We have the others versions(who is leaving, who isn’t leaving but is staying reluctantly), so why not?
I think it may be good. Toothless personal attacks by people hiding behind a keyboard have never really turned my crank. People who demand the right to tell someone to bite it, and say it is pointless to exist in a world where you can’t is just true unbearable oppression, seem non beneficial
Hey, I figure its a good chance to seperate some of the chaff. The folks who think they are losing a piece of themselves because they can’t tell someone off anonymously… ehhh good ridance, we are bored with your Drama games.
This will get ugly quickly, but I’m indifferent to the new rules. I never understood why people got so worked up that someone who wrote a book wanted to use a message board created from his column to promote the book. I never understood people who let so much of their identity be caught up in an anonymous message board and I never understood the need to declare that they were leaving a message board instead of just leaving.
Here’s why the new rules are a bad idea. Read this carefully, and when you’re done smack yourself in the head 3 times. I guarantee* you will feel better.
The new rules have alienated hundreds of posters. You may not care, but when your business model depends on postings and viewings, it’s not a good thing to shit all over your customers.
The new rules have caused 2 Pit mods to leave. They were 2 of the best mods around, and they left as a direct result of these new rules.
Because of the new rules, 2 new boards have been created – both of which are taking lots of posters, posts, and viewings away from this board.
The new rules have caused lots of turmoil in a place that was running smoothly. They have created a rift between posters and mods (who frankly don’t seem to know what rules to enforce and how), and unnecessarily turned this place quite sour.
Now, whether or not you personally feel better because of the new rules, it does not matter. They are a bad idea, and even TPTB are starting to get the picture. I hope you can too.
*Guarantee void in Alabama and Mississippi.
It is understandable that you may not have read all of the posts about the new rules. But the OP makes it clear that you have not even read or understood the rules as they were posted. It’s one post, not too hard to do.
My reading is that even the supporters of the new rules regard them as a regrettable necessity rather than a cause for celebration. Perhaps I am wrong and somewhere there are Dopers dancing in the streets at the news. But I doubt it.
I think there is a backlash to the backlash. I know I am tired of the noise and the histrionics of some of the complainers and are waiting for those who are going to go, to go. I think it would be good to bring in some new blood and break up the cliques (until new ones form).
I respectfully disagree. I think you have dressed up a subjective opinion as an objective fact. By all means share your opinion as to why you think the new rules are a bad idea. It’s an opinion many will share, and many will not. But to say ‘are a bad idea’, as if this is a fact, doesn’t help anything.
I doubt you have really counted the total, and I think this is an exaggeration. I haven’t counted either, but my view is that the rules have disaffected about 50-75 posters at most, led by a particularly vocal dozen or couple of dozen. The active membership runs to at least a couple of thousand, so everyone else either supports the new rules or doesn’t care much either way.
You are also being rather selective. Yes, some Dopers dislike the new rules. It is equally true to say that some Dopers actually prefer the new rules, and that some people who come along in future will actually find the place more receptive and welcoming under the new rules than they would have done under the old. It’s a little unfair to only count one side of the balance sheet.
Again, I respectfully suggest this is only presenting one side of the argument. Here’s my version: when your business model depends on postings and viewings, it makes perfect sense to introduce rules intended to cut down on swearing and personal abuse, and to try to encourage a more civil and considered tone all round, so that a greater percentage of people will consider signing up and joining in. Personally, I also think it’s great to encourage people to express their views, even their very strong feelings, in language that remains respectful to other people. Those who choose not to do so, choose not to do so. Those who cannot do so, in my opinion, degrade the quality of the Dope and are no great loss to it. In this context, your chosen metaphor speaks volumes.
I also wonder, as a matter of curiosity, if you are in a position to lecture others on what constitutes a good business model. Is it the case that you run a business as large as the business that hosts the Straight Dope, and have done so for an equal length of time, and with equal success? If so, congratulations. This lends some weight to your argument. If not, what makes you think you are in a position to lecture others on ‘business models’?
‘Best’ is another subjective term. ‘Best’ in your opinion may not be ‘best’ in mine. Also, I could be wrong about this, but I believe at least one of the Moderators you refer to sought to make it clear that he did not regard his decision as a direct consequence of the new rules.
I think this is a sweeping assertion based on a false dichotomy. The vast majority of those who have visited the new boards have said they intend to remain here as well. And why not? It does not have to be either/or. They can participate here, to enjoy the qualities and character of the SDMB, and they can enjoy the new boards as well.
I think it would be equally accurate to say the new rules didn’t cause any turmoil at all, but the strident protests and howls of indignation, from a small but loud number of Dopers, gave rise to what you might call ‘turmoil’, but what I call ‘an extended tantrum’. Children throw tantrums when they don’t get their own way. Adults can, and should, be capable of discussing disagreements and settling disputes in other ways. I don’t think this message board is the poorer if children prone to temper tantrums decide to go elsewhere.
That’s strange, because I’m a poster, and there’s no rift between me and the Moderators.
‘Seem’ to whom? To you? Maybe. But the fact that your overview and comprehension may be limited does not, in and of itself, prove that the Mods are either incompetent or floundering. I think they’re doing a fine job.
You know, if you repeat an opinion, it doesn’t magically transform into a fact.
Considering how much bitching and moaning there’s been going on here both before and after the new pit rules went into effect, I would take issue with the idea that “things were running smoothly.”
Let’s face facts; the Straight Dope was never about free speech and never was. You want an unmoderated message board; to be able to say anything you want and it just ain’t gonna happen. I’ve been there; it’s hell. It doesn’t work. And I agree with what someone said in another thread that we can chew and nitpick and tear apart things so much that they become meaningless. I don’t think the rules that have been laid down are particularly difficult to understand or follow. We’re just afraid of the mods having to make judgement calls which, frankly, is what the job was all about anyway. Sometimes they make good judgements; sometimes they dont. But love it or not, that’s their call. Deal with it.
*From another thread : *
I wince every time I read a statement like that. The older I get, the more I realize that people who think of themselves as such usually are not. I can only point to a small handful of posters who have the art of the insult down to a feathered edge; sadly, the rest are just kidding themselves. It doesn’t take much more than a five-year old intelligence to call someone a jerk. Or worse.
I’m reminded of a story that may be apocryphal and was told by Mark Twain and that I’m probably misquoting. It seemed his wife, Olivia, didn’t like the idea that he was cynical and used bad language and like to find clever ways to insult his enemies. So one day, she met him at home and started using every foul word she could think of in every possible way she could. Twain just stood there and listened to it for awhile and then said “Okay …you know the words, you just don’t know the music.”
As Dopers, we’ve fallen so in love with the words, we’ve forgotten the music.
I will stand up and say that I rejoice in the new Rules. As a human being acting as moderator, I certainly make mistakes from time to time. I consider myself open to criticism and I have reversed my decision in several instance, when presented with reasonable argument and polite discussion. However, that’s not what always happens. Far more often, what happened was that someone unhappy with my decision would start a Pit thread, telling me to fuck off, or making nasty remarks about my parentage. I don’t read such threads, and if they do come to my attention, my reaction is usually significantly colored by the insults; the main point (disagreement about a decision) is lost in the shouting and ranting.
So, I think this is a very favorable rules change that will produce more fairness in moderating and a better ability to review (and possibly reverse) moderator decisions. (Some of us have been asking for this on and off for a while, while others have felt that the Pit was the better place for people to vent. I think it probably is a better place if all one wants to do is vent; if one wants constructive action, ATMB will be far more productive.)
I’m right with you on this one. I don’t want to say “good riddance” to the folks that really dislike the rules and choose to go somewhere else, because that’s not accurace.
I have never been a fan of aggressive and insulting language in any context, so the Pit is for the most part an unpleasant place for me. But I do visit it, as gripes and complaints about the world have a legitimate place, and have a lot of entertainment value.
So I sort of like the new rules, though their method of implementation was appalling.
If the SDMB was my own messageboard, I would’ve restricted the language in thread titles from day one, but otherwise I would not have changed things too much from the original “don’t be a jerk” which served the forums pretty well for so long.