Sure!
But the worst democrat is better than the best republican.
If they weren’t, they’d have already recognized how fucked their party is and switched sides.
Sure!
But the worst democrat is better than the best republican.
If they weren’t, they’d have already recognized how fucked their party is and switched sides.
What are the chances that the D’s, if they get a majority of the Senate, will abolish the 60% McConnell cloture blockage on its opening day?
For many of us it’s increasingly clear that abolishing the filibuster is a good step, and should be taken the first time the Senate falls into D hands.. Which of the candidates have come out in favor? Warrem IIRC; any others? (Would all 50 out of 50 (or 51) D Senators vote to abolish? Unfortunately I strongly doubt it.)
Can Mr. Biden keep his support for the rule change secret in his heart, but encourage D’s to act after he’s elected? This might be the most electable option — given that the Koch-Putin-Hannity Lie Machine will make support for abolishing filibuster seem like treason and socialism.
The question we seem faced with in this and other threads is:
**Which of two voter groups is most essential for D's to appeal to:**[ul][li]1. Progressives on the left, who will stay home if they think Trump vs Biden is "Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Dum no reason to vote for either one."[*]2. Centrist, rather uninformed, and easily confused voters, from ruralish America; people prone to being misled by the Russia-GOP Lie Machine.[/ul][/li]
Perhaps someone can phrase an OP (with poll?) to ask my question. By common sense I'll guess (2) as the larger group, but have no poll or other evidence to link to.
I think hard progressives just fantasize about having more power than they actually do, or maybe it’s that they look at their twitter followers and facebook timeline and just live in a political bubble. What center-line Democrats understand is that there are more radical right wing people in America than there are radical left wing Americans. The radical right can sometimes get away with being who they are because they have the numbers to win if not enough people care to stop them. Not true of the radical left, which is confined mostly to cities in the Northeast or West Coast. Progressives need to work harder and spend more energy selling their message than the right wing does. America is more conservative than liberal. Joe Biden didn’t make it this way, but it is.
The only way the far left will understand that is in a general election loss. Their one size fits all political philosophy while admirable in terms of goals, it is just not practical. The biggest and most loyal voting bloc for the Democratic party are African-American women. They tend to be more conservative/moderate. In 2016 when they turned out to support Hillary Clinton’s bid some Bernie Sanders supporters, and even campaign surrogates criticised them for being “low-information voters”. One Sanders campaign worker said John Lewis - Civil Rights hero - is part of the establishment and “would throw a cat under the bus to help the DNC”.
It is that type of abrasiveness that puts people including myself off Bernie Sanders. African-American women were not voting against their self-interest by supporting Hillary Clinton. They were voting for their self-interest because the issue of Civil Rights and the rollback of the progress made is in line with the courts. Supreme Court appointees, Federal judges. 2016 was the election for the judicial future for the next 30 years.
Another thing about Bernie supporters that irritates me is the guilt trap they try to play. Maybe it’s just a social media thing but too many times I see support for another candidate rather than Bernie have a group of his supporters shouting “you don’t care about the poor” “homelessness is on the rise and you’re happy to keep them there” and my favorite “you neo-liberal stooge”.
My response is what has Bernie succeeded in doing as a Senator for nigh on 30 years to solve this. You don’t have to be President to take on the issues of poverty, housing, tuition costs etc.
Bernie did not even vote until he was 41 years old, and that was for himself. He passed through the Civil Rights movement, the anti-War movement, the Watergate aftermath without casting a vote which for millions of people they only received their inalienable right to cast a vote a few years earlier. For me that is quite shameful.
'Bout sums it up. He’s past his sell by date now; I know that the Malaysians elected a 92 year old who had been prez before, but the actuarlla odds aren’t too good for someone past the biblical three score and ten.
Of course, Trump might just turn into a Blue Norwegian. With any luck.
Our best proxies for the two groups (Obama-nons and Obama-Trumps, respectively) show that the former is about twice as large as the latter.
That said, I’m not sure the former is going to be easier to reach. Although this does raise doubts: Obama-to-Trump Voters Are Cooling On the President: Study
Mitch McConnell has been every bit as responsible for this as Trump. After Trump goes, Mitch will still be there.
I totally agree! However, one’s expectations must be grounded in reality. Biden’s aren’t.
Which Dem candidates above the 1% line wouldn’t do this? Bernie, maybe. That’s it.
Inslee has, but he’s down in the 0%-1% range.
I think this is why the case needs to be made now. It’s going to take time to change the minds of Senators.
The general public doesn’t care about things like this - well, a fairly small minority of tuned-in voters do, but that’s it. They’re going to notice whether you kept the campaign promises you made that affect them personally, and vote (or stay home) accordingly in 2022. If the filibuster remains in place, you can see how that’s gonna go.
Bernie Sanders would easily poll double digits higher if his so called ‘Bernie Bros’ supporters weren’t such loud-mouthed obnoxious assholes. He has almost no chance without his campaign adopting a blanket ‘STFU You Low-Class Cheap Seats Assholes’ corporate policy.
…
The other day I went to buy gasoline. The islands were busy (the price was good). There was a car trying to jockey left, right and sideways to get to the pumps with his gas cap side facing the pumps. He was getting into it with a car that had filled up and wanted to leave an open space… one he could easily take and use… but no, he had to scream out his window and try to ‘get into it’ with the driver trying to leave. At one point, he even got out of his car, puffed out his chest, tensed all his arm muscles, made fists and threatened her.
I backed up and allowed enough room so that she could leave. He then started to scream at me for ‘stealing his spot’. (facepalm)
I backed up my car, rolled down the window and did my best to assure him, “No, that spot is all yours. Take it. Take your time, I’m not stealing anything. Please, use it in good health with my blessings”.
He then started screaming, “You! You stop talking!!!” and started to repeat the whole puffed chest/tensed arms/fists drill with me. (I started filming at this point with my other hand on a can of mace.)
Eventually ‘Cro-Magnon Man’ got back in his car and got his gas at the spot he wanted, but not before I took another spot on another island, filled up completely, and left.
Now the point is that he COULD have gassed up and have been out of there easily ten minutes earlier… but no, he had to be a Human Bleeding Hemorrhoid, a screaming big-mouth with bad breath that screwed up everything for everyone around him, including himself.
As I drove away I realized that he had acted just like a ‘Bernie Bro’.
Sounds more like a Trump guy. Did he insist the Mexico was going to pay for his fill-up?
Perhaps. But I’d guess Trumpist would be more likely.
I wish you’d made inquiries so we’d know — Trumpist or BernieBro? “I’m a pollster; please help us, kind sir” would probably not have worked but isn’t there some shortcut available? Put on a MAGA hat and see how he reacted?
I, too believe that fellow to be a Trump voter.
I am not familiar with Bernie Bros. How does this resemble Bernie-Bro behavior? What do they do exactly in real life?
They specialize in suits for the frumpy American man.
The question’s not only which group is larger, though. The question’s also which group is more likely to be moveable to both show up and, once they’ve done so, vote for the D.
Both parts of that are relevant – if you can shift 90% of group A but only 10% of group B, but there are 10 times as many in group B, it would still make sense to aim at group B, for example. But I suspect that none of the percentages/ratios in that example are correct; and don’t know what any of them actually are.
What we really need is someone who can appeal to both group A and group B. I don’t know whether there’s any such person running, though. I was hoping one such would stand out by now; but it’s hard to stand out in the current large pack.
You may be right, but statistics don’t quite bear you out. The radical right is about 6% of the electorate (according to Fortune Magazine). The radical left is about 2%. Neither one is a significant voting bloc.
39% of US citizens live on the coast.
Here’s a Gallup chartfrom 2017 of self-stated voter slant. There is a long steady trend upward for “liberal” over the past decade, with most of this being Democrats changing their position from moderate to liberal.
It’s an interesting chart. One of the more striking findings is that men are a LOT more conservative-identifying than women. I think this is has only increased since 2017.
Yes to universal healthcare and raising the minimum wage. Those ideas have been around forever. Maybe no to free college tuition, but i don’t support that anyway.
yup
And all those reasons that were quoted several times, except i don’t think Bernie has been an effective legislator.
and so much this. Atheist communist Jew. Yeah, that’s going to bring people to the polls. Not.
yup
yeah, it’s scary to know just how little the radical left gives a shit about America.
you know, if we were talking about Hillary vs. Romney, you’d have a point. But the Republican nominee will be trump.
okay. You’re wrong, but your are free to think whatever nonsense your like.
Yes, that is a jab. A jab at Bernie. He’s been proposing all this stuff forever, and what has he accomplished? Jack shit, that’s what.
The primary reason i don’t support Bernie is because he’s been an ineffective senator, he has almost no adminstrative experience, he doesn’t know anything about foreign policy, and he’s one of the few people running who might actually be worse than Donald trump at actually being president.
His distinctive Mexican accent on the words that came out in Spanish made it clear that he was no friend of POTUS.
That said, how he screwed up The Entire System of people trying to just get gasoline was 100% ‘Bernie Bro’.
Those fat bastards fit in suits? Sounds like an awful waste of bolts of cloth.
In answer to the OP: Because he is irritating as fuck. My god, if I have to listen to that voice for four or even eight years… :smack: