Where have all the hobbyists gone?

Always a bit of a conundrum and subject of discussion / dispute – how much are hobbies about “the thrill of the chase”, and how much are they about other and different things? Re the stamp-collecting scene as mentioned – I remember in my collecting days (pre-Internet, but stamp dealers operated by snail-mail), fellow-enthusiasts opining that buying particularly desired items from a dealer, was “cheating” – you ought to rely entirely on chance, and the “lottery” of possible trading between fellow-fans. That approach stuck me as crazily purist and deliberately-making-things-difficult; but one can sort of see where its proponents are coming from. Maybe, do wet-wishy-washy-anything-goes-tolerant-compromise-a-bit-this-a-bit-that stuff – hoping that the philatelic jihadists will confine their disapproval, to mere words…

The ease of starting a blog has made it possible for people unable to string two coherent sentences together to make their swing at becoming the next Matt Drudge. Approximately 9,999 out of any 10k are fooling themselves badly.

As much as I agree with the last part, I don’t think blogs do anything except provide a sea of inanity in which the commercial sites look appealing.

Yes. In many parts of the world the concept of a “hobby”–something that you do simply to fill free time–doesn’t really exist. As for golf, however, I don’t see how the OP can say it’s disappearing. As far as I can tell, golf courses are as busy as they’ve always been.

I think you need to distinguish activities that people do simply because they enjoy the act of doing them (e.g., golf), and those that people do really in order to be able to talk about them with others, (e.g., collections), which are more like emblematic rituals.

Plus Sean Bean did the voiceover for the trailer. This isn’t some little ‘one dude programmed this at home’ kind of game.

(My own hobbies include homebrewing, knitting, occasional cross-stitching, and cooking.)

With respect – I don’t know, I feel that it’s a big mixture, depending on the individual: whatever the activity, some just enjoy the act of doing it – some like talking about it with fellow-addicts – and with assorted “intermediate shades”.

I would opine that a good many (widest-range) hobbyists, are “solitaries” who just want to do the thing, themselves – and have no interest in sharing about it, whether with, as above, fellow-addicts, or with “innocent bystanders”. Citing a pursuit of mine, and with which I’m acquainted: I have the impression that a good many British railway enthusiasts are, at least re their hobby, misanthropic loners to the point that they’d make Sheldon Cooper look like a social butterfly.

I think collecting is still going on at the same levels, or even more than before, it’s just all digital.

I collect comic books and Broadway recordings. Something rare? I’ll take a scan, thx.

Same with music. Even though there’s a lot of music still only available as pressed CDs, same with books, same with TV, that divide is shrinking every year. Same with video game cartridges vs emulators.

Cool stamps? A digital picture will do.

YouTube videos of rare tapes? In storage on a hard drive.

Insects? How about a 3D model?

Trains? As Ferret Herder said.

My disposable income didn’t go into a boat or a jetski or a model train, it went into a computer. But same difference.

I wonder if it is also how the Hobby itself is spread.

Social, active hobbies seem to be much more resilient to solitary ones. Someone invited my friend to play a game of paintball with him one weekend, and he got hooked. He in turn invited his brother-in-law, and before he knew it they had a team built up of acquaintances, friends and relatives. The social aspect of it allowed it to propigate, and by having a group of people actively willing to help a newbie, they would support people that might have thought “I have the time but don’t have the money for a gun/paintballs/mask/etc”. A lot of newbies started out with equipment their friends loaned them; A person would by Baby’s First Paintball gun, but over time save up for “Uber Elite Paintball Gun”. The first gun would be loaned/given to newbies to help them get into it.

I don’t see people getting into Stamp or Coin collecting the same way. Since they’re not as social, you’re not interacting with other people as much. I know that some people pick hobbies like this specirfically becuase they don’t have to deal with people very much :stuck_out_tongue: . But it doesn’t help them spread or even maintain their numbers over hobbies that involve interacting with other people regularly.

Changing demographics also affect hobbies. Due to differences in birth rates, immigration, and geography, over time in the US the average age of caucasians will start getting higher, while a greater proportion of younger people will be people of color. What was popular with primarily white kids in the 1950’s might not be popular with primarily Latino kids in the 2020’s.

What a peculiar criticism of those particular hobbies. The rest of the world doesn’t care if I complete a marathon or bowl a strike or buy a piece of carnival glass or Action Comics #1 or that wright brothers stamp with the plane upside down either. How does the fact that the rest of the world doesn’t care make cooking or blogging different from any hobby ever?

I mean, the entire point of a hobby is personal enjoyment. I’m not aware of anyone who does, say, model airplanes for the vast impact it has on the world.

Just a single data point: I got heavily into wooden model ship building. Got several kits, started a build from scratch based on a plan made for modellers, got in touch with the Maritime Museum in Greenwich to get copies of the actual dockyard draughts for another build, built a Kon-Tiki in a lightbulb just for fun…

I was in my 20s, and at any given point was either unemployed, a student with financial support, and/or working part-time, as well as being unmarried. From forums and such it seemed that virtually all other modelers were retired.

Now I’m 30, with a full-time job with a long and stressful commute, and responsibilities at home. I’ve tried to pull out my equipment and materials several times on a weekend, but don’t even find time to get everything organised and remember where I left off to actually get started.

So: lack of time, and a surplus of responsibilities that keep me from choosing how to spend my non-working non-commuting time, has forced me out of my hobby.

(for now!)

I find that ineffably sad.

That people can create, play with, and give away train pieces without needing to take up an entire basement? I don’t.

Forgot one - even video gaming is changing with recent years. Thanks to companies like Steam and GOG (among others), I can play video games now that had never been able to be run on a modern computer for years, but are packaged up nicely to be compatible with today’s computer hardware. And I can find many old favorites just by firing up an Internet browser, rather than having to scour computer and electronics stores, hoping for some forgotten classic stuck at the bottom of a bargain bin. I don’t even need to own the physical copies.

Why? How is it different to people playing flight simulators?

I’ve used MS Train Simulator and a Japanese one called BSE for over a decade. I don’t have the time, money, talent, or space to do modelling as I’d like to, and this is arguably better anyway. The software is old and buggy now (but new ones are being developed), but I think I spent a total of A$35 on it, in about 2003, and nothing since then. There is a huge amount of user-developed software, and I can enjoy routes and trains familiar to me from my home city or something exotic from the other side of the world, switching between in moments, as the whim takes me. The attraction to me, is that rather than seeing a little plastic train whirring around an oval, I can immerse myself in many hundreds of kilometres of routes with realistic scenery, realistic geometry (those sharp curves with trains chasing their tails are a bit of a deal breaker for modelling to me), and realistic physics. Sometimes, I might enjoy keeping on top of the demands of a steam locomotive, or after a shitty day at work, I might unwind and focus by driving a virtual 5000 ton freighter down a mountain pass, keeping three different braking systems under control, “feeling” the undulating grades of the line, etc.

Like most of the broader hobby (maybe British anorak wearers with notebooks aside), it’s surprisingly social. I’m on multiple rail fora (I run one with several hundred members), multiple Facebook groups, I’ve volunteered on heritage railways, enjoyed steam tours, gone for “cab rides” on commuter trains with driver friends, and just hung out and had beers with like-minded people. The internet has been a boon for this hobby.

Right, actually I didn’t phrase that right, because the involvement of others is not necessary. What I wanted to point out is that the physical object itself is not necessarily the appeal (though it can be, and often acquires appeal through reification), but rather its currency, and that can happen only through some kind of knowledge of how the object came into being, and its place in a larger order. This can come about by talking with others, or simply be viewing a commerical that says, “Collect 'em all!” In any case, the difference between a collector and a hoarder is this notion of currency.

[QUOTE=LibrarySpy]
Cool stamps? A digital picture will do.
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No, I don’t think it will do at all. The whole point of collecting things is to collect them. The process of getting the object is what makes it valuable, (along with the rituals ones does with the object after acquiring it). Fundamentally people don’t collect stamps because the pictures on them are beautiful (though they do acquire beauty as objects of collection, as I mentioned above).

“Social versus solitary” – a significant distinction. I have the impression (in this, just my vague personal “take” – I can give no cites, and am open to being told that I’m pulling drivel out of my arsehole) – that demographics have a good deal to do with this whole thing. Solitary, “nerdish” hobbies – say, collecting cards of various kinds, stamps, coins, banknotes; railway enthusiasm; model-making; bibliophily; birdwatching, maybe – would seem rather the preserve of white, mainly Protestant or “Protestant-descended” folk. Other cultures tend to have little use for such stuff, and to place much more value on people’s interacting with each other / serving God / performing good works. Members of such cultures are overall not forbidden on pain of death, from indulging in solitary hobbies – and there will be mavericks who will do what they crave to do, let the consequences be what they may – but such mavericks are in the main, few in number.

(Modern electronic hobbies / pastimes are, I’ll admit, a different ballgame.)

Because, replacing the hobby of actually building a physical model with a computer simulation just seems pathetic. Not that computer simulations can’t be fun and engaging, it’s just that I don’t see where any of the properties that make a hobby like model trains fun - the craftsmanship, modeling skill, creativity, attention to detail, and maybe most importantly, the maintenance required to keep a physical model running - exist in a computer simulation.

It’s the difference between sculpting in clay and 3D computer modeling, or simulating an electronic circuit and actually soldering one.

I struggle with this myself a bit, since I used to have a color darkroom, and now shoot everything digitally. I think digital is easier, and might be capable of better results, but it’s not as much fun!

Can you recommend / put me in touch with, any? Maybe I’m too fixated on Brit railfans’ strong misanthropic / hermit-type tendency; but I’ve never come upon any such (one possible not-discussion-forum-in-so-many words, excepted), not for want of seeking.

Aaah, OK. I think those are distinct different hobbies. Or at least, different mindsets. Many (but by no means all) people who build elaborate models have little or no interest in operating them, but sell them, and go on to the challenge of building the next one. With Train Sim it’s the same: I know a lot of folks very talented in digital 3D modelling who love building Train Sim routes, but again, rarely use them. I’ve dabbled in building, but never had the spare time to get through most of the learning curve, so remain a simple user of other folks’ creativity.

I can, but they’re Australian-focused. If that’s OK, try Railpage Australia (it does have a small international component), as it’s the biggest one.

I learned this when I married a woman that is not white:

When you grow up, you are exposed to things that often determine your interests when you are older. Back in 1985, when going out to eat at a pizzar parlor, my dad taught me how to play Pac-Man when I was 5 years old. When I was six, I got a Nintendo for Christmas. I started playing video games and computers at a young age, and my interest grew and expanded from there.

In contrast, my wife was living in Mexico when she was 5 at the time. They didn’t go out for pizza, there weren’t Pac-Man cabinets in their tiny little town in Michoacan. They played soccer and dreamed of wearing nice shoes that wouldn’t fall apart after a month. As such, as an adult, my wife enjoys clothes and shoe shopping, and ‘collecting’ shoes. When I naively asked why she never got into video games, she pointed out that growing up they were just too poor and too busy for such pastimes. As an adult she never had the nostalgia I did of going to a pizza place/movie theater/etc and playing arcade games; the appeal just wasn’t there.

Many of the hobbies I have my wife sees as stereotypically ‘white people hobbies’. Many of them are based on the fact that someone that came from a position of privlege will be more likely to have the time and money to pursue geeky hobbies. For others, its simply cultural; some cultures are simply going to be more interested spending their time playing a pickup game of soccer rather than LARPing a game of Vampire: The masquerade in the park. :stuck_out_tongue:

Yeah, it’s funny. I definitely fit the white, protestant, Anglo-Saxon male criterion, and ten years ago, the Asian population of this already-very-Asian-by-then city would have regarded railway enthusiasm as about on a par with staring at a wall, for enjoyment. However, these people were first generation migrants, had escaped the horrors of war, and just wanted to knuckle down and work hard. These days, there are a lot of Asian railfans - they are the children of that first generation: born locally, and have been exposed to different things as young people.

By the way, I mentioned upthread that Australia and the UK seem to be the biggest countries for the rail hobby. That’s still true, but maybe the Catholics are finally getting in on the act - it seems to be huge in South America, of all places.