Great, here I am, thinking about how I want to be a teacher and that is ALL I want to do with my WHOLE LIFE and you people have to go and screw it all up by saying that the students treat you like crap. GREAT! NOW WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO WITH MY LIFE??? HUH??? Thought so.
Garfield, WHERE you teach matters a lot. Teach at VMI? You won’t see this crap. Teach at a small liberal arts college? You’ll see some of it, but you’ll also get to know the exceptions so well, the crappy students won’t gall you so much. Even at Behemoth U, or an open-enrollment community college, you can do things to cut down on the B.S. and maixmize the reward to the students who don’t try it.
When I taught stats, I used to walk home breathless every day after class because it was just such a high, it was so rewarding. Granted, I was teaching grad students, which made a huge difference.
The more I read about these meaningless grades, the more I am certain that my alma mater, the University of California at Santa Cruz, is making a grave error in attempting to get rid of our system of narrative evaluations. An eval actually describes a person’s work and behavior in a course. How a single letter can represent a person’s work in a course, I don’t know. I know that the evals make more work for the professors, but most of mine told me that they would rather write a couple paragraphs of something honest than give a letter that reflected nothing, even if it took twice as long. Not to mention, no one would ditch classes on the belief that they could get a good grade on the exams, as the eval would almost certainly begin with “Passed the exams, but had a very poor attendance record and never participated in class discussions.” Ouch.
TAs and professors, you have my eternal respect.
I attended Cornell University, College of Engineering (class of 1990) and I consider myself to be a conscientious student (I graduated with a 3.5 GPA). I had some great teachers and I had some that sucked. I met a few that loved to teach but most hated it and it showed (the TA’s were worse then the professors but not by much). To be entirely blunt, if all the TA’s and Prof’s at Cornell Engineering died tomorrow it would be a good thing overall. I went in loving engineering but before they were done with me I hated it (and I know I wasn’t the only one). When I graduated I had a huge student loan to pay and no other means of support but to work as an engineer.
My experience at Cornell (and the OP rant) has convinced me of one thing, I honestly don’t think people should should teach other people past basic reading skills. Once a kid knows how to read then he should be given access to a computer with special teaching software and required to pass certain tests after a certain amount of time at the computer (a month for sex ed, a year for calculus etc). I’m going to GD now to open a thread on computer teaching in place of the 5,000 year old classroom. I would appreciate any comments you have there, unless you just want to tell me to Fuck Off then this is definitely the place :).
While I don’t have a lot to add to the OP, I did want to respond to this:
phouka thinks,
I think, phouka, that you’re a little idealistic. Well, a lot idealistic. Professorial priorities vary from school to school, of course, but in my experience, the ordering is usually:
- felch a governmental agency program manager for more grant money
- felch another governmental agency program manager for more grant money
- felch a foundation chair for more grant money
- felch a corporate research VP for more grant money
- publish an incestuous, colleague butt-rimming, ass kissing paper
- take charge of undergraduate classes
somewhere down the line) care about teaching those classes
Now, I think you’ve got the idea of how things should be, but that’s not how they are. You remember when you visited universities as a prospective undergraduate, and the admissions councelors gave you a spiel about how important undergraduate teaching is to the University’s mission? Well, they lied. It’s not.
Yes, I think this should change, but you’re not going to change anything by yelling at Assistant Professors. Assistant Professors need to get tenure, which means that they have to pay strict attention to the priorities I listed above.
An anecdote: One of the reasons that I’m not an Assistant Professor is that, during one of my interviews at mumblemumble University, I was told,
This wasn’t meant to be insulting, rather, it was meant to be good advice, because that’s just the way tenure committees work.
ObPit: Fuck
I now have a crush on bio-brat.
She sounds like just my type: bright, young, female, cranky, bitter, no patience, no tolerance …
ah! be still my black little Mr. Burns heart!
I’m with biobrat. I’m currently a student, finishing off the high school courses I should have taken when I was supposed to be in high school, and maintaining straight A’s so I can attend University.
I’m in adult education, so going in, I thought that my fellow students would act like adults. Let’s face it. Most of us are there because we’re tired of low paying menial work. Most of us are trying to get into University.
80% of the students there don’t act like adults, IMHO. Skipping classes, not paying attention, not doing any of the homework, and then coming to me for tutoring because they “didn’t get Chapters 5-17”. Hmmm… I wonder why not.
I also hear so many lame excuses. For the record, I am a mother of 4, with two boys in soccer (taking up all of my evening time) and two girls in diapers, one still breastfeeding. THEN people come to me for tutoring (or to try and copy my assignments which goes over REALLY well) because they were too busy taking a long weekend at the lake, or their one child takes up too much time to do homework, etc.
Too busy? TOO BUSY??? Excuse me. I work my ass off to keep straight A’s. I have a perfect attendance record. I do every scrap of homework assigned, and I pay attention in class.
If someone wants help, and they are working really hard at their class, I don’t mind taking a little bit of time to try and help, but it’s usually people who aren’t there often enough who are having problems passing.
Sadly, I find that the teachers really try to accomadate the students that aren’t showing up. Giving extra time on assignments without docking grades. Spending valuable classroom time re-covering subjects that we already covered once (because half the class wasn’t there for an important topic). On Friday it was announced that our test was being put back because not enough people showed up for class to find out that we were having a test. Personally, I think that just punishes those of us who do really try. Why bother showing up when you get so many allowances made for you? Is this going to prepare us for University???
Kyla,
I thought written evaluations instead of grades worked very well at my alma mater (New College in Sarasota, Florida) too. I’m not claiming they would work everywhere, but they did work at New College.
Sumaran, I now understand why you’ve go the post on classroom teaching. I studied and taught at Cornell myself, (1987-1991) and had several friends in engineering.
You didn’t really have many teachers. You had researchers who were forced to spend some time in the classroom. That is not at all the same thing as having someone who knows how to teach and who loves to teach. Cornell was (and probably still is) loaded with people who have no business being in a classroom except as guest lecturer.
Bucky
Bolding mine.
Whatever you say, teach. :rolleyes:
(FTR, I agree with the rest of your rant. I give it a 7.2)
I teach statistics to sophomore Psychology students at an urban university. I prefer research to teaching and was hired, as I understand it, as a researcher not a teacher. Accordingly, I use part of my grant funding to buy me out of 2 courses/year, leaving me only 1 course/semester to teach.
Unmotivated students can be a drag and will challenge even the best teachers. Also, students who are woefully unprepared for university-level courses are a challenge.
That being said, teaching is part of my job and I do the absolute best job that I can possibly do. Part of “the absolute best job that I can possibly do” means treating students with respect and compassion, regardless of their motivation, level of preparedness, or any other variable.
The OP degrades the Professor, the student, the class, and the university.
Eissclam
I’m going to jump in here with my first (well, almost my first) post on SDMB and co-rant/sympathize with bio-brat.
I teach at a fairly large community college in the Midwest, and on the whole, I honestly enjoy what I do. But it can get frustrating sometimes when you get some students who rarely attend class, make no effort to contact me/see me if they are having problems, do poorly on assignments and exams, and then expect me to “give” them a grade they want for the class (“But I need a B to maintain my grade-point average, keep my financial aid, etc. WAH!”).
I’m all for helping students out as much as possible, but I am a teacher, not a baby-sitter.
I’m just jumping in for a rating. I give it 7.5. Not enough humor or referencs to felching and other nastiness. Overall, a great clean rant.
Don’t these two statements seem to contradict each other? Why should you be upset if someone asks for a little leniency, when they can get it for free if you *think *they’re funny? How very hypocritical of you. Do they get 1 extra point for a chuckle, 2 points for a guffaw, and 3 points for a belly laugh?
If you don’t like working with students, I suggest you get a research job or a hammer to pound that chip off your shoulder.
Oops, sorry Mouthbreather, I didn’t see that you had made the same point. Guess Bio Brat would give me an “F” for plagiarism.
I admit it I’m busted. Giving one point on a test because one of my students made me chuckle is indeed equivalent to giving out the 2.0 despite the fact that what was earned was a 1.0 because the kid came to my office and either begged or threatened. Fortunately the Dean of my dept fully supports my decisions and has NEVER requested that I change a grade.
If you read the posts from others in the University system you’ll find that I am not alone. I can appreciate the fact that some folks simply don’t care what is happening in Universities, but as I’ve stated before, grade inflation and the state of higher learning is affecting all of us. It means that the TRULY bright students are lumped in the same group as the knuckle-draggers who come here for a good party. Do you not have a job? Are you unaware that despite my best efforts kids will be leaving this University with unearned degrees only to have to be COMPLETELY re-trained?
I am happy for the Stats Professor who has never gone through any of this. Do you teach undergrads sir? Will you lower yourself? You’ve BOUGHT your way out of two classes? You have the nerve to think that I degrade Professors and the University?!?!
Despite what some of you think, I consider teaching my job ** first and foremost**. Research has now become my hobby. It’s something I now do on weekend, holidays, and nights when I’m not grading papers. However I am NOT under ANY circumstances a babysitter for 20 year olds.
Thanks to all who have replied (even those that have strongly disagreed with me). I REALLY appreciate the feedback. It’s nice to have well thought out answers for a change.
Do any of you want to take my class? I’ll GIVE you a 4.0!
Oh, the obligatory FUCK YOU!!
(No I don’t teach at OSU)
bio-brat
Drat, would have asked you if you knew my sister, who is going for her PhD in organic chemistry there, or my brother, who just got his PhD in Physics there. 
I received a BA in English (should have been a B.S. 'cuz that’s basically what I learned to do) from a small women’s college. I was fortunate to have many excellent teachers, and especially fortunate because I was able to take several different classes from each one. Papers were assigned thick and fast; exams were essay only. Except for senior year, when a new teacher assigned a multiple-choice/fill-in-the-blank/true-false final. Totally blew our minds! We had been in essay mode for so long the final looked like it was written in a foreign language! On the flip side, there was the philosophy professor who gave poor grades if you didn’t agree with HIS particular life-view (the guy was a Christian Fundamentalist Marxist, a concept I’m still trying to figure out). It didn’t matter how well-researched or well thought-out your argument was.
I substitute taught in the local junior high and high school a few times before I stopped answering the phone in the morning. Teachers seem to like to call in subs on test days. EVERY SINGLE TEACHER I subbed for left instructions for me to either READ THE TEST OUT LOUD to the class or dismiss the ones who needed the test read to the library, where the guidance counselor would read it to them. 12 students in the 12th grade had to leave the room to have their tests read. I mean, come on. I know learning disabilities exist, but I refuse to believe half the class was affected by one.
We’re raising a generation of idiots, folks. And it’s all happened in the last ten years or so. I attended the same schools I subbed at - even subbed for some of my former teachers - and if we couldn’t read our own tests, that was just tough shit. I gave a class of 7th graders a science test in the form of a crossword puzzle. They screamed because there wasn’t a “word bank” at the bottom of the page. “How are we supposed to know how to spell the answers?” they whined. Did it never occur to any of them to study the friggin’ material? What makes it worse is I had just walked them through a review sheet that was virtually IDENTICAL to the test they were taking!
My third grade son told me Martin Luther King Jr. freed the slaves. I am beginning to seriously home-schooling.
is that you don’t acknowledge the good part of your teaching experience. It is just this sort of holier than though arrogance that has turned academia into a machine run by inflexible zealots. It is a factionalized monolith that has ceased to serve its function. I am a senior at UC Berkeley and I had a teacher just like you last semester. No other factor has more importance than the skill and demeanor of the teacher.You are young. Why do you persist in teaching when you could have many happy years as a jack-booted dominatrix? You have the soul of a petty martinette. You need three things: You belong in research. Get a job filling test tubes. More fiber. A savage doggy style sort of fucking with a lengthy period of lengual stimulation preceding it.
I give you a B- because I can see exactly what you are talking about. It is the babay boomer’s fault. The spawn is exactly the same; self-centered, illiterate, and greedy. But you have had years of training which should have given you a thicker skin. Go to your true calling Woman!!
“I now have a crush on bio-brat.
She sounds like just my type: bright, young, female, cranky, bitter, no patience, no tolerance …
ah! be still my black little Mr. Burns heart!”
The moment I read it, I knew she was the gal for me! I can see her, black rimmed glasses, one size too small matching buffalo plaid ensemble in a muted dignified tone (she owns seven grey power suits, replete with matching accessories), that piercing gaze which betrays little more than a subtle contempt. I verily swoon! Yes! She opens the desk drawer and pulls out a bull whip, her perky breasts straining at attention…
Too bad I am an English major. Sigh.