In this thread I asked which country would be best to emigrate to and although I specified English speaking countries, The Netherlands was mentioned favourably a few times. This has obviously made me wonder what living there would be like. If any Dopers could enlighten me I would appreciate it. Some of the questions I have are -
What are the costs of accomodation and living like?
How’s the weather - cold and depressing or more bearable?
How much leave would one get a year in a typical job?
What are the downsides to living there?
As an English-speaking South African with a UK passport what kind of problems would I have in trying to get a job there - I am currently working as a UNIX/Oracle administrator and my SO is working as a SAP ABAP consultant?
Which is the best part of the country to live in?
I lived in A’dam for 3months last year working on secondment in my firm’s global headquarters.
What are the costs of accommodation and living like?
Not too sure as the company put me up but from talking to people it seemed better than the Euro cities that I’m used to (Dublin, London, Paris)
How’s the weather - cold and depressing or more bearable?
The winters are cold and wet but the summers are very nice indeed. Nicer than Dublin anyway
How much leave would one get a year in a typical job?
About 5 weeks IIRC
What are the downsides to living there?
I didn’t see any. I loved it and would move there permanently tomorrow.
As an English-speaking South African with a UK passport what kind of problems would I have in trying to get a job there - I am currently working as a UNIX/Oracle administrator and my SO is working as a SAP ABAP consultant?
The comp industry seemed pretty strong. I was a SAP admin and there seemed to be lots of work around from talking to people.
Which is the best part of the country to live in?
I only know A’dam but it is the coolest, most relaxed and beautiful place I’ve ever lived. Great people and great atmosphere.
I’m actually flying to A’dam tomorrow for a training course and am really looking forward to a few days in my favourite city.
The costs of accomodation really depend on where you would want to live.
Around Amsterdam the cost of housing is quite high.
I see you are from Gauteng so the weather will probably kill you.
We have a lot of rain and wind and our summers aren’t that long, although it has improved a bit the last few years.
I currently get 29 days of leave, but normally I think it is about 23-25.
The downsides of living here are the costs and the weather mostly. (traffic can also be a nightmare)
You should be able to find gainful employment in your field here, as does your SO.
I am not sure which part should be best to live.
Around Amsterdam there is a lot of work, but as I said the costs of living are pretty high.
The lower part of the Netherlands, around Eindhoven, has been developing pretty good, since a lot of businesses are moving there.
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[li]What are the costs of accomodation and living like?[/li]I’d say you could rent a reasonable apartment for about 500-750 euros a month.
[li]How’s the weather - cold and depressing or more bearable?[/li]The Dutch spend their days complaining about the weather. I love it though. Very diverse, with lots of storm, occasional days when temperature drops below freezing point, and quite a few days that are hot enough to take a swim at the beach. Overall the weather is mild. I use a bicycle to get to work, a twenty minute ride, and even though I have to be outside for at least forty minutes a day, I have not come home wet from the rain more than three or four times last year.
[li]How much leave would one get a year in a typical job?[/li]I get about five and a halve hours leave for every 40 hours I work.
[li]What are the downsides to living there?[/li]Since 9-11 and the Fortuyn/Van Gogh murders the political climate has become quite rightwing and xenophobic. The Dutch Tolerance and the poldercultuur (the compromise-seeking that’s part of most political decicions) we were once proud of are becoming more and more of a scapegoat for everything that’s wrong.
[li]As an English-speaking South African with a UK passport what kind of problems would I have in trying to get a job there - I am currently working as a UNIX/Oracle administrator and my SO is working as a SAP ABAP consultant?[/li]Can’t help you here.
[li]Which is the best part of the country to live in?[/li]I guess economically the Randstad, a conglomeration of cities in the west, is the place to be. If you like big cities choose Amsterdam, Rotterdam or Den Haag (The Hague), Leiden and Delft are smaller cities that are still part of the Randstad. If you’re more interested in the countryside I’d recommend the northwest, Friesland and Groningen, for the typical flat landscape
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This is one of those very touchy feely commentaries which is based completely on limited experience and probably completely irrelevant. I’ve been to Amsterdam 3 or 4 times and after hanging out there I would have thought everyone in the Netherlands spoke English like the Queen (Elizabeth II, not Beatrix, although now that I think of it, Beatrix probably speaks English with a perfect Oxford accent).
A friend of mine married a Dutch girl and moved to a small village. Being an American without fantastic job skills, he elected to be the househusband and raised the kids. He had not become fluent (he could get by, but didn’t spend a lot of time at the pub chatting up the locals) even after having spent several years there. It’s unfortunate for my friend that he didn’t pick up the language more easily, and I got the impression that he was a bit isolated. As an Oracle DBA, I would assume that you would end up in a more cosmopolitan area.
The point being is that outside the cities, English speakers are not ubiquitous. Additionally, since almost every Dutch traveler I’ve met speaks English like a Californian or a Brit, I was under the impression that everybody there spoke English, but I was mistaken.
Nevertheless, it seems like a great country with extremely enlightened people, and I would jump at the chance to live there given good employment opportunities. Amsterdam is one of my favorite cities on the planet.
I suspect that almost any place would seem cold and depressing compared to South Africa, but when I’ve been in Amsterdam the weather has ranged from delightful to dreary.
Not really what you asked, but I recently paid 100 US a night for a hotel room that was equivalent to a probably a 20 buck a night hotel in the US- you know the kind you take a prostitute to in a seedy neighborhood- tiny, smelly, old furnishings, bedspread you wouldn’t touch- so I imagine a decent apartment is astronomical. But the pot made the room bearable. It was bitter cold, but the ticket price was hard to beat.
As far as speaking English goes- no problem. Not only does everyone speak it, they have a knack for being able to accurately size you up and tell that you speak Englsih- most people I encountered began their conversations with me in English, as though they somehow knew I spoke it instead of Dutch- and no, I wasn’t wearing my American flag “these colors don’t run” t-shirt.
