America does a good propeganda job. I was surprised at how different it is in reality compared to the TV shows I’ve seen. A lot more beggers, not as technologically advanced as I’d thought, and pretty dirty. On the tv shows it appears to be filled with rich people living in spotless cities with the best technology. I wonder how many cubans are disappointed when they actually see what it’s like? And I bet the new arrivals are desperately hoping they don’t get sick…
The US stance on Cuba seems very confusing in view of the US stance on China.
Well why would they, when Florida has far more consumer goods for the healthy, educated and hard-working to purchase?
Too bad that there’s not, say, a whole rest of the world that they could trade with. :rolleyes:
The embargo means nothing. Cuba’s screwed because of their government.
There is an argument to be made here that if the Cuban economy were not embargoed, free trade woud do more damage to the Cuban leadership than any of the failed measures over the past 50 years.
Cuba’s economy is no worse (and even better than) lots of other countries around the world… Burma, North Korea, Zimbabwe etc. US citizens are allowed to go all these places which are ruled by dictators, so why single out Cuba?
Certainly a flood of US tourists would be more likely to bring change in Cuba as the sanctions of the past 50 years.
When you look beyond the superficial you find things like the US bullying other countries to join the embargo, resulting in things like an entire village in Ecuador becoming unemployed and destitute because their main industry was making Panama hats for export to Cuba.
Americans are too spooked out by the whole “communist” thing, especially right at their doorstep. It’s too bad we can’t just take a look at the failed embargo’s original purpose, getting rid of Castro, acknowledge it’s failure, and remove it. There are plenty of dictators around and we deal with a lot of them. It isn’t our job to deny our own citizens things in order to selectively punish a government that disagrees with us. If Castro and Cuba were richer maybe he’d have less of an incentive to be paranoid about his power and hold on for 40 years. I hope Obama chips away at this stupid restriction during his presidency.
Well, the embargo includes punishment to non-US corporations trading with Cuba, so it discourages a good portion of that ‘whole rest of the world’ from doing bussiness there.
If it means nothing, then why continue it? I say, lift it, and let the goverment colapse (or at least prevent it from using the embargo scapegoat).
THey seem to be doing quite the tourist business with every other country in the world, not to mention exporting stuff to every other country in the world … about 5 years ago I could have flown to Cuba for a 3 day weekend for 300 euros … [as long as I didnt want to try and get back into the US with a cuban stamp on my passport]
There is a lot of political analysis in this thread about America’s motives that is at best superficial. The United States government does not consider Cuba a threat or a bastion of communism on our doorstep, etc etc.
The real barrier to ending the embargo of Cuba is… Cubans. Many/most Cubanos intensely dislike Castro and want a return to the good old days of Cuba, instead of the 3rd world dictatorship it is now.
The Cuban voting bloc is oddly powerful and the Cuban vote has tended to go to the GOP. The Republicans don’t want to piss off a big voting bloc to help out a despot, and the Democrats have been trying to appease the Cubano population for years.
The embargo is fairly useless. Both parties will and have admitted that. Both parties have also tried to make moves towards ending the embargo, but the political hit was and is still too big. The embargo is also not the driving factor in Cuban poverty. Sure, we are a big trading partner, but so is/was the communist bloc, Canada, Mexico, Asia, etc. etc, especially for what is pretty much a tiny island nation. Most of the older Cubano families fled when Castro took power; they see prosperity replaced with poverty due to Fidel, and they are mostly right.
I hardly think pornography (visiting) or other things are similar to “buying a product” no-one has still answered the question, why do they (US Government) do it. It seems very counter productive. Let’s be honest I don’t like Cuba either and the dictatorship but I just don’t understand the big deal. If America says you are “free” why can you not buy something from another country or visit the said country. Has it stopped Americans from going there?
Can you buy something from North Korea?
I still don’t get it?
The bottom line is, it doesn’t seem to be working, Cuba is surviving it’s very much like the “war on drugs” that doesn’t seem to be working either although I am very against that too.
I think ivn1188 has given you the best answer: Politics. There is nothing to be gained for politicians to lift the embargo, and everything to lose. Politicians agitating to lift the embargo are then depicted as coddling dictators and soft on communism. Why burn the political capital?
Likewise, since you brought it up, the prohibition on marijuana. Politicians who don’t see the laws as effective don’t put repealling them as their top priority because while it might be a rational or logical decision, it opens them up to being “soft on drugs”. You’re likely to lose many more votes than you’ll gain.
Well, it was most certainly a dictarship before Castro, so are you saying it wasn’t a 3rd world country under Batista?
I think you are greatly underestimating the effects of being denied trade with the richest population in the world. How would democratic European nations fair under an embargo? Would simply being democracies keep them rich? Also, given the fairly accepted notion of how tied to organized crime the old regime was, I’m not sure how it could be described as the lesser of the two evils.
I agree that the Cuban voting bloc in Florida is the main reason the embargo is staying in place.
Moving from GQ to GD.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
You hit the nail on the head.
If you’ve ever wondered why Israel carries so much weight in U.S. foreign policy, it’s basically the same reason as this - a small group of people who know how to make a lot of noise and have allies in high places.
And a lot of politicians, even if they do want to pursue a more sensible policy, figure its not an issue worth wasting political capital on, and thus don’t make a big stink about changing the status quo.
I’m inclined to agree with you. The whole thing reminds me of the powerful Jewish lobby. Both of these groups exert power more than they deserve and if they did not scare so many Congressmen, improvements in both countries’ issues would definitely happen
I believe that what needs to happen is that someone have a frank and honest discussion about the Cuba issue. Tell the Cubans that their dream of old Cuba is dead, Castro and his cronies are in power and have been for almost half a century. We need to end the embargo and normalize relations with the country.
I don’t think this is true, if by US based carriers you mean major passenger airlines, like AA, USAir, United, and so on. There are some charter airlines from the US that do fly to Cuba though, and of course airlines from everywhere else in the world.
For all those blaming the US embargo for Cuba’s economic trouble, please take a step back and look at the facts.
The US is Cuba’s 5th largest trading partner, see here.
In 2008 the US exported 653 million dollars worth of food to Cuba, link here.
Cuba opened its tourism market in 1989, and today over 2 million tourists visit Cuba annually, link here.
The embargo by the US has very little impact on the Cuban economy, the major problem with the Cuban economy is that is run as a communist model, and it is grossly inefficient. This is beginning to change in some of the new tourist venues, but if you have stayed in any tourist resort in Cuba then you can attest to the state of repair of even the newest facilities.
I have said many times here in the SDMB that the US embargo is ineffective, but that lifting would do nothing to change the situation in Cuba. I would even bet that if the US lifted travel restrictions to Cuba the number of US citizens allowed to travel to Cuba would not change significantly, because Cuba would continue to portray the US as the big aggressor and the lifting of sanctions as some sort of “affront to national sovereignty”, and refuse entry visas to US citizens.
For the Castros to retain power they need the US as the enemy, and the Castros have demonstrated for 50 years that they will remain in power, whatever it takes.
There are dictatorships and dictatorships. After Batista’s coup, Cuba was a dictatorship, but as long as you stayed out of opposition politics and kept your head down, you could live your life unmolested. With Castro in charge, that really hasn’t been true anymore.