If my very vague memories are correct, it was about a female high school teacher getting hit on by a studly young student, and not putting her foot down hard and fast.
After a quick read-through it looks like I will be in the minority in my opinion on the matter but oh well. I think that the male teacher-female student/male student and female teacher/female student cases have remained fairly consistent. Reports of these cases have increased now that the media is focusing in on inappropriate teacher-student relationships but there has not been an explosion in the number of these cases. However, I disagree with posters who think that the number of cases of female teacher/male student relationships have not increased.
Based on my experiences in Jr. High through the end of High School, I can remember several cases where there were relationships between students and teachers. The only cases that were confirmed involved male teachers. The closest we ever came to a female teacher incident were a few rather serious dress code violations by young (low to mid twenties) teachers. Admittedly, most of the male teacher cases were completely swept away and only recently were a few actually brought to the greater public view.
For the most part, people within a given community are aware of teachers who have a history of inappropriate relationships with students. Why nothing happens is an entirely different discussion. In the case of young female teachers though, I do know that their population in the upper levels of schools has increased significantly. I went from 8th through 12th grade with only 3 early to mid twenties aged female teachers in my schools. We had 10 male teachers in the same age range that I can think of off the top of my head. Now, there are at least 8 female teachers in that range in the upper levels of my home district. The number of suspected cases involving these teachers has also increased.
Personally I just see it as a reflection of the increased number of young teachers. Despite current thoughts towards reporting these incidents being more favorable, I still see the quiet gossip technique prevailing.
Five or six years ago, in my swinging, bachelor days, when I was relatively active on AOL, my profile had “teacher” on it. You would not believe the amount of IMs and e-mails from high school girls around the country who would try to hook up with me. It got to a point where there was a good possiblity that the email would contain an utterly illegal picture that made me think the FBI would be knocking on my door. And I an not exaggerating. I was honestly terrified more than once that there was some sting going on. I never did anything, never instigated anything, and once I found out the age of whoever I was chatting with that ended right there. Hell, a couple different girls wanted to have sex in my classroom. Total fantasy for them. Most made sure I knew they were “18 and totally legal” - one 16 year old from Michigan even helpfully sent me a link to the age of consent laws in her state.
And most of them told me that they’d already slept with one or more of their teachers.
I’m not on AOL anymore.
So, yeah. Terrifying. This is why I am never, ever alone with a student in my room with the door closed. This stuff happens, and happens all the time. I don’t know how much actual sex occurs, but the opportunity is always, always there.
Frosted Glass, I can report anecdotally that we had a female-teacher-male-student scandal in my junior high school in the 70s. (8th grade.) The teacher was quietly dismissed. Today, it would be a huge media circus.
This isn’t The Pit so I cannot reply directly to An Arky.
I can say this. At 45, I am able to plan to go to a school board meeting in that district in the coming months. I will read a prepared statement.
Everyone sitting in that room will know his name and exactly what happened. I want the Board in that district to not assume it is okay to just be “passing the trash” ( which is the recognized phrase for transferring a sexual abuser who is a teacher without legal or in-district punishment ).
They need to know it isn’t other districts. It’s them. It was them, and if they are not open and honest and able to LISTEN to kids, it will be them again.
OtakuLoki, thank you for that post.
I’ts kind wierd now that I think about it, but it was pretty common in my high school in the late 80’s. There were at least 4 male teacher/female student relationships, and one female teacher/male student that I knew of. There was one stud of a guy teacher who would pick one girl each year, and there was some competition on the girls part to be picked, and some bragging rights involved. It was well known in the student body, and I can’t believe the staff could have been that oblivious. I guess it was part of the whole Colorado “If it ain’t your business, it ain’t your business” morality as long as it was concentual, it was ignored.
There were two cases of alleged unwanted stuff, and both teachers were gone instantly. (One case I knew the male teacher, and the female student who claim he reached down her shirt both very well. I put 99.999999% that she was a lying bitch, but he was gone instantly after the accusation anyway)
Another point is that the view of what is happening at the time may not be the same view that you will have in retrospect. The author John Irving has talked recently about he was sexually abused by a woman at the age of 11. Only at the time he thought he was in love and was an active participant. It was only later that he came to realize just how much it had fucked him up psychologically.
This may be a hijack, but did anyone catch that Dr. Phil episode with the teacher who was accused of sleeping with several young male students? It was just so odd. The former student they had on seemed so rational and the teacher so guilty, but then he failed the polygraph (which is not solid evidence, IMHO, but he was the third boy to do so).
There has definitely been an explosion in at least the reporting of female teacher-male student scandals, in part because it’s fantasy fodder for non-participants and the idea of a woman holding more power than even a teenage boy is still so alient to some readers/viewers.
Such an inquisition could well include questions like “did you do anything to encourage him/her?” or “did you enjoy it?” or “are you sexually active with anyone else?”
The first question is obviously not one that a child who is wondering if they did do something to deserve this is ready to hear. It’s likely to send them spinning through everything they have said or done around the teacher, trying to find something they did to encourage the abuse. There’s also the possibility that something they did without intending to have it lead to sexual abuse will be twisted to look like “they were asking for it”.
“Did you enjoy it?”, of course, brings up the old fallacy that if the victim responded physically to anything the abuser did, he or she must have wanted the abuse to happen. Absolute garbage, of course, but still believed by a disgustingly large number of people.
“Are you sexually active with anyone else?”- what teenager (or what adult, for that matter) wants someone scrutinizing every detail of their sex lives? If the victim is or has been sexually active with someone else, that information might be used to portray them as a slut who was “clearly asking for it”. Because, as we all know, anyone who fits some arbitrary definition of a slut is willing to have sex with just anyone, so they can’t be sexually abused or raped :rolleyes:
There are some other factors if the student being abused is male. (I don’t know if Cartooniverse is, btw)
If he’s being abused by a male teacher, there’s the “does that make me gay?” issue. That could well have been a huge deal at that time, and still would be to some students in some places- questioning your sexual orientation, which is a major part of who you are, is not easy even if you don’t harbor negative stereotypes of gay people. If you do, of course, it’s much worse. A male student being abused by a male teacher might also have to deal with homophobic parents, relatives, or friends, and their reaction to finding out that he had been involved in sexual activity with another man. Homophobia isn’t dead, and it certainly wasn’t then.
If he’s being abused by a female teacher, there are a lot of guys who would say, “what’s the problem?”- they’d assume that any teenage male would, of course, want to have sex with any woman who was reasonably attractive and willing to do so- the old “men can’t be raped by women” argument.
But you should realize that not all parents do this. There were and are parents out there who assume that if their kid has a disagreement with a teacher, the teacher, being an adult and an authority figure, must be right. There were and are parents out there who assume that any victim of sexual abuse or assault must have been doing something wrong to cause it, or that “that kind of thing doesn’t happen to good kids”. There were and are parents out there who assume that their kid must be making it up because “this is a good school, and that sort of thing doesn’t happen here” or “that teacher is so nice at PTA meetings, it’s hard to imagine him/her doing something like that”. If you think your parents are going to think you are lying or worse if you tell them about something like this, do you really think you’d feel comfortable telling them?
You’re welcome. I figured that it would be a difficult question for any victim to answer informatively. I’m glad that you feel I spoke well towards the subject.
In the 1920’s, my grandfather dated one of his students who was the same age as his oldest daughter. He divorced his wife, married the student and continued teaching at the same highschool. It upset the family at first, but they got over it and life went on.
Forty years ago, when I was in high school, we didn’t have Jerry Springer and Oprah to shine a spotlight on everybody’s secrets. Teachers dated and bedded students, and nobody made headlines of it. The only time anybody got in trouble was when a girl student got pregnant. Even then, it was hush-hush. The teacher and the girl were booted out with no fanfare, and nothing was in the paper. BTW, in those days, the idea of a pregnant girl remaining in school was unthinkable, preposterous.
At least two pretty teachers in my school were boffing boys every year. Were the other boys shocked? Hell, no. I was wishing it was me, and I’m sure most other boys did, too.
Interesting, perhaps. But as a depiction of a realistic situation that might be enlightening or instructional as applied to real student-teacher sexual interactions? Useless.
Thanks to all for your insights.
I’m kind of on the outside of the issue, other than being a parent, and I probably have too many misconceptions regarding it. Well that’s putting it lightly; what I don’t know would fill lots of thick books with thin pages. :o It’s really just damn frustrating. I want to be able to make it go away, for no kid to be in fear, for all abusers to be put away, but that’s naive, as the minds and actions of people are a bitch.
And Cartooniverse, I am very sorry I offended you. It was not at all my intent. I think you are very brave for what you are going to do, and I hope you make a difference.
Class of 79 here; a coach and a girl in my (senior) class dated & later married. Neither were at the 20 year reunion, but I understand they are still married.
VCNJ~
Another data point. High school in the early 1980s, and we had at least two male teachers and one female teacher who were known to have relationships with the students, and no one cared (except for the juicy gossip aspect of it all). The hot female teacher who was making the rounds (and even approached me but I was too naive to realize it at the time–damnit) didn’t get fired until she got caught in the act with the married principal.
Accepted most gratefully. The truth is that the upset you heard came out of 30 years of frustration over the fact that * I didn’t have a way to stop it cold* at the time. You pointed out thing I’ve had running around my brain for decades.
It hurt to read but I know you did not mean to make it personal- you were referring to a situation that was presented. No personal offense taken, upon reflection.