Last three replies: noted.
Thank you.
ETA if you and your wife do go to a marriage counselor be prepared to be unpleasantly surprised. Marriage counselling can be rough for both parties. There(should)will be rules about who gets to talk etc. You will probably hear some things you don’t like and will have to wait your turn to respond.
I found it to be a painful eye opener, but one that, while it ultimately did not save my marriage did help me improve all of my other relationships (not speaking figuratively here)
I suspect it could be this:
There may not have been a specific incident because things may never have been right with the marriage.
This seriously disturbs me.
Partly that at the start of your marriage she was so uncertain of herself that she apologized to you for something that you had done.
Mostly because you appear to have liked her better as a person who was so timid and uncertain that she apologized for things that other people had done.
What I find confusing about this is the pants. Did either kwc or Mrs. kwc consider it a problem if he saw her without pants? And are we talking panties or outerwear pants, e.g., jeans/sweats?
I can possible see a scenario where a guy bursts into the bedroom while female companion is totally naked and saying, “Oops! Didn’t mean to bust in on you while you were in your birthday suit!” But that would be just politeness, not the same as if the cable guy burst in and saw her naked.
But if she was otherwise clothed except for jeans/slacks, why was it deemed necessary for anyone to apologize to anyone? These are married people with children. Presumably nakedness is a thing they engage in.
And, as mentioned, why did she apologize? Was she saying, “I’m sorry, I’m not ready yet” or “I’m sorry I’m taking so long to get dressed” or “I’m sorry I have exposed my nakedness (partial or total) to you at a time when we’re not being sexual”?
Can anyone (OP or someone else) sort this out for me?
Sometimes I fail to see the blatantly obvious.
Is it that big of a deal? “Sorry you caught a glimpse of my butt-crack, you probably weren’t expecting that.”
I remember joking with my sister how goofy I thought that was that she’d apologize for partially mooning me.
I think you guys are going way too far in analyzing this.
Nice people apologize all the time for stuff that isn’t their fault.
There’s a whole country in the north….
Exactly. She’s a sweetheart.
It wasn’t clear to me, probably due to my misreading, that laying down the law referred to his wife, not kids. That said, of course I understand that children need clear boundaries and rules, having raised two very independent and functional adults.
I still find the langue cringe-worthy, even for kids, but that’s my perspective that all may not share.
That seems so odd. Married people see each other naked all the time.
It’s not language I would use. I never thought of myself as “laying down the law” to my kids. I might snatch them out of the road and punish them for it, but after the excitement had passed, I’d always tell the kids WHY the rules were important. And honestly, even so, I feel like we were too strict with the older kid.
But it’s not language that strikes me as obviously outside of the acceptable norms for child-rearing, either.
I agree, especially as the OP’s original post was about being unhappy about the unilateral decisions that his wife has made.
Not much advice to add to all the good advice above, but just to comment that it’s a huge red flag to me that your wife’s “superior” in the essential oils scam, er, scheme, is the one pushing her into it. That woman’s incentive is to make herself more money, and your wife’s financial success will not be her priority. I would hope you could gently steer her into seeing this.
Lots of red flags here. The bible studies are probably brainwashing her, and her “plan” is to get scammed by an MLM company (though she doesn’t know it yet). IMO things are going to get worse if she continues with these. Personally, I have little tolerance for this kind of BS. YMMV.
I’m literal-minded and detail-oriented. I want to understand exactly what I’m reading. So sue me. 
This thread is ABOUT communication. I didn’t understand something, and I asked for clarification. A couple of times. From the OP I get:
No, in absolute terms, it’s NOT that big of a deal. Frankly, within the context of my own personal life, it matters not at all. But I asked for clarification. “Is it that big of a deal?” is not the right response to someone who is asking you a serious question.
I even said at the end of my post:
So, in a way, that was ME apologizing (or at least waffling) for seeking information.
Just ponder this exchange, @kwc27.
Men also, in your experience?
(And I wouldn’t count the ‘I’m so sorry!’ on hearing about, say, a death or a car accident. That’s not an apology.)
– if what she said was in effect ‘whoops, sorry for mooning you’, as in ‘I wouldn’t have shoved my ass right in your face without warning if I’d realized you were there’, that’s one thing. But if what she did was in effect to apologize for being naked in her own bedroom without having locked the door against her own husband, that’s something else entirely. And, yes, about communications: I really can’t tell which of those things happened.
True… I guess where I was coming from is that there’s often a lot of… institutional(?) pressure from the MLM organization to sell more/recruit more, but there’s also this ready-made community where they may have some fringey/out there beliefs and all reinforce each other on it. Most of those MLM businesses are really centered around recruiting because most people want to have stock on hand to sell right away, and that’s how the mothership makes their money. Some even require a certain level of stock buy-in, even if it is refundable later. They don’t necessarily make their money from ongoing sales to the general public, but rather to their own people.
If I had to guess, it’s some sort of peer-pressure thing, where if you’re part of the business, you’re expected to be part of the gang so to speak, and you can’t really be “in” within the business if you’re not “in” the gang. While it’s not a cult, it’s got some definite cult-like aspects to it.
I imagine with selling essential oils, there’s a pretty good dose of being expected to walk the talk, so to speak, with respect to all that wellness woo and “natural” bullshit. Like you’re not a credible essential oils saleswoman if you take your kids to the doctor instead of giving them an essential oil enema or something. Some piece of that is probably also tied into being a stay-at-home mom as well.
Why would she apologize, and not you? Presumably you would want to see your wife in various states of undress, not have her apologizing for showing you her un-pantsed butt and legs?
Sounds to me like marriage counseling would be an excellent idea here. Basically, they’ll listen to you together, then each of you separately, and then work with you from there, both together and apart to get you on the same page about what the issues in your marriage are.
Kids are often a huge disruptor of marriages. Things that weren’t a big deal as unmarried couples suddenly take on more prominence to one or the other of the couple, and if you don’t communicate that, it ends up festering over time, and causing problems from there on out, unless you clean it out via talking and fix the issue that caused it. That’s what the counseling would hopefully accomplish.
Several of us wondered about this upthread. The OP said,
The OP noted that his wife is an extremely conservative Christian, and described her as an “old school gal.” I would not be surprised if she has been taught that there’s innate sinfulness in nudity, and that one should be seen naked (even by one’s spouse) as little as possible.
Very true.
I like essential oils for the smells - though I do eucalyptus in vapor for plugged sinuses. I have a friend who makes candles and she made me one that was sandalwood/bamboo that is very lovely and relaxing, not sure what they theoretically do, I just like the smell.
Wrong. Read my previous posts. You folks sure beat a simple nonchalant, meant to be humorous comment like a dead horse. And, yes, I hope someone gets offended by the “beat the comment like it’s a dead horse” comment.
Still appreciating most of the feedback though.