Whenever I see a Cessna L-19 Bird Dog for sale, it seems they are rather expensive for what they are. They’re basically Cessna 170s with a cut-down rear fuselage, and two seats instead of four. They do have a more powerful engine.
I haven’t looked at 170s recently, but IIRC they usually sell in the $25,000 - $50,000 range. Older Cessna 172s are similarly priced. But the L-19s seem to run $60,000 or more. Is it simply because they’re ‘warbirds’?
They’re always in demand as glider tugs, so maybe it’s just the free market there. Could also be that there are so few of them around that they’re generally in better condition than 170’s and 172’s of that age. Dunno.
I think they are also considered a minor warbird. They were used as artillery spotters, if I recall correctly.
I second ElvisL1ves statment.
because they are lighter than a normal 170, but with the bigger engine, they’re in huge demand by glider clubs. A quick search of the Canadian database shows that nearly 3/4s of all Cessna Model 305s are registered to soaring-related associations (Looks like the Air Cadet League is the largest operator… About half of all the L-19s are registered to them, and they’re the only operator of the “c” model. No big surprise there, as they do a whole lot of gliding, and are only willing to operate L-19s and Bellanca Scouts.
Hm. You learn something new every day. I never considered the glider angle. How to they compare with the 180/185 in that role?
Can’t say I’ve ever heard of a 180/185 towing. Not to say that it doesn’t happen, I’ve just never heard of it.
Though I’m betting that they’re not used because of their larger size and complexity. I’ve never heard of anything larger than a 2-seat being used for tow. Most stick to a smallplane/big engine setup.
I know several glider operation that run L-19s, and several that until recently did. The consensus seems to be that the “warbird wannabe” market is driving up the cost of parts to where these planes are becoming uneconomical as glider tugs. Operations that have them still run them, but very few would be interested in paying the price a decent L-19 will fetch.
The Piper Pawnee seems to be the current towplane of choice. Depending on how it’s set up (engine, prop & empty weight) it can tow as well as an L-19. It’s said to be easier to fly, with a lower incidence of groundloops. Its drawbacks are that it can’t carry a passenger (so it’s hard to check out new pilots), it’s not as sexy as an L-19 (so it’s harder to attact towpilots, who typically are volunteers), and it’s fabric-covered.
You can typically sell a run-out L-19 for enough money to buy a nice Pawnee and have a fair amount left over.
I have a couple dozen tows behind a C-180, and one with a C-185. Both are excellent (the 185 is almost too powerful). In comparable condition, each would cost more than an L-19, and much more than a Pawnee. So they aren’t all that commonly used as tugs.
A Cessna 182 is occasionally used as a tug, and it performs well - one of the few “nosedraggers” for which this is true.
Really? I think it is sexier than an L-19. Other’s mileage obviously varies.
Just a comment: A C172 priced below US$50K is probably run out anyway even if it’s old. Figure on $20K for an engine overhaul or $25k for a replacement on top of that.
I’ve seen extremely nice 172Ks for $45,000 not on eBay.