With respect, to say that fish are not conscious seems ridiculous to me. Fish show fear, they can problem solve and learn how to avoid traps - they can even get out of them.
We personally owned a Siamese Fighting Fish a few years ago and my husband always fed him his shrimp. (His name was Samurai, but we all called him Sam.)
As it happened, my husband had to go away for a few days to record with his band in a city and I was left to feed Sam. This (according to you) unconscious fish SULKED and would not eat what I offered him. My husband always used a teaspoon and Sam would come and eat the shrimp from the spoon. When I put the spoon where he was used to eating from it, he went to the far corner of his tank and literally SULKED. :rolleyes: He didn’t eat a morsel for the three days my husband was away and it’s not as if I was a stranger to him. He resumed his normal eating pattern when My husband resumed feeding him.
A couple of things. I’m not sure where the stories of her crying or reacting to her parents came from. My experience is that many things circulated on the internet that get accepted as true turn out to be incorrect when you check them out. Regardless let’s talk about the sanctity of life.
It seems to me believing in the sanctity of life should have something to do with the quality of life and the realistic choices faced in a certain situation. It can be an act of love to let someone go rather than have them linger in body with no chance of recovery. I have some up close and personal experience with this.
I can’t understand why people who believe in an afterlife would consider it murder to let someone go and let nature take it’s course.
I have no citation other than the videos we all watched many times on TV. Even the Pope commented on them several times, so we know that the broadcasts did reach Rome.
I was asked for my opinion and I’ve given it. The consciousness of fish and goats has little to do with Terry Shiavo and I have no wish to ‘argue’ on their behalf.
You should really rethink your signoff. I have this mental image of someone sitting at her computer with her mouth hanging open in stark surprise every time she reads a new post. Just FYI.
Sorry, grasshopper, but regardless of what you yourself think - Sam SULKED! My grandmother’s dog used to sulk every day when she went to work. Animals aren’t stupid or unconscious. Even the aforementioned carp were cognizant enough to differentiate between the human who fed them and strangers. I don’t think we all have our logic caps on tonight. Of course, that’s just my opinion.
Jesse, you sound like a nice enough person, but GD is for people who are willing to change their minds. “That’s my opinion” is best reserved for IMHO, not GD.
Not necessary to prove it, I experienced it. As for your misinterpretation of my experience I can only say, you weren’t there, you couldn’t know anything about it.
You are just engaged in wishful thinking, nothing more.
Ah, quandry time - to whom should I listen? I was roasted for stating anything as ‘fact,’ substantiated or not, and was told I should rather give my opinion.
If I were a Tylenol-taking person…
Love - Jess.
Edited to add: I do change my mind, or at least my perspective, and that’s why I spend time on forums like this one. Just so you know.
You weren’t roasted, you were asked to give evidence for unsubstantiated statements, and you failed to. Um, I’m not sure I’ve seen a substantiated one from you actually. That’s the issue. This is a debate forum, posting ‘That’s my opinion’, and then defending it as the truth doesn’t really work here. If you have an opinion or belief, fine, just don’t try to pass it off as anything else. If you want to argue fact, then you’re going to have to come up with more than ‘That’s my opinion’ or your argument won’t hold any weight. When people ask for cites, they aren’t being mean or calling you a liar, they’re actually asking for you to back up your assertion with something so we can determine if your argument is valid. Otherwise, the only basis we have for doing so is ‘Jesse Leigh said it’.
Nothing wrong with opinions in GD if you’re willing to acknowledge them as such. If you present something as factual the tradition is that you provide some evidence that it’s true if someone asks for a cite. An article or something. The source is considered. Scholastic sources are better than someone’s blog.
Of course you can choose to not provide a cite. Some do. If that’s the case then everything you say gets relegated to the opinion category.
Yes, I know, thank you. I endeavor to provide links to source material when I state something as fact. (I ask the people on my own forum to do the same.) Not every link I’ve provided has satisfied all, but… such is the nature of debate since deciding who is an authority on any given subject is oftentimes a matter of perspective and opinion - unfortunately.
I have been posting here for years, and never seen anyone change their mind about anything. It is also true that most posters never provide a cite. I agree with your posts, all life is sacred, and Terry had a loving family ready, willing, and able to care for her with no expense to her cheating husband. The decision was most unfortunate for all, no one won in the end. This case will remain as a “what not to do” example for many years.
I know that life goes on after death, but it is not our judgement to take another’s life. Keep up the good posting. By the way “agape” is a word understood by all. At least all the people I know. I wouldn’t stop using it on the word of a stranger.
Everybody knows the videos existed, the question is what the videos meant. Your assertions that they prove she was conscious would be more credible if you backed them up. I don’t remember any video where she cried on being told her tube was going to be removed. I do remember a tape where she supposedly tracked a balloon with her eyes, even though postmortem testing of her brain showed she was blind.
but regardless of what you yourself think - Sam SULKED! My grandmother’s dog used to sulk every day when she went to work. Animals aren’t stupid or unconscious. Even the aforementioned carp were cognizant enough to differentiate between the human who fed them and strangers. I don’t think we all have our logic caps on tonight. Of course, that’s just my opinion.
- Jess.