Wean yourself away from Rachel Maddow, and keep conversations to the weather(), and USA might be OK!
( - Hint: “changing climate” is OK to say, but not “climate change.”)
Thailand has its own political problems, but the people have a happier attitude about them. And I’ve needed to interact with many dozens of government workers and, despite that the rules are often stupid, the bureaucrats almost always bend over backwards to help. Interacting with American bureaucracy is major annoyance IIRC.
Good points, but as far as medical care goes, it might not be so bad, as at least here in Poland it is incredibly, almost impossibly affordable; a year or so ago, after I had been here a couple of years, I had a pretty severe gout flare-up and my fiancee (now wife) made an appointment for me with an internist/rheumatologist who spoke perfect English, and she gave me a full physical, complete with labratory bloodwork, (to check uric acid levels) talked to me about my general health and asked if there was anything else I needed from her, and a Rx for 3 months worth of medicine, for a total cost of $25, including the cost of the prescription.
Shortly after that, my fiancee found out that she could add me to her health insurance for free, as a “Domestic Partner”, (this was before our marriage) so I recieved full coverage thru her work at no cost to either of us.
Granted, Polish health care generally isn’t cutting edge, and there can be long, long waits for specialist care (supposedly a year for an MRI, for example) but for the basics, even for the unemployed/uninsured/homeless it is head and shoulders above what many Americans pay a small fortune for.
There’s no point in moving unless it’s for some other reason. There’s assholes everywhere and anywhere you go, if they’re not in charge now, they will be at some point.
What you need to do is drastically reduce your consumption of cable news and internet. Like to zero except for conducting personal business. Arrange to have someone email you when Trump is either gone or tweets that he has declared “Marshall Law!”
Living as I do in Canada, I’m biased, but there are tangible benefits that can’t be achieved in the US just by ignoring the problems or not watching the news: free health care (“free” as in “exactly zero cost at the point of service”), strong gun control, low crime, legal cannabis for those so inclined, and sane governments (relatively speaking) with generally liberal policies due to regulated limits on political spending and a reasonably well informed populace. Other benefits not relevant to a retiree: sane abortion policies (namely, no legal restrictions), and regulated low prescription drug prices (you’d be covered anyway). Probably the biggest benefit, at least in terms of entertainment, is the ability to watch US news and shake your head in quiet amusement.
And winter weather is generally not an issue in the southern part of the country, although winters can be cold on the prairies. But not on the west coast, nor generally in southern Ontario or the Maritimes, and they’re getting warmer, with wine country in Ontario growing wider varieties of world-class wines during increasingly longer summers. Still, to put the most positive spin on it, expect a good chance of a white Christmas each year.
Immigration is an issue, though I don’t know how big an issue for a retiree with independent means of support. I presume you would still get your full US Social Security. You would not be eligible for the contributory Canada pension plan, but would be at some point for the non-contributory universal entitlement.
If you have a couple million saved, and want to retire to another country, they probably want you, right? You’re bringing money from elsewhere to spend it there, and you’re not going to occupy a job.
Not really, because old folks tend to be one of the groups that is the heaviest user of health services. If you’ve not paid taxes your working life to support Medicare, why should you be able to move here and get free* medical care during the “heavy-user” phase of your life?
Yes, I know it’s not “free”. It’s paid for by taxes. That’s my point.
Survive, yes; in some of the more rural parts of the country you may even be able to get a farm with a decent chunk of land. But don’t expect an American-sized house and car in an urban area for that money.
A hobby-friend of my Crazy Aunt is Finnish. Often, she doesn’t say a word beyond “hello ladies” and “see you next day”. One time the conversation turned to immigration and she said “by your standards I’m super-closemouthed. By Finnish standards I’m crazy: I’ve been known to answer questions from strangers.”
I visited Finland, and found the people reasonably friendly. I suppose I mostly interacted with people who were part of the group I was with (some were Finns, they invited the group), and with people in the tourist trade. But I found the Finns friendlier than the Czechs, for instance.
I loved Finland, and sometimes fantasize about moving there. But it’s need someone else to go during the winter. I get a little seasonal affective disorder here in the northern US, and I’m sure if have troubles there.
You may well find the Nordics politically suited, mostly. But we are not really all that good as retirement objects. The long winters have been mentioned, but there is also the issue of ice on all the outside surfaces as you get older, your balance declines and your bones grow brittle. The cost of living is likely to be higher than your country of origin and your money won’t go as far as you think.
If you have sufficient money and don’t mind quiet small places the south coasts of Norway and Sweden plus most of Denmark tends to have acceptable winters though.
Meh. The doctors are on salary, the nurses, technicians etc are all on salaries, running an extra MRI or CT only costs a bit of electricity and contrast fluid. Supplies like plaster, drugs, bandages etc are bought in bulk. Its not that different from moving to a different nation and putting your kid in K-12 education, or using their police, firemen or military protection. The investments have already been made, the costs of an extra unit are not all that. The issue does get raised now and then, but Americans tend to be far more sensitive to health care being given to people because its such a scarcity good there.
