I’m looking for an inexpensive way to record two mikes (one for acoustic piano, one for vocals) onto CD. The restrictions are:
It needs to be in real-time (that is, I don’t want to write to flash memory or hard disk first)
It needs to be easy to use
It needs to use regular CD-Rs
It can’t require a computer
I don’t need studio quality, the sound just needs to be clear.
I’ve looked at simple analog mike mixers connected to a dedicated CD recorder, but the least expensive recorders I’ve found start at $300. I note that DVD recorders (that can write to CD-R) are, for some reason, much less expensive (I see them for under $100), but that’s for a basic model with no level adjust or metering, which would mean that I’d have to convert the signal to digital before sending it to the player (and it’s also assuming that the DVD recorder would have enough features to do this properly).
This is for my son’s vocal instructor. We’d like him to be able to record his students singing along with his piano accompaniment, and then be able to hand them a CD at the end of the session, without the recording process taking up any of his time (other than to put a CD in the recorder and press record).
Maybe get a recorder like this (about $250; $175ish for a refurbished model) and a simple mini mixer like this (~$50) to set the mic levels. (You may need to look for a mixer with XLR inputs—there are some in the same price range—or get an impedance converter.)
I don’t see you spending less than $250 - $300 total for a push-button solution. CDs have always been a mix-down format, not a direct recording format, so this is an arena with few options. No one ever bothered to create the equivalent of a cassette deck, where you just hit “record.”
I was looking at that one, but it only records on audio CD-Rs, which are, in general, more expensive and difficult to find than standard CD-Rs. The person who will be using this is not what I’d call technologically advanced, so I don’t want to worry about him buying the wrong discs to use with it. However, if the next step up is signficantly more money then I’ll take the chance…
Would something like this be able to mix down directly to standard 2 track CD on the fly? I note it has a built-in hard drive, which implies that there might have to be an intermediate step.
The price is reasonable, and the fact that it’s all-in-one is a plus.
I’m not too concerned about the mixer, there are inexpensive (< $50) mixers available, not much more than a mike preamp (which I’d need anyway since CD recorders do not seem to have mike inputs). I’d also be concerned about ambient noise, since the voice lessons take place in the instructor’s NYC apartment.
I took a closer look at that Tascam Portastudio; while it seems like a helluva deal for the price (you really get a lot of features), there doesn’t seem to be any way to burn direct to CD, and it’s probably too complicated for him.
If you have access a Mac of recent vintage, it probably came with Garage Band and iTunes. All you need a small, inexpensive mixing board like this and the appropriate cables and adapters to get the signal into your computer. This allows you to record on the computer, do simply editing, and burn the result to a CD-R. The first two steps are done in Garage Band; the last in iTunes.
Damn, you keep figuring out the things I was in the process of putting in a post before I finish editing them. Here’s what I had before your last post:
As you noted, toadspittle’s unit requires Music CD-Rs, not standard data CD-Rs. This is the case with the majority of component CD recorders. IIRC, the price of Music CD-Rs includes a payment to the music industry in some fashion, the assumption being that you are using them to copy CDs. (A quick look at Amazon suggests that the extra cost may be amount to about $2.00 per 50 discs.)
However, here is a Sony CD recorder that claims to be able to record on standard CD-Rs and CD-RWs. It’s a little more expensive than the first one, though.
But neither of these units has mike inputs. So at the very least, you’d need a small mike mixer or pre-amp to bring the mikes up to line level.
The Tascam Mixer is very impressive in its capabilities, but I’m relatively sure that, as you guessed, that it is a two-step process: record and mix on the hard disk, then burn the mix to the CD recorder. You might be able to find the manual online.
But the big problem with it would seem to be that it is way too technically complex for your technophobe teacher.
So I’d suggest a small simple mike mixer like this one along with the Sony deck I linked to might do what you want without too much trouble. Note that your mikes need to have XLR plugs, or you’ll need adapters.
That’s the first deck I looked at before I found the Teac. However, a user review notes that it does require CD-R/Audio discs to record, and its rating is lower than that of the Teac.
I found a Roland two-track CD recorder (CD-2) that seems to do everything I need, but it’s significantly more expensive.
If you have an iPod available, the Belkin TouchTune Stereo adds two microphones and recording capability for $60. You only use a computer when burning the CD later. I use this for recording concerts, and it works astonishingly well, is cheap (assuming you already have the iPod).
You’re thinking about one user—the instructor—but there’s another user here—the student. And you need to remember that standard CD-Rs DON’T always play in all CD players. There’s a reason to use music CD-Rs; many stereo manufacturers have set up their equipment so that ONLY music CD-Rs will play on them.
If the instructor is that helpless, then I suggest you also assist him in purchasing music CD-Rs in bulk spindles of 50.
After further research, I stand corrected. I know that some consumer audio CD players (i.e., not attached to a PC in any way) simply will not play CD-Rs. Usually a problem with older models, and these have been dying off over time. At the time I was experiencing such problems (with a Sony CD player) I had been told that it was due to the music-CD royalty issue (i.e., that some manufacturers had basically said, “if you don’t pay the royalty fee, then we’ll simply assume your music is pirated and won’t play the disc”). It appears now that its more an issue of (a) age of CD player and (b) quirks/quality control among players and brands of CDR media.
Actually, to my knowledge the problem was with CD-RWs, for the most part, because they are less reflective than CD-Rs. I believe almost all CD players, even old models, can play CD-Rs (at least, that’s been my experience; I’ve tried CD-Rs in players manufactured as early as 1985 or so).
I think you are a few tech steps behind. I think it would be far easier, cheaper, and much less fuss to record the performance digitally, save it as mp3 and email it to the student, or host it on a web space (cheap to get) where they, or relatives across the county call DL and listen to it. It would be cleaner, easier and far more useful than burning to a CD.
Re access virtually any student whose parents are paying for music lessons will be in a demographic that has numerous PCs in he household.
Again, I want to set this up so that no computer is involved (not because it’s too complex, necessarily, but because there is no computer set up in the area where lessons take place, and setting one up in the area would be unwieldy at best).
Incidentally, we’re not talking about kids music lessons here. This is an instructor for professionals involved in (or looking to be involved in) musical theatre. The reason it can’t take any extra time for the CD burning is that sessions are scheduled very tightly, and nobody wants to take time out of his lesson to burn a CD.
A new notebook PC and USB digital mixer can be had for 550. Used in good condition for approx 350 or less. It would take up less space than the analog audio equipment you anticipate using.
A cheap, easy, pushbutton, non-PC mediated solution that directly burns non-audio regular CDRs does not exist so far as I know.
Right, but if you could live with the students getting their recordings later, instead of right at the lesson, you could use one of these portable digital recorders. No computer needed on site. Transfer the recordings later to someone’s computer, and as **astro **suggests, by e-mail or Web to the students.
You could conceivably even transfer them to a student’s own thumb drive at the time of the lesson, although I’m not sure how easy that would be. You might have to transfer it to some intermediate digital storage device first.
If none of this is acceptable, The small mixer and CD recorder will come closest to what you asked for in the OP, except that you’ll need to use Music CD-Rs.
