I’ve actually never heard that one before… What region of the world are you from?
I’ve heard it fairly often in California - I usually hear the long version, though. “Too stupid to pour piss out of a boot even if the instructions were written on the heel”.
Ummmm, leaving “fat” out of my rant and I couldn’t have made my point…he was using his status of being overweight as a weapon…he knows it’s ** A VERY BAD THING ** to mention someone’s obeseness…His statement that he was going to inform the boss that I had mentioned his weight was the thrust of my rant…even if poorly written. As I said earlier as it seems it bears mentioning it again…had it been a skinny marathon runner who was being a work-food glutton, I would have called him an ASS and would have felt no qualms about it. The problem was this involved a “fat” over-eater.
yea, yea yea, I read your rant. And, part of it was
so, while you found it necessary to talk to him in the first place (which I still don’t understand), you brought up the issue of his weight in connection with your annoyance. And, frankly that’s the same fucking thing as you’ve done here. If it wasn’t part of your annoyance, then why did you mention it. And, if it was part of your problem with him, then he’s correct to throw it in your face to knock it off.
I didn’t see **any ** level of ‘oh, but I was genuinely worried about his health’ You saw a fat jerk and decided to add in the ‘fat’ part. Jerk is sufficient to cause annoyance. Like I pointed out, you didn’t find it necessary either here or to his face to add in other incidental descriptive phrases about him. So, we’re left to believe that you added in the ‘fat’ descriptor to enhance the level of annoyance.
All of your qualifications so far have only shown to me that the above assesment is true. this latest only enhances it BBJ
Actually, I think they do, and that would be Redboss’s point, I believe. The way the two rants were written, there was undue emphasis placed on the fact that the subjects of the rants were fat. Their fatness itself was part of the attack in both rants. I think Redboss felt, and I agree, was that the two rants may have been about specific individuals behaving badly, but that those individuals and their behavior were more offensive and disgusting to the ranters precisely because the individuals were fat. And he got that notion from the ranters’ own words.
Then you havent’ been reading kabbes’ posts.
I don’t know anyone who would read the word “bitch” or “slut” directed at someone else and identify with it. No one. Unless they did so with pride, as some (strange) women around here sometimes do with the word “bitch”. So I don’t know anyone who will be directly or indirectly insulted by it.
However, when people start slinging around insults like “fatty”, I and the majority of fat people I’ve ever known identify with it. And feel as though we are being insulted as well.
Pretty simple and straightforward, I don’t see what’s so hard to get.
And ** Redboss, ** thank you. But I think we do need to be crystal clear…describing someone as fat is simply a true description (assuming they are, of course.) Calling someone names like “fatty” or one of a thousand others, attacking them for it, making derisive remarks about their appearance or the many ways that their fat interferes with their ability to participate in life (a la BBJ’s recitation of her co-worker’s inability to cross the room without sweating) is rude and insulting and unacceptable because it ends up insulting more than the intended target.
This is about the word “slut”, and I’m fucking furious, I warn you.
In two recent threads, two pursed-mouth, peevish victorians detail their horrors of slutty people.
One recounts a banal story of sex in the workplace, where the man’s sexual appetite is inextricable from his irritating but trivial crime. No matter how often other Dopers suggest that his bad behavior is distinct from his promiscuity, she sticks to her guns: that awful political correctness prevents her from speaking her mind. He shouldn’t be slut.
The other whiny teen doesn’t like her room-mate’s brother. His greatest crime? Being slut, of course. Whingeing ensues.
And why am I so angry with these two trivial, tight-arsed virgins?
Because I love these boards, and have often gained strength from the community I have access to by posting here.
I have met a few Dopers in real life, and I have seen photos of many at the ancillary sites that this metropolis has in its orbit. And you know what?
Many, many of the finest posters here would call themselves (or more likely, be called by others) sluts. They screw around, sleep with almost anyone. If they’re men they may be lady-killers, if women, horny. They’re straight, gay or bi. Or, as those smug, holier than thou bores would say slut.
Yes, you two purse-mouthed, mirthless whingers. You call them slut, but there’s more than that. For you, slut doesn’t refer to sexual activity - it’s a moral choice. Your colleague, your room-mate are morally disgusting because they’re sluts, and, added nonchalantly, so indeed are all slutty people…
And that’s what makes me pale with anger, as I pound the keyboard much harder than usual. Your insult is so much worse because it is so casual.
It’s an off-hand assumption that none of us reading what you’ve written and posted in a public forum would of course be (earggh) slut, so we can all share your disgust. Slutty people are them, not us. Oh, you whine, why can’t I be free to say He’s a Slut. Nobody here will be offended, will they?
Yes they will.
Don’t use “slut” as a term of insult here!.
In case I didn’t make that clear,
Don’t use “slut” as a term of insult here!.
Get the message. There are so many far more interesting, funnier, wiser, kinder, smarter, more valuable Dopers here, who you slur when you use their sexual activity as a gibe.
Don’t come here to insult them to their face and then pretend that it’s about political correctness or the moral slackness of sluts.
And those adolescent boys who like to start threads on “but let’s face it - sluts are ugly”, and either aim at a Tom Green “but I’m successful because so many people hate me” bravado, or cover over the sneer with mock concern about health, and actuarial tables - quit it! Shut up!!
Let it be a warning - you’ll find me on your back, and I think perhaps many other Dopers, if you slight the promiscuous in future when I’m around.
Because the other thing that makes me wild is that these people that I respect so much, are being done over, repeatedly by so many others beside you, and even by themselves.
Of course there are health issues about excess sex, and “let’s face it”, adolescent men have been programmed by thousands of years of natural selection to prefer slender young bodies over mature fuller bodies. That’s about Nature wanting healthy babies.
And in our saner moments, we understand that what gets called slut in our lives is so dependent on the culture around us, that it’s laughable to assign any moral value to the frequency of sexual activity. It’s coitus - that’s it.
But I suspect that to many who post here, and whose words I read with pleasure, and whose names I look for and light up when I see them, I suspect that to them the word slut can sometimes be wounding. It can happen that the memories of insecurity and not belonging can be so primal and submerged that the Boards’ most reasoned and urbane wordsmiths can be brought undone.
If you use slut as an adjective of loathing here on these Boards, you are fouling these forums. That is, you are invited to a salon of the brightest, most creative and expressive people in the world, and you are sitting in a corner playing with yourself.
Because in the end, it is your genitals. It’s the worst form of self-loathing to be so publicly phobic of something that in fact means so little. It’s your own sluttiness you are hating you shrill, irritating whiners. Either the libido you fear you have now or the libido you fear will take over your mind, as you grow older and lose control.
And you’re not always going to be in control of your body, and you are very likely, one day, to screw more than you want to. And you have so little self esteem to start with, that you’ll be truly fucked.
Even the best are scarred. I have a sad memory of meeting a lovely woman a few years ago through my work. We had only ever spoken on the phone, and were to catch up at a crowded coffee shop. I said “Well you’ll know me because I have a moustache” and she said “Well you’ll know me because I’ll be the horniest person in the room”. We met successfully, sorted our business and then stayed to have lunch. We hit it off so well that we talked for two and a half hours. And I kept thinking, you have beautiful hair, a vivacious sweet face, you’re well-groomed, wearing unusual clothes and jewelry, you’re a wonderful human being, and the thought that you came in here with was that you were going to be the horniest person in the room. Of course she wasn’t. Nowhere near. Except in her head, I suppose.
So that’s the manifesto, then. You’re not just insulting my friends, you’re hurting them where they have the least resilience.
In future, you do it at your peril. Stay off the boards if you can’t control yourselves and leaf through Penthouse Forum instead.
“Jeez, look at Callista - she’s such a slut!”
"Yeah, she’s been going downhill since she French kissed Bon Jovi. Swapping spit that’ll do it to ya - ya never lose that primal urge.
"God, I miss Xaiver Hollander - those last stories by her were really steamy, weren’t they?
Go and get laid, you insulting weaselly puritans.
A 'la this lovely specimen thinks he’s PROTECTED from anyone mentioning his weight…that is utter bullshit. Re the sweating and other descriptions…he does those things but makes fun of others when they do the same things…sorry if I didn’t make this clear–i.e., a paralegal came puffing up the stairs the other day, she’s 50ish and just not in stellar shape–who the fuck is–but this ass decides to make fun of her re being out of shape. He is in the same fucking boat. He will jump right in when discussing someone’s weight.
Other than the ADA for people with disbility/weight issues, there is no fucking law that says you cannot mention somone is overweight, there is no law saying that obese people are protected. Fuck him if I mention weight in a roundabout way. I would never call him “fatty” or “fat” or anything like that to his face or behind his back. Had I called him such maybe y’all could feel justified–omigod she’s “weight-prejudiced” well, I’m not other than the fact that because you are bigger does not give you the right to take and eat more than your share of free-range office food.
I asked my secretary if she would have said anything to this guy if he had been a skinny marathin runner…her answer “I would have told him to kiss my butt and to give me the damn donuts since I eat Ramen for lunch!”
Cracked me up!
you’re still not getting it obviously.
You keep on emphasizing that you’d done the same thing had the guy been skinny. Untrue. 'cause you wouldn’t have included the tag line "you sure don’t need to eat anymore ’ or whatever the fuck you said.
It was rude and unnecessary.
You don’t have to keep on giving examples why he’s a jerk. What you might want to consider is why you decided to join his ranks.
So, next time he comments on some one else’s physical limitations, some one who hasn’t done the same goddamn thing could say to him “you know, it’s inappropriate , unkind, rude and offensive for you to make comments about other people’s infirmaties”.
Since you’ve already joined his ranks and been the one commenting, it shouldn’t be you to make the comment.
In short: He seems to be a class A jerk, in many ways. It’s perfectly appropriate to let class A jerks know that their behavior is inappropriate, unkind, inconsiderate, rude, offensive, not good for work place.
Comments from either you or him about other peoples infirmaties, limitations, physical characteristics etc belong in the same fucking category of rude, unkind, inconsiderate, offensive, inappropriate, not good work place behavior.
And the more you keep on insisting, but he’s really a jerk and he’s really fat etc. the more you’re making it clear that the only fucking difference between the two is he seems to have done jerky things more often than you (per your reporting).
Hi, LL. I grew up in San Antonio, and while that wasn’t the most common way to say someone had overdrawn their smarts account, it was still pretty popular.
I don’t see the words fat, thin, gargantuan, or any references to weight in this sentence. The statement was about greed more than anything else. You are the one who assigned the “fat” connotation to it, simply because the man she was speaking to was overweight. If she had not mentioned he was fat, this would have gone unnoticed by everyone, and thought of as a comment on his avarice instead of his weight, because(hold on here) THE QUOTE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WEIGHT! You assigned the meaning to it, and yet you are angry about what you decided it meant.
The word “fag” also has two meanings. When* I call people “fags” I’m calling them a cigarette, as cigarettes are undesirable to me…right…:rolleyes:
It doesn’t matter which meaning you meant, it’s still not good to call someone a fag or a slut and mean it as an insult**. Especially when you’re complaining about them using the word fat as an insult, as slut or fag are both miles ahead of fat on the slur list for me. Someone already said “you can’t have your cake and eat it too”, you can’t tell someone not to insult you while slurring them in the same breath. Not only does it make your argument weaker, but makes you look a tad foolish.
I’m rambling and prolly outgunned in this argument, so I’ll just head back to lurking…
*Just making it clear so no one jumps on my case for this one: I both smoke and refrain from calling people “fags”. I’m using it as an example, and mean no slight to anyone.
**Of course even if you don’t mean it to be an insult and the person is offended, it’s probably a good idea to apologize and explain what your meaning was for it. But getting angry at the word “niggardly” or likewise would just be the offended party freaking out over nothing, eh?
DarkPrince - you’re wrong. The inference comes from none other than BBJ herself, in her OP (as a matter of fact, the very words following those I clipped) here’s more of that quote
Her intent was clear. She meant it as a fucking insult and felt he deserved it
my comments stand.
**
Oooooo. I’ll be careful.
Who the hell do you think you are attacking peevish Victorians like that?
I can’t beleive you said that you big fat stupid slut!!
**
::Hit the music!::
Ohhhhhhhhhh!
**
Ohhhhhhhhhh!
John Beckwld is a slut. He’s a big bad slut. He’s the biggest slut in the whole wide world!
He’s a big fat slut. He’s a stupid slut! He’s a slut to all the boys and girls.
On Mondays he’s a slut. On Tuesday’s he’s a slut. On Wednesday’s and Thursday’s he’s a slut!
I really mean it!
Oh yeah!
John Beckwld!
He’s a big bad dirty SSSSSLLLLLUUUUUTTTTT!
yeah,
Just don’t be making fun of my baldness.
You know, I really don’t understand why some people are having so much trouble understanding Redboss’ point. It seems so simple and plain to me.
He is not complaining that someone is being insulting, he is complaining that the insults, by their nature, insult people who are not the intended target of the insult.
Slut, bitch, whore, asshole, fuckface, skidmark, dickhead, motherfucker, shmuck, etc. are not insults which refer to a common, harmless characteristic shared by a good percentage, even a majority of the people on this board and in the world at large (and importantly, a characteristic with shame attached to it) , and therefore using these insults towards one or two people specifically does NOT inadvertently insult half the people reading it, it insults the people it was intended to insult.
This isn’t a rant about people being insulting in general. Redboss (obviously!) isn’t making the case no one should insult anyone. He’s pissed off because insulting ONE fat person ** about their weight ** insults ** all people who share that characteristic ** (whether said people choose to feel the insult or not, ** mouthbreather ** .)
This distinction really isn’t complicated, people.
If you still can’t get it, play a game with me:
Pretend, if you are male, that BEING male is a matter about which you are unhappy and probably ashamed, mostly because the culture in which you live pounds you over the head every day with the idea that because you are male, you are to be shunned, made fun of, rejected at work and in love, degraded and humiliated publicly, etc.
Then you read people on a message board making shitty remarks about other people who piss them off who are male, and they make shitty remarks * about their maleness. * Do you really think you are going to fail to be personally insulted by those remarks? They aren’t going to tweak your sensitivity strings?
Think about it.
Stoid:
Motherfucker is insulting to people with Oedipal complexes, lots of women find “bitch” offensive, “dickhead” is offensive to bald people, “slut and whore” are offensive to many women in general, as their sexist remarks.
In my office you might get away with calling a heavy person “fat,” but “bitch whore and slut” will get you fired for sexual harassment in today’s environment. They’re much stronger than slut.
Ain’t nothing special about “fat,” that gives you protected status.
At least you have the possibility of doing something about your weight.
I am balding and I have severely scarred hands, and I get made fun of for both of them on occasion.
Being “Lobsterboy” I didn’t share the options that you have.
I used to hate it when other kids made fun of my hands, and girls went “iiccck!” when they thought I couldn’t hear.
Then I fucking grew up, stopped worrying about it, and didn’t let it bother me, and when I stopped giving people a reaction they eventually stopped doing it, and when they did, they just made themselves look stupid, small and mean.
You can’t change anybody else, and you choose to be offended when you want to. Nobody else makes you do it.
If you’re happy being fat, be fat. If you’re not, take a shot at changing it. In either case there’s no money in worrying what anybody wants to think or say about it.
It’s a free world. Others will say and do as they please, so you might as well have another ding-dong and put a smile on.
Wring-Aye, I didn’t mean to say that BBJ wasn’t being an asshole in the other post you quoted, just that from the small phrase, there was no mention of weight. I had read the original thread, and got from it that HE had come to the conclusion that her insult was about weight. Maybe I’m wrong, if so, I’m just an idiot.
Stoid-Yes yes yes, we all know it’s okay to insult people if no others are affected. 
**
Last time I checked, the word slut is fairly offensive to women. At my college, if enough people complain about hearing you say slut you can get kicked out. Thus so, I’d guess it’s prolly offensive to more than the person you’re calling it. If it matters at all, it bugs me to hell when I hear slut thrown around, as I put it on the same level with fag or nigger, and it’s pretty sad to see a place proclaiming it’s fighting ignorance to be okay with this sort of thing.
Hardly. I’m just making the distinction between insults directed and landing on one person you intend to insult, and insults that spray all over the place.
I’m a woman, in a family of all women, with a whole bunch of women friends. And it has never been my observation or experience that hearing someone call a specific woman a slut felt personal to me or any women I know. Of course, I don’t hear people calling other people “slut” much at all, except around here. The same can hardly be said for insulting remarks about fat.
Do you know alot of people who call other people slut? Perhaps you know people who use it as a generic term for all women? Because THAT would be offensive, because THAT is insulting a whole group. But I find it hard to believe that your school has a policy in place because so many people are calling other people sluts.
Actually, I have heard people call each other sluts… friendly women teasing each other.
stoid
I forgot…I get offended when a person calls a woman a slut because she’s sexually free. That annoys me because it is a bullshit double standard.
But I’ve certainly known some seriously slutty women in my life that deserved to be called same, and I sure wouldn’t take it as a personal slam against me. (And I say that as a sexually free woman).
Nah, almost no one calls each other a slut here(unless their good friends as you said) 'cause it will get you in a whole ton of trouble. If the person is offended and you’re an ass about it, or if you say it enough and a lot of people complain, you get put up in front of a board consisting of your fellow students and one faculty arbiter. If they decide so, you can get put on probation, or even(rarely, only once ever I think) kicked out if the charge is harsh enough. Blah blah blah. Just because you don’t take offense to someone else being called a slut doesn’t mean others around you feel the same, and slut is FAR worse of an insult than fat imho.
Thankyou, Redboss, for making a stand. I totally agree with what you say.
P.S. congrats on making it to 1001!