But that’s not me Kay, that’s my family.
I was just reading an on-line transcript of GF2, and there’s a line said by Michael that pretty much sums up his behaviour with Fredo, Paulie, et al:
“I don’t want to kill everybody, Tom; just my enemies.”
I think that Michael killing Fredo was to show us “how out of control” Michael and his situation had become. While he had become his father in title, he was NOT his father. His father, while Godfather, was able to handle the family business while at the same time being able to have a close tight nit family.
Michael could not do this. At the end of Part II (Part III does not exist in my mind) we see that Michael has lost the love of his wife, his sister is less than loving, and he kills his older brother. He has even fired Tom Higgins whom his father has adopted as one of his own family.
The final scene of Part II shows Michael sitting outside – alone. I do not think this was by accident. Micheal could not be tough and ruthless without giving up love and compassion – which is what made his father a great man.
It’s Tom Hagen. He’s German-Irish as he tells Waltz in Part I.
Obviously a lot of people on the SMDB must be watching AMC these past two weeks as the Godfather films have been shown a lot.
Definitely the best scene in the movie. Hell, it even gave Al Neri the creeps - he could hardly believe it and had to avert his eyes.
As for the OP, I always naturally assumed he killed Fredo simply b/c he took sides against the family again, which he was warned not to do.
I have a different take.
I’ve always thought that Michael was sincere when he told Tom to tell Fredo “Tell him everything’s alright… that I know he didn’t know they would try to kill me”.
Also, when leaving Cuba he yells “your still my brother”
I didn’t think Michael decided to kill Fredo until Fredo lashed out at him in the boathouse. That’s when he realized he was beyond weak and stupid, he was jealous.
I always thought the stare he gave Neri at the funeral was one of regret to Neri, that Neri felt Michael was weak for embracing him. Neri kind of looks away. I dont think Neri would be spooked by Michael’s sudden decision to kill Fredo. He already expected it. Remember when he tells him “I don’t want anything to happen to him while my mother’s alive”.
But then again, if my theory were true, nothing happened between that scene and Fredo’s death to change his mind, so maybe I am wrong. Maybe the combination of pentangelli, Roth, and Fredo boiled over and he decided to do it.
furnishesq, I have to point out a few errors in your comments.
–Michael did not fire Tom Hagen at the end of GF2. He did tell him that Tom had to commit to being with him, because Michael had found out that Tom had been offered a new job. Tom reaffirmed his committment to Michael, and proved it by a carrying the suggestion to Frankie Five Angles that he commit suicide.
–Connie rebelled against Michael at the beginning of the film, but after their mother’s death, she begged to come back and take care of Michael. She admitted that she had behaived badly.
–Michael was sitting inside, not outside. But you’re right, he was alone, both in reality and symbolically. Then again, he’d been an outsider all along. The flashback to 1941 (just before the end) showed that very clearly.
Guy Propski,
While I do agree with some of your comments. . .
Tom was relieved of his duties as “head counsel” to the family and was reduced to the status of “special advisor” to the family. I believe that this was one way of Michael distancing himself from all who loved him. That really hurt Tom and was one of the reason’s Tom went looking for other work – the promise Tom made to Mike at the end was I believe made more out of fear than loyalty – you could see that the tone Tom’s promise was half-assed. Tom would have done anything for Mike’s father.
Connie admitted she behaved badly – however I believe (and this is just my theory) she did this because she had not other choice – it was not out of sisterly love. She just lost her mother – the only “insurance” she had that Michael would not cut her off. Thus, when Mom died she needed to kiss some ass so that she wouldn’t be kicked out. Good ole’ Dad didn’t have this problem – his family really loved him. Mike doesn’t have that luxury.
I’ll give you that he was sitting “inside”
My point is – Mike somewhere along the line snapped – losing all who loved him and making him capable of offing his brother.
I think it was poor writing in III when Connie refers to Fredo drowning. How naive could she be. She was acting in such a way in that movie that she had to know what went on. “Maybe they should fear you!”
Maybe it was just her trying to psyche herself to the point where she wnated to believe he drowned.
…as a long-time student of the mafia/mob/organized crime history, I was always fascinated about what held these organizations together. It must be pretty scary to reach the upper levels of the mob-you never know if a subordinate is plotting against you, or the "godfather’ of the family might be decidine to have YOU whacked! I think Michael got too smart for his own good…he should have moved to las Vegas, bought the hotels, and settled down to a peaceful existance. but no. he has to keep making deals with hyman Roth (“we are bigger than US Steel”), and keeps nominal control of the mob back in NYC. His subordinates are confused, and thus the family falls apart. Something along the same lines hapened to paul Castellano (late don of NYC). He forgot to watch everyone, and an ambitious young hood named John Gotti rose up and whacked him! I wonder what life is like in the successors to the mafia-the mexican, russian, chinese gangs, etc.
Really? That’s not what I thought at all - I always believed it was a private “I’m going to need you to kill him later” stare between Michael and Neri, and Neri got the message, and seemed to look away b/c he couldn’t believe Michael was already planning it not even hours after the mother’s funeral.
Does anybody else wanna give their take on this? Since it’s one of my favorite moments from the series, I’d like to make sure I understood it correctly…
You probably have the right take. I always fail to ‘get it’ when it comes to things like this.
What made me think that is the way Neri looks away. I’ll look at it again when I get home.
Here’s the final Michael/Tom scene dialogue from GF2:
TOM: Why did you ask me if something was wrong when I came in?
MICHAEL: I thought you were goin’ to tell me that – you were going to move your family to Vegas – and that you’d been offered the vice-presidency of the house and hotels there I thought you were goin’ to tell me that.
TOM: I turned them down – do I have to tell you about ever offer I turn down?
MICHAEL: let’s do business.
TOM: Alright – just consider this Mike – that’s all just consider it. Now ROTH and the Rosato’s are on the run – are they worth it? And are they strong – is it worth it – I mean you’ve won – do you have to wipe everyone out?
MICHAEL: I don’t fell I have to wipe everyone out – just my enemies – that’s all. You gonna come along with me in these things I have to do – or what. Because if not you can take your wife, your family, and your mistress – and move 'em all to Las Vegas.
TOM: Why do you hurt me MICHAEL – I’ve always been loyal to you – I mean what is this.
MICHAEL: So – you’re staying?
TOM: Yes, I’m staying. Now what is it that you want me to do?
There’s nothing in there about Tom being demoted. Michael just forces him to clearly state his (Tom’s) position. Also, Tom says they came looking for him, not that he looked for a job. As a man in his position, I’m sure Tom received lots of job offers.
Now here’s Connie’s final speech to Michael in GF2:
CONNIE: MICHAEL please I want to talk to you. MICHAEL I hated you – for so many years. I think I did things to myself – to hurt myself – so you’d know – .that I could hurt you. You’re just being strong for all of us the way Papa was. Now I forgive you – can’t you forgive FREDO – he’s so sweet and helpless without you. You need me MICHAEL – I want to take care of you now.
Okay, so she was sucking up. But if you wait until GF3, though, she’s completely on Michael’s side, even going to far as to help him kill one of Michael’s enemies.
I think one thing needs to be said–it’s always going to be hard to pin down everyone’s motivation in the Godfather Saga because of all the double-dealing and plotting. I’m still a bit confused about some of Hyman Roth’s plans!
astorian, I agree 100%
It’s a small point, and we’ve moved to other matters but . . .
Sonny’s murder was carefully planned - surely you can’t hijack a toll road on the spur of the moment without a high risk of discovery. The call from Carlo’s “girlfriend” is too conveniently timed. After all, there’s no requirement that Carlo’s “real” girlfriend has to be the one who calls. Any woman could have provided the female voice, which provokes the argument, and so on. In fact, if Carlo is momentarily monogamous, he’d be even angrier at the accusation from Connie.
Well of course! I still just want to slap the hell out of Kay, after all, part of fighting ignorance means that Mafia Men Do Not Good Husbands Make.
I only saw the first movie, and I read the book. The part that kinda got to me was the killing of Michael’s first wife-what was her name-Appolonia? I always thought it was kinda funny, he goes off, marries this girl in Italy, just this innocent peasant girl, and she gets killed…hmmm…was there a point to this part?
Papermache Prince, true 'nuff. I thought that myself after I posted it.
I haven’t read the book, but as far as the movie goes, it showed the extent to which the Corleone enemies were willing to go. If Michael had not come down the stairs and spotted Fabrizio, he would have gotten in the car and been killed himself. He already knew that it was no longer safe in Sicily; this was another demonstration that he could not allow any enemies, real or perceived, to get the upper hand.
OK, this question has been thoroughly answered.
I’d just like to point out that my user-name in a few different Internet places that require them is Fishing_With_Fredo.
I have always felt that the part where his wife is killed was where Michael’s heart really turns cold. He loved her more than he ever could love Kay(if he even loved her at all), and because of his actions (killing the police chief, etc) she was dead.
When he met Appolonia, I think he envisioned the kind of marriage and family that Vito had, and it was all gone in seconds. It seems to me that when he was in Sicily he sort of fooled himself into a false sense of security and he was jolted back to reality by her death (and his near death). Notice how he never talked about it with anyone back in the states?
To me, this is a major turning point in the series.