As someone who lurked for a short while, and just started posted recently, I have to say I’ve felt the brunt of mods deciding I was being a jerk when I felt I was just trying to keep up with the tone of the thread I was in. Not a welcoming feeling, and certainly made me consider if this was a good place for me to post. Still mulling that over, in fact. I’ve got a pretty thick skin, I think, but I’m trying to figure what the standards of posting in various forums are, exactly–if issuing vague warnings, and giving me no answers to direct questions (asking questions got me warned for “repeating” the thing I was warned about–I felt i was just providing context for my question, but the mod felt strongly otherwise) is the SDMB learning curve, I’m really not sure I’m all interested in particpating here. Just a newbie’s opinion, of course.
I’ve been here since 2000 (and was mildly active on the SD AOL group before the SDMB was created). I love this place, and there are a number of my fellow Dopers whom I consider friends.
That said, the general tenor of the board has been increasingly making me uncomfortable. It feels, to me, like there’s even more pedantry now than there was in the past, more people who seem to just want to argue, and a greater undercurrent of tension and sniping. It feels like an increasing number of threads (and not even just in subfora like Great Debates, where I’d expect it more) devolve into personal attacks or umbrage.
I’m probably just a sentimental old nerd, but it makes me sad to see people getting angry with each other all the time here.
Is that particular to the Straight Dope, or is this just what society is becoming? Tone policing and hypersensitivity to wrongthink seem to be on the rise everywhere.
Sideburns. We should all grow longer sideburns. That extended the shelf life of The Lawrence Welk Show for a decade. Switching from polka to music videos isn’t going to attract new viewers. It will just alienate the old ones.
When this board finally ages out, it won’t be a failure on anybody’s part, it’s just another indication of a passing generation.
It’s probably indicative of what’s happening in society as a whole, though it’s not just “tone policing and hypersensitivity to wrongthink” – it’s also a general decline in the ability to have a normal conversation or discussion with people about anything, without raised voices, criticism, and ire coming into play, sooner rather than later.
That said, “I need to win this argument with that guy on the internet” is nothing new, but my personal impression is that the board has become meaner, overall. (Or, maybe, it’s no different now, but I’m just more sensitive to it. Hard to say.)
You make a worthwhile point—it’s the communication style that’s dragging knuckles, not necessarily the person who posts that way.
There is a place for leetspeak, unknown words, phrases and made-up initialisms, (e.g.: “He ISO like, GJEDBEOTKT, ya know?”) but I don’t believe that place is here. You may disagree. Cecil may disagree.
And as I said, if the goal is to make the SDMB more popular it might be effective to lower the level of discourse here. Might be good to have animated GIFs and videos for signatures, too.
Imagine “Regards, Shodan” but with huge bare-breasted harpys with Cookie Monster faces etching the the words in snow with flaming piss.
Imagine the most common response in a Great Debates thread being: “No, YOU!!1!”
We can do that if that’s truly what people want. If TPTB clearly communicated that that is the new direction the Dope is going I wouldn’t complain cuz it’s their bag, baby. But neither would I post here anymore. Would you?
Guess I’m working on a new avatar now…
I thought we weren’t going to discuss personal fetishes.
Maybe that’s why membership is declining!
But usually those terms are known in the community/culture having the discussion. Not understanding how “kids these days” talk, chastising them for not talking like you, and calling them “knuckle-draggers” is going to do absolutely nothing whatsoever to attract younger posters. “Hey, here’s a forum with angry elderly people yelling at us for talking wrong. I think I’ll join!”
Your weird hard-on hate against acronyms aside, have you actually been to any other message board or social media forum in the past 20 years? I think I remember seeing flashing sparkly signatures on a geocities page in 1998.
I’ve always found it annoying how in some TV show/movie depicting a generation gap (and, actually, IRL) they have adults complaining about the unknown initialisms being used by their kids when it is terms I saw used on Usenet and IRC in the mid-1990s, and that were old even then.
One issue of relevance for new people arriving on the site. We’ve had conversations about this before, but it’s idiotic that there’s so much resistance to making forum names more sensible and intuitive. How many times does a newbie come on here, post something in General Questions, only to be (albeit gently) rebuked that General Questions is not actually the place to post general questions. MPSIMS is of course the most egregious example. Why does a message board that is supposed to be about fighting ignorance have misleading and unintuitive subforum names, and insist on keeping them for “traditional” reasons?
GQ should be called something like “Factual Questions”.
The MPSIMS name could be kept - if that’s the entirety of what goes in it, tirival/gossipy/silly stuff. But the idea that a breaking news story about a landslide burying a kindgergarten belongs in a forum with that name is beyond absurd.
I think we should lean into this. Lots of places serve the young folk. Rebrand the pkace, “The Straight Dope - A place for angry old people to yell at the world.” No malarkey!
That one slipped right by me when I wasn’t looking. HOW in the world did that become the norm?
ETA-- Maybe it was a “Democracy is the worst form of government. Except for all of the others.” kind of thing?
“MPSIMS is the worst forum for…”
I have, but to be fair it was Disney Boards my wife was reading.
I could get on board with this. I see an awful lot of reports of some new poster posting looking for advice in GQ. And… yeah, that sounds like the right place. You shouldn’t need to read paragraphs of FAQs to make your first post.
And MPSIMS! The first post I read there was someone talking about losing their spouse. What a horrible name for the place. “Respondings” “Musing” “Other Thoughts”?
Yup, I think IMHO could be made clearer too - since asking advice is a common entry point for newbies, something like “IMHO: Advice & Opinions”.
But if we rearrange the furniture, I’ll bump into stuff, because I’m used to where everything is now!
If it were just a matter of appealing to the existing members, I would staunchly defend keeping everything (forum names, etc.) the same, because of all the history and tradition behind them.
But I’m open to being convinced—not yet convinced, but open—that it’s worth changing them to make the place more welcoming for visitors.
I agree with @Puzzlegal, who in turn was agreeing with @Riemann in that the forums are super non-intuitive, but especially with all the tension going on right now, don’t want to drive off any current posters as T_B brought up. We’re at an ugly tension point, and probably will be for a good while before we take any active steps to increase new readers.
So I was wondering, for those more familiar with Discourse Themes, if it would be possible to have our ‘new and clear’ set of names once decided upon and then a ‘SDMB classic theme’ in discourse that could preserve the ‘old’ names. Yes, I full acknowledge ahead of time that people would get confused if the various abbreviations/acronyms would therefore not match up, just trying to see if there was a way to do a tech fix (plausible or not) that would let people who were invested in the way it had always been to have it their way, while changing the default to something more open.