When did canned goods Net Wt change?

As a kid in the 1970s, I remember when new labelling laws came into effect. Among other things, all canned goods started displaying “Net Weight” or “drained weight” in the front of their labels. (Before that, they simply said “16 oz” or whatever.) I recall that the labeled weight of several products (in Atlanta stores, anyway) changed significantly, suggesting that they’d been playing fast and loose.

A few weeks ago, I noticed that a can of “store brand” lima beans had an asterisk next to the “Net wt” and after some hunting, I found that this 15.5 oz “net wt.” can only contained 9.75 oz of lima beans. I was extremely disappointed, partly because this (smaller local) chain usually sold a better quality of goods than most of the chains in our area, and partly because they were the only ones who consistently stocked “full cans” of lima beans, a family favorite, and did so at a reasonable price. “Oh well, I guess I know why they were so cheap now” I thought, and resolved to write a stern letter to the chain.

However, the following week, while making a three-bean salad (something I haven’t done in many years), I noticed that the proportions seemed off. I drained and weighed the green beans (from a “Big Three” national brand, with no asterisk or drained weight indicated on the label) and the 14.5 oz can only contained 8 oz. (By contrast, the asterisked store brand contained 9.75 oz) The undrained can was definitely visibly less full of beans than I recall, too.

What the heck? I’d always taken “Net weight” to mean “drained weight”, because, face it, none of us are really turning to Del Monte or Green Giant for canned water. If “net wt.” now means “product plus water” then what is “gross weight”? Product plus water plus can?

Is it possible the law changed? Did some lawyer successfully argue that “net wt.” wasn’t subject to the laws regulating the words “net weight”? (I’ve seen crazier things – and this now-ubiquitous abbreviation doesn’t save a single cent in printing and square millimeters of label real estate are hardly at a premium)

Fortunately, I prefer fresh or frozen, and only use a few canned vegetables, for specific purposes, but I still feel scammed. The big national brands are the worst offenders. There is NO way to tell how much product you’re actually getting. That store brand that so disappointed me was actually doing me a favor with its asterisk (and also put 10-20% more vegetables in its cans). I’ve noticed that less famous or local brands are more likely to have “drained weight” on the label.

Did I miss something that can savvy-shoppers have known for years? I’d noticed that canned veggies were far less popular in local stores in recent years. In many stores, they’ve gone gtom having a full aisle, to one side of an aisle, to maybe 20ft in one corner of an aisle – with a fairly small choice of veggies (e.g. when you discount the “veggie mixes” and varieties of beans, they really only stock around a dozen different “actual vegetables” in cans anymore (including the tomatoes, which get more space than the rest of the vegetables combined, but excluding the specialty/ethnic aisle – which I think is a real advance in the supermarket industry)

As far back as I can remember, net weight has always been the weight of everything except the packaging (can, box, whatever). I’ve never seen any product with “drained weight” (but then again, I don’t usually look that closely at these things).

I remember back in home ec (it was required, thankyouverymuch) in intermediate school (all the lazy call 'em “middle schools” these days) we were expressly told that net weight was the content less the packaging, but that if you check the order of the ingredients (which is by weight), you could often see if the water came before the item, or the item came before the water.

I agree with the others, “net weight” is the weight of the goods (including water) less the packaging.

As to sneaky, yes, they’ve slowly been upping the water and reducing the actual goods. As well, what used to be a 16oz can is now a 14.5oz can. Same price for 10% less product. Who says there’s no significant inflation? It’s just more carefully camouflaged than it used to be.

The sad thing is the 10% reduction in goods in the can represents a true 10% loss to us the consumer, yet it didn’t gain the manufacturer anywhere near 10% increased margin since the cost of the can and transport and labor and advertising and … probably didn’t decrease proportionally.

Here’s the US FTC definition of “net weight”, as well as lots of other interesting trivia on packaging labeling rules: http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=2547b81eb2563403ef92a29b8ab11e16&rgn=div5&view=text&node=16:1.0.1.5.56&idno=16#16:1.0.1.5.56.0.38.25. If that link fails, it’s 16 CFR 500.25, which any of several federal websites can retrieve for you.

So, how little of the product can there be? The sections of the code I read online didn’t even hint that there might be a limit to how low the product/water ratio might be.

Have You Noticed that the box package size and price remains the same but the net weight is periodiaclly reduced?
Now that’s a subtle but real scam too!

Thanks, that’s useful info.

I used a lot of canned beans this weekend (My family has become enamored with 3- or 4- bean salad, and we’ve gone through 3 large batches in 3 days), so I’ve opened and weighed the contents about 20 cans of various brands. It’s not much, in scientific terms, but it really thinned out the cabinet. [Safety tip: using the herb epazote with beans can help prevent a severe explosion hazard]

Two brands really seemed to push the edge. One was a Big 3 national brand, and the other was a store brand (from a gimmicky store that is overpriced but constantly has double/triple/quadruple coupons or other promotions) They had a scant 7.3 oz per “15 oz” can – Not even 50%, even after I subtract out the weight of salt! I guess they think no one will ever notice, and they’d plead “manufacturing variation” if anyone did. That’s pretty darn cynical. It’s bad enough to sell “equal parts beans and water”, but to cheat on even that?

On the other hand, the store that initially disappointed me (which I had previously respected) did indeed turn out to be much better than average, with 8-9.8 oz of food for 14-15 oz cans. Though I’ve long believed brands don’t matter much for canned foods [going back to the stencil-labelled generics from the late 70s that actually came off the same canning lines as the big brands), it seems brand may matter – but not the way Mad Ave would have you think: specialty and less known national brands did better than the big 3 in my relatively small sample.

Well, at least I can understand how we went through so much bean salad: there was only half as much as I thought I’d made.

I suppose that it’s just an extension of the baldly incorrect calorie counts and other nutritional info. The law doesn’t require the manufacturers to actually measure calories or nutrients; they can use any ‘published standard’ for the individual ingredients or a published recipe that is substantially the same (but not necessarily identical) even if the cookbook never directly measured it either. I’m guessing the companies know exactly which source has the juiciest figures. [“According to the Monmouth County Senior Society cookbook, our lemon meringue pie is just 100 calories a slice!”)

[Next time you’re in the store, check prepared foods containing spinach. I found a frozen spanakopita that couldn’t have had its listed iron content if it had been a block of solid spinach. I can only guess that hey used the published 1870 von Wolf figures for the iron content of spinach, which has been known to be wrong since the 1930s (von Wolf misplaced a decimal point) as reported by TJ Hamblin in the British Medical Journal in 1981. ]

I’ve been a careful consumer for decades, now, and I had NO IDEA that net weight is basically a bullshi number.

See a more recent article here, from Sept 2013 Consumer Reports:
Have some oranges with that liquid: Cans we opened held about 57% of the label’s claimed weight in solids

Once again, those creepy lobbyists in Washington succeeded in depriving consumers of the information needed to make good choices.

Del Monte is trading at $60.76 per share … consensus puts it at $70 per share by this time next year … seems like the lobbyists in Washington DC are doing a great job …

You could buy dried beans, then you would get what you pay for.

I’ve already got my black-eyed peas. :wink:

I’ll get the collard greens Saturday.

The one that annoys me most is vinegar. It used to be that 5% acidity was the standard, but now it’s crept down to 4%. With most products, it’s at least possible to just buy more, but with vinegar, the concentration is often important, and there’s no easy way to increase the concentration at home.

I know you’re late to the party, but this was talked about 11 years go farther upthread.

But you’ve got the timeline backwards. Back in the 1970s and before a “16 oz.” can contained 16 oz. of product, water, and can. The change back then in the 70s, was to not let them weight the can. So now “16 oz.” means 16 oz. of product and water, *not *including the can. So we’re improving, albeit very, very slowly.

If we ever elect another consumer-oriented Congress (Hint: it has to have very little vitamin R in it) then perhaps we can force manufacturers to display actual weights of actual product in addition to product plus water.

How would you write the regulations, though? It’s clear enough what’s meant by the “drained weight” of a can of beans, but what’s the “drained weight” of a can of broth? And I’ve seen recipes that call for a can of beans, fluid and all, so one can claim that the fluid in a can of beans has at least some value.

I’d take a slightly different tack than “drained weight”. Any canned food is manufactured in a pretty precisely controlled process. They know how many X gallons of water go into the recipe for Y quantity of finished product. So I’d require that pro-rata value be posted.

A 14.5 oz. can of soup could legitimately have 12 oz. of water in the recipe, or maybe only 4 oz. depending on whether it’s beef consommé or thick goopy split pea. Neither number is good or bad in and of itself.

What matters though is the comparison. If I’m buying canned split pea soup and one brand has 4 oz water and the other has 8, … well I know which one is “tick and zesty” and which is junk watered down to make a stated price point and profit margin.

OTOH, for consommé this particular number simply isn’t meaningful as a consumer differentiator. It’s simple enough to write the regs to require it, and simple enough for the manufacturer to compute it & print it. But I would not expect to make my consommé buying decisions based on it.

Once again, those creepy lobbyists in Washington succeeded in depriving consumers of the information needed to make good choices.

Yeah, Ok.

But it’s not like you’re not part of the equation. If you buy the stuff and you notice there’s not much in the can, then don’t buy it again. Find the brand that offers the best value. It’s not like shopping for food is one time deal. Pay attention to what you’re doing and you don’t need the government to do it for you.

Or maybe think about shopping the perimeter of the market instead of the aisles. You can’t get ripped off with water if you buy it fresh instead of in a can.

If you are buying water in the supermarket you are probably getting ripped off.

There was a move to use drained weight, but the canners opposed it on fairly reasonable grounds: each can has a different canned weight because the vegetables in them absorb different amounts of water, and that amount is unpredictable. Thus two cans of peas can vary by a couple of ounces in drained weight, even when the same weight of peas and same amount of water is put in.

Thus anyone who tested the drained weight could get different numbers than what was on the can. (There’s also the issue of how long you drain the contents.) It was proposed that canners take a bunch of cans and find an average, but that meant throwing out a lot of food.

So the idea never became a regulation.

Which brands are doing this? I have Heinz, Great Value (Walmart brand), and Tuscan Garden (not sure where I got that. Aldi? Target?) and they’re all 5%. ((And a Goya sherry vinegar at 6%. The others are distilled white or, in the case of Heinz, a distilled and an apple cider). I just want to know what brands to look out for.