I said that taking a dump always results in smelly stuff coming out of your body.
Masturbating doesn’t always result in smelly stuff coming out of your body.
So, taking a dump has to be private (so as not to stink up the living room for everyone else), but masturbation doesn’t have to be private (since you are not ruining anyone’s “airspace”)
Why do we feel uncomfortable if two people french kiss next to us?
When someone is enjoying a good meal, a lot of times they forget about your existence, and it is sometimes a bit sloppy, but I don’t see why eating a good meal should be a private act?
I agree with Maastricht. Men are usually the ones who create religious law, but women are the guardians of what’s considered “proper” in a society. That way female masturbation is more likely to be deemed proper because the people who say it’s proper enjoy it. Immensely. The religious law in the west, the Bible, has barely anything about greasin the pole… only a story about a guy who jettisoned his baby batter in order to steal an inheritance. It’s quite clear the “stealing” is what pissed off El-Shaddai, not the vaginaless shuddering shangri-la. The lack of rules against beating the baloney shows that the men who wrote the Bible themselves enjoyed it. Immensely.
And how about this for non-constructively cynical?: Women don’t want men to masturbate because they want to have complete control of when and how much their husband’s get their much-needed orgasms. Label the act “disgusting” and now you can lead your guy around by his :wally
I would appreciate being disabused of this conjecture.
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Polerius was close when he compared masturbation to eating cake. the basic philosophy behind condemning masturbation is this
God gave us certain pleasures to enjoy on earth. some examples being food, rest, and sex. these pleasures become sins when one abuses them. when you abuse such gifts from god they become gluttony, slouth, and adultery. to masturbate usurps god’s gift of sexual pleasure to mankind and perverts it into a selfish act.
Polerius, I misunderstood you. You were trying to find a logic reason why the one behaviour can’t be engagd in in public and another one can. And you couldn’t find such a logic reason.
True. If social customs were invented for practical reasons, like contaminating other persons airspace, farting and sneezing should be considered much more intensely private then masturbation. So, as you said, no logic there.
I’m afraid the answer is “because”. Once an act is socially labeled as private, it is impolite to do it the presence of others. Ignoring that custom, and sitting at the dinnertable while French kissing, masturbating or nosepicking, effectively says to the other guests: “You’re not somebody whose feelings I have to take into account” or even worse “You’re not there”.
A friend of mine actually was insulted when we said that it made us uncomfortable that she was kissing and cuddling her boyfriend non stop in our company. She thought it had to do with us being “stuck-up”, jealous, disapproving of her boyfriend, or that we weren’t happy enough for her.
I had to explain that her petting her boyfriend just made me feel that they wanted me to go away so they’d could be alone together.
So, because. In the UK, making the V-sign (palms facing the audience) is a friendly sign. Making the same sign with the back of your hand facing the audience is the UK’s equavalent of the USA “giving someone the finger”. There’s no logic to that either. It’s just a social agreement that one sign is an insult, and the other means a shared triumph.
Yes, but this thread is about why the theologian picked out masturbation, spcifically as THE abuse and an usurpation. The Church has condemned gluttony and slouth, sure. But eating cake and taking afternoon naps have never been as fiercely prosecuted as masturbation has been. The question adressed in this thread is: why?
but they were bad enough to make into the list of the seven deadly sins. many sins are either an abuse or denial of god’s gifts and i wanted to show how masturbation fit in with this. and i did answer why. this answer is no different from the ones who told about the loss of sperm, this is just a different way of answering the questions. i merely thought that instead of just the problem with with wasted sperm, this is another reason jesus cries when you touch yourself! instead of accusing the church of political motives, i thought i would suggest a case where they interpreted the will of god.
by and by, no one has mentioned that back in the day people thought each ejaculation took a certain amount of time off your life. because it was the life essence.
nobody better call me a crazy religious person that’s the last thing i need and the least thing i am
Masturbation is artificial sex…
Your body is for the Lord!
The fact that masturbation is being compared to any cake I think shows how you’re wandering off course. Orgasm is the most intense pleasure that most humans ever experience. I remember reading that an Asian word (I don’t remember which language) for it translated as “the little death”. We’re talking pleasure that is described as rapturous. A number of ancient religions viewed orgasm as a spiritual event. The Church does not like competition.
Also, remember that God is for pain and against pleasure. When you want something from God, you have to buy it with pain (sacrifice a goat, forgo something that you like). The extreme example is the Christian belief that mankind’s salvation could be purchased by a painful death. Christ traded suffering for our soul’s and apparently God accepts suffering in the same way that drug dealers accept cash.
Forgoing masturbation is a sacrifice. You are making a downpayment on your heavenly reward; whereas, experiencing pleasure is like making a withdrawal from the account. For those who were raised Catholic, you should remember that, while married people are expected to have sex, they are not expected to enjoy it. In fact, it is sinful to get lustful pleasure from the act. It should be performed in the missionary position with an attitude of respectful reverence for God’s mysteries.
So let go of that ceiling fan and start thinking of ways you can suffer for God’s pleasure.
I believe the prohibition, religiously, is like all things religious. You take something that the masses do on a regular basis, and demonize it to the point that the magical sky pixie will punish them for all eternity for engaging in it. It makes them feel guilty about themselves, it makes them turn on their neighbors in an effort to minimize their own ‘transgressions’, and it keeps them in fear of something they can’t actually see or prove doesn’t exist.
If you want total control of people, teach them to be fearful of something that is all powerful, all knowing, everlasting, and that they can’t see. The only worry you have after that is if they figure out that the ‘Great and Powerful Oz’ is a smoke hologram and the short guy with the moustache in behind the curtain is really pulling the strings. Of course if you keep them mostly uneducated (as the underclass was throughout much of history) and unable to read, they’ll never be able to glean that there are reasons other than god for the sun coming up, the plants growing, etc.
It’s a marvelous invention. I wish I’d thought of it first.
It’s a start, but it’s not devious enough. Better: Teach them that when they experience pain that it is an investment in a future reward that is better than anything that they have ever experienced. All they need is to do what you say and to suffer their pain without complaint. And make sure that you support them while they suffer their pain. You have to empathize without actually trying to help.
If you pull it off, not only will they do what you say, but they’ll fucking love you for it. They’ll start looking for ways to hurt themselves just to please you. And you will love them because of the way they suffer.
Fear of punishment is a start, but it’s not as great of a behavior modifier as anticipation of areward. I can tell you you’ll probably never get my kids to clean their rooms by threatening them. But if you’ve got candy, negotiations can begin immediately.
The religious law in the west, the Bible, has barely anything about greasin the pole… only a story about a guy who jettisoned his baby batter in order to steal an inheritance. It’s quite clear the “stealing” is what pissed off El-Shaddai, not the vaginaless shuddering shangri-la. 
The lack of rules against beating the baloney shows that the men who wrote the Bible themselves enjoyed it. Immensely.