What's wrong with kids these days???

The BBQ Pit
1

My just-turned-6 stepdaughter is extremely outgoing but somewhat socially immature. Because of this she gets picked on by the neighborhood kids quite a bit. I realize this is a part of childhood and me and her mother try not to overreact, we just TRY to tell her that if people are mean to her they aren’t her friends and she should stay away from them (but she’ll argue that they are her friends, everybody she wants to play with is her friend in her mind), and if one of them hits her or pushes her, hit or push back - some people may disagree with me on this part, but in my experience the kids who never defended themselves were the ones who spent their lives being picked on.

She’s been coming home crying a lot because of some kid named Chad who picks on her. Chad hit her, Chad pushed her down, Chad took all the batteries out of her toy. I figured it was one of the little boys I see her playing with, I could see how she could annoy a little boy to death, especially if she developed a crush on them. I told her to leave him alone and not let him pick on her, and to tell us or his parents if he kept it up, but Chad apparently told her that he would beat her up if she did tell on him. Not the nicest kid, but nothing unusual.

Well, I’m sitting out on the front steps with her waiting for a friend who was coming over. Some kids are playing in front of the apartment building and she points out Chad.

The kid looks to be at least 12 years old, maybe older. What the hell is a kid that age doing playing with a little girl half his age? Even if he wasn’t bullying and stealing from her I would think there was something wrong with that (in fact, I posted a few months ago about a kid in that age range knocking on our door asking if she could come out and play). When I was that age we thought kids that age were beneath our attention, and if one of us were to pick on one I’d imagine they’d get smacked around for it by their friends. At that age we were interested in chasing girls our own age or older, and not to beat on them. What’s happened to these age and gender barriers that we had when I was a kid? Young children these days are hanging out with teenagers and learning stuff they aren’t ready for from them, getting bullied in situations where they have no chance of defending themselves. I can’t believe it’s too good for the older kids, either.

Not sure what to do about the Chad situation, maybe ask some of the other kids in the neighborhood if they know where he lives so we can have a talk with his parents, though I doubt it would do much good considering how well the kid has been raised so far. What my stepdaughter really needs is a big brother or cousin who’s old enough to kick this Chad’s ass but young enough to avoid serious trouble for it, but none is available. I’m half-tempted to give the girl a knife, despite my better judgement.

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Okay, first, ditch the knife idea, as half-hearted as the idea may be. It will only make a bad situation way, way worse.

Second, I was struck by the age of the child in your OP because I remembered your other story about the older kid coming by to play with her. If I were you, I would try to watch her playing with these other kids for a while. I don’t mean directly supervising but maybe just you can just happen to be within earshot and able to see what goes on. It would be even better if they didn’t know you were there. You might be able to get a better handle on what is going on. It may just be that this Chad kid gets picked on by kids his own age so he turns around and bullies the smaller kids.

However, and I do not mean to alarm you, “playing doctor” with younger kids who don’t know what’s going on is not uncommon at Chad’s age. The only reason I bring this up is because of the two separate incidents with two different older kids. The fact that your step-daughter is very outgoing and that she wants to be friends with everyone makes her a good choice for this activity. You or your wife need to hang around a bit more near where she is playing–especially when these older kids are around. Just a thought.

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Yeah, that kind of situation was one thing I was worried about, especially back at the time of the earlier post mentioned. She has been taught to tell us if anybody ever tries to touch her in certain areas or if anybody tries to tell her to take off her clothes. Found out once she did tell about a situation with a then-family friend before I met her mother, and she’s given us some false alarms when kids try to talk her into taking off her shoes for playing in puddles, so I THINK she might tell us, but then considering how she’s been frightened out of telling on that one kid who picks on her…she does tell about his physical abuse, so I think she would if he was trying anything else she has been warned about.

I have spied on her a couple of times, I sat near an open window overlooking the area where she was playing, never heard anything worse that kids teasing her for the amount of Barbies she owns…it seems impossible to watch her all the time, though.

I truly was joking about the knife comment, BTW.

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I figured you were kidding but you never know… :wink:

So far as “playing doctor” goes, she may not see it as bad and therefore, she won’t tell you. After all, kids like her when she does that–they don’t pick on her. She would have no reason to tell you. I know you said she has been trained to tell if anyone tries to touch her or remove her clothes but often, to kids, the training teaches them to watch for this with adults, not other kids. To her, it may seem like playing. Although, with the info about her telling about her removing her shoes, I think she might say something. Just keep a look out for her.

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Badtz Maru, let me start off by saying that I’m a Mom of two boys (8 years and almost-5 years old), so I have LOADS of Mom-paranoia. I just get uneasy thoughts reading what you said about Chad. The thing that really set my alarm bells ringing was the comment that he told your daughter that he would beat her up if she ever told on him about anything. I’ve always told my boys that if anyone ever threatened them against telling about something, that that meant it was probably something very wrong, and something that they SHOULD tell me about.

I do some part-time teaching at the YMCA. Every year, there is a mandatory all-staff meeting at our branch, where they tell us information we all need to know. This year, our insurance provider came in and gave a talk on keeping kids safe. (Although I work in adult fitness, this was considered relevant to all of us because the YMCA is the largest child care provider in the US.)

Although I can’t remember any of the statistics he cited, they were very eye-opening. Basically, he pointed out statistics on the number of children who are molested each year. A startlingly large percentage of this is peer-on-peer molestation. (I had honestly never given this any thought. My only fears for my sons up until this point had been the sterotypical dirty old men. I didn’t realize that his own peers were actually the greater threat.) I had always assumed when my son attended Y camp that the kids were broken into huddles by age group so that the counselors would be dealing with kids of similar sizes and education (which is also part of the reason) — but one of the main reasons is because peer-on-peer molestation is most likely to happen when you have one kid who is a year or two older than the other one. The younger one looks up to the older one socially, and is easier for the older one to dominate him/her.

So, maybe this kid Chad doesn’t have friends his own age because there aren’t many more kids his own age around, or maybe he doesn’t have much personality. My guess, though, is that he gets off on bullying other kids around, and it’s a lot easier to do when the kids are a lot younger than you are. (And, as I remember, to a 6 year old, 12 year olds are almost god-like in their maturity and coolness.) From what you’ve said, it doesn’t sound like anything untoward has happened other than what you’ve mentioned — pushing her around, taking her toy’s batteries out, etc. I’d sure be uncomfortable for her to be playing with him unsupervised, though.

I’d make sure that she knows it’s not only OK, it’s very important for her to tell you anything he does to her or her friends, especially if he makes threats about telling anyone about it. (And I’m tempted to say to tell her that if he touches her anywhere he shouldn’t that she should tell him something along the lines of “My Daddy says that if you touch me there, he’s going to pull your balls off with his bare hands and then stuff them down your throat,” but I know you don’t want to tamper with your child’s innocence because of what some thug MIGHT do.)

Your idea of checking with other parents in the neighborhood is a good one, though. It sounds like a good idea if everyone could help look after everyone else’s kids, or at least find out if other kids have problems with him as well. And, if your daughter is in school, have you thought about checking with her school’s guidance counselor for advice? (Some are more useful than others, however.)

Good luck on this. I feel for you. It’s so hard to know what to do sometimes.

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When I was around 7 or 8 yrs old, there was a wide range of ages in my neighborhood. During the summer I played with kids younger & older than me (6 yrs to about 14 yrs old). When I got a little older I played with younger kids but it was usually because I was babysitting one of them & the rest of the kids came over to play. Nothing untoward ever happened. HOWEVER, I agree with the other people who have already posted. Keep an eye on this boy, talk to other parents in your neighborhood, remind your step-daughter that it’s okay to “tell” on someone. Having had parents who were not really that concerned or supportive when I was being picked on/teased, it’s refreshing to see someone who is concerned with his kid’s well-being.

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Well, I found out who his parents are. It turns out he lives in the apartment next door to us, where a new family moved in a month or two ago. I haven’t run into them yet but my wife doesn’t like them, and we both suspect they reported us to the office for leaving bagged trash near our front door (since it’s a long walk to the dumpster and I live upstairs we occasionally would set the trash there and I would carry it to the dumpster when I go to work at night). We stopped leaving our trash out there at all, and then a Coke 12-pack of trash showed up next to our door and another complaint was made. Went to the office and told them I would take out that trash but it wasn’t ours, we didn’t even drink Coke. This makes me wonder if a direct confrontation with them will do any good.

I think that my stepdaughter would definitely tell on Chad, even if she might not with someone else, now that she knows I don’t approve of him picking on her (as I said before, we teach her to take care of herself in peer-on-peer conflicts and apparently she thought that applied to bigger kids too). A friend was babysitting her and told me later that my stepdaughter told her about Chad and said that if her stepdad caught him picking on her he’d kick his butt (which I didn’t say), and got a really angry snarl on her face when talking about him.

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Badtz, I can’t find the thread you’re referring to. What’s the title?

This is really unfortunate, and I’m sorry to hear of it.

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Here’s the thread.

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Thanks, Badtz. Is “Chad” the same guy from the GQ thread?

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Nope, different kid. Chad moved here just a few weeks ago.

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I see.

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Why can’t they be like we were - perfect in every way?
What’s the matter with kids today?

[sub]Sorry – couldn’t help myself…[/sub]

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So what, exactly, is wrong with anyone hanging out with anyone?

If it was socially acceptable for everyone to hang out with everyone, then we would be able to synergize our relationships with other ages/genders and come off the better for it (like exercising muscles more intensely than you are going to use them rather, so you can use them as needed more effiently.)

I remember the paranoia of the 80s and I am was fairly traumatized because of it. A soccer mom (no quotes, this was at an actual soccer game) told another that she lets her daughter be babysat by girls but there’s “something wrong” with girls being babysat by men/boys.

Of COURSE its more likely to be a problem, chances are good that a gerontophilic (woohoo i coined a new word! :)) man would not be desperate enough to overcome the stigma for a mere monetary reward. But if our social mores were changed then the average male babysitter would be no more likely than the average man to hold ill intentions.

And the strange part is, women can be the perpetrators too, just ask my mom who works in a psychiatric children’s unit.

Have you ever been accused of holding an undue affection for children? I have and it does not make you feel like Wally Cleaver the man next door.

Perhaps we need to go back to the white bread/picket fence ways of 50s suburbia and regain some lost innocence. I know it was never as good as people remember. But I hope my scars from being a member of a discriminated gender heal some time so that I can fully open myself up to my children if any.

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I understand what you’re saying, Ludovic (cool SN!), but the bottom line is, Badtz wouldn’t be any happier if it was a girl his stepdaughter’s own age who was picking on her and taking her stuff.

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ok, this chad kid sounds like trouble, yes, but only because he’s picking on her.

when i was in junior high i was very unpopular with kids my own age. i also lived in an apartment complex with only younger kids. i babysat most of them, but i also played with them off the clock. i never had any hamrful intentions towards any of them; it was just that i still wanted to live in a world of barbie dolls and dress-up clothes – not a place where pissy little blondes teased me and talked their boyfriends into asking me out so they could laugh in my face if i even seemed to think they might be serious.

i don’t see any harm in supervising a young child’s playtime and playmates, but don’t automatically assume that older children are out to get her, or have something wrong with them. maybe they’re just lonely.

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If Chad was her age, I still wouldn’t like his picking on her, but it wouldn’t seem so unfair to me - my stepdaughter has hit other kids before, she’s tomboyish in some aspects and I have faith in her ability to deal with bullying from her peers. She’s big for her age and can pack quite a punch! But this kid is twice her size and twice her age, and clearly she is intimidated by him and he is taking advantage of that by taking her stuff, and as pointed out above he’s at the age where you have to consider the possibility this might mutate into something even uglier.

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Ludovic, I hope I didn’t come across as recommending a blanket opposition to older kids playing with younger kids, or boys playing with girls. It’s just that this particular kid sounded like bad news to me, particularly due to his habit of picking on a much younger girl, and then threatening her if she told anyone in authority.

I’m aware that many people do hold a prejudice against males in nurturing roles. I’ve had the opportunity to watch several young men working in the nursery and child care programs at my YMCA, and I have fallen in love with several of them for the playful, affectionate care that they have given to my children. I’m also aware that they are viewed with suspicion by some parents because of an automatic prejudice along the lines of “Why are they doing child care? Are they gay or something?” It’s a shame that they have to face that. I’m glad that the Y has the guts to stick to its guns and keep them in there to provide an example that men can be top-notch caregivers.

I don’t think that turning back the clock would help things. If anything, those times were more homophobic and rigid about gender roles than today. And unfortunately, you can’t really regain lost innocence. I feel sad that I don’t feel safe allowing my sons to roam free around the neighborhood the way I did as a kid, but I don’t feel willing to make them part of a social experiment to seeing if being more trusting of others will actually make others more trustworthy.

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I can’t offer advice, I can only commisserate. When I was your step-daughter’s age, I had my own “Chad.” He rode my school bus and every day he had to tell me how fat or ugly or stupid I was, he would take my lunch box and dent the hell out of it, or try to trip me as I walked down the aisle. This went on through most of my elementary school years, until he either got his own car or graduated.[sup]1[/sup]

Looking back, I still can’t figure out what would drive a junior high, almost high school age boy to pick on a kindergarten or first grade girl. Was his self-esteem so low that that was the only way he could feel like a big guy? That just makes him even more pathetic. Of course, it didn’t occur to me to think like that in elementary school. And my parents couldn’t figure out how to make it better. Their advice ranged from, “If a boy teases you, that means he likes you,” to “Kick him in the shins.” I love my parents, but in the area of defending us from bullies or teaching us how to stick up for ourselves, they were completely clueless. I still don’t know how to defend myself.

[sub]1 Imagine my horror when I went to my 5 year high school reunion and there he was, married to one of my classmates. Yecch, I thought I’d never have to see his ugly mug again, but there he was, sneering away. What a mean, ugly person. What on earth does she even see in him? I hope he treats his own kids (they had about 3 of them scattered around) better than he treated me.[/sub]

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I have had two experiences with “Chad” types. Keep your daughter as far away from that person as possible. Talk to his parents. Warn other parents in the neighborhood…do whatever you can.
People like him are bad news. I don’t think I’ll ever really get over what happened to me, and I would be devastated if the same thing happened to your little girl.