I still don’t understand this. Why didn’t Britian raise a stink about American funding of IRA terrorism in Britian before jumping into the war on terrorism with both feet? I suppose that Blair could have gotten some behind the scenes concessions about cracking down on the problem, but that certainly wouldn’t help him be viewed as a leader. No wonder he is called Bush’s Lap-Dog. Did the British press even bring it up? Or did I completely miss the story?
Oh, God, here we go again.
“American funding of IRA terrorism” has always meant a small minority of American citizens making donations to groups whose usage of those funds for violent acts has never been proven (and is probably unproveable, which is not to say nonexistent). America itself (i.e., the US government) was in no way responsible for these donations.
Because they could never prove the link and because the IRA was only active prior to the War on Terror (and to an extent because of the influence of Irish-Americans), the US government did not violate its constitution by suppressing its citizens’ right to donate their money to political causes they supported. It did, however, force the most prominent of these groups (Noraid) to register as an agent of the IRA. It also kept the groups’ members/supporters under surveillance, harassed and arrested and prosecuted a couple of them on gun-running charges.
What exactly else did you want them to do?
ruadh is correct, the donations weren’t from the American government, just from individual groups of morons who, one can only assume, had some romantisised view of the whole sorry mess. It’d be a bit harsh to slam America for its moron quota, we have our own morons and proportionally it’s probably about the same percentage. Ireland also have morons. Would the country without morons please stand up?
No?
Oh well.
On the up side Clinton helped a lot in the negotiations with the IRA and things have been distinctly better since he did - /surely/ teaching all involved that addressing the underlying causes of terrorism is more effective than blowing the hell out of people … or not.
Britain didn’t “raise a stink” because IRA terrorism is not a big issue here any more, having more or less gone away. These days, Irish republican sentiment in the north is generally articulated through the political party Sinn Fein, not the IRA.
We did complain about Noraid and other green-tinted-spectacles groups back when they mattered, but the US Government seemed strangely unconcerned at the time. Perhaps they didn’t appreciate then what it’s like to be targeted by terrorists.
Where do the Ulsters get their money?
No, that’s OK, I really don’t mind that you completely ignored what I just posted about this.
NurseCarmen: what do you mean by “the Ulsters”?
I get mine from working. In a job.
What?
ruadh, regarless of the real truth behind the issue, the perception during the 70s and 80s in the UK was that Noraid was funding the IRA. With respect to that particular perception, I think the question can be legitimately answered. And people did complain quite vehemently, but were ignored (perhaps because there was nothing to complain about…?).
You what?
I haven’t questioned the perception of what Noraid was doing with the money, jjimm. I’m trying (without much luck, it seems) to address the perception that the US “ignored” the complaints.
Actually, thinking again on this, I think NurseCarmen may be refering to the paramilitary groups with ‘Ulster-XX’ in their name, such as the UFF, UVF and the likes.
Most of those get their money from intimidation of commercial owners, collection of payments from pubs & construction sites, and from the production and sale of of pirate CDs, DVDS, and fake labelled clothes. And the odd armed robbery, though that’s not as common a method these days. Oh, and the selling of drugs, of course.
NurseCarmen Ulster is a province of Ireland. It includes Northern Irish counties and a couple of Rep. of Ireland ones as well. When talking about the area best to call it Northern Ireland.
http://www.wesleyjohnston.com/users/ireland/geography/counties.html
Anyhoo most of the Provisional IRA’s money came from bank raids etc pulled of in the north and south. There was donations coming in from the US and UK and the south of Ireland. Countries like Libya also supplied arms to the IRA. Mostly AFAIK the money came from the local fund raising (bank jobs etc.)
So am I right in thinking past inaction on the US government’s part regarding UK complaints about Noraid contributions was due to there being no case to answer regarding terrorist funding?
How sweetly yet provocatively phrased . . . err no. It was due to New York and Boston having more votes in the presidential election than London.
People did create a terrific stink about this at all levels.
In reality I suspect that the amount of cash that came in from Noraid was probably small in comaprison with locally raised money and indeed money raised within the UK, however it was percieved as a major propaganda coup for the IRA.
Several governements took this up with the US government.
But as others have said; the misguided US citizens contributing were doing so in a private capacity, If the US Governement had been making contributions that would have been a different matter.
There are people here in England who are financing terrorism in foreign countries (eg Algeria)
Oh, and I probably mentioned this before, but the Irish pub I used to drink in in the UK had a nightly collection “for the boys”. You had to contribute something or be barred. I’d imagine this was happening in many Republican pubs all over Britian. Whether, of course, the money actually got to the IRA is debatable, though collecting under false pretenses would probably not be too healthy.
While I have to smile sardonically at the thought of the poor little gunrunners being harassed by the nasty, big ole US government, I have to ask where I can read more about this.
I haven’t heard of this at all and would be interested in finding out more.
Which, prior to the end of 2001, was perfectly legal? There are no Americans who are in a position to be prosecuted for knowingly funding terrorist acts?
Here’s a concise summary, including:
So, the charges may in fact have been harrassment. I have no idea as to the accuracy/leaning of the cite, though the site appears to be supportive of independence movements.
The UVF also used to get a small chunk of change from supporters in Canada, although I’m not sure how true that is these days. Contributions have also been made to both sides from supporters in Scotland.
More stuff about the US government’s “inaction” toward Noraid can be found here. Curly Chick, I’ll draw your attention to the line that reads “American law-enforcement agencies persistently hounded Noraid” …
The second part of that sentence reads “…and secured convictions in a number of important gunrunning conspiracies”, which makes me think that maybe they weren’t too squeaky clean after all?