Here’s a theory: women don’t date nice guys because they think they don’t deserve them.
This is not universally true, but it’s certainly true in some cases. It was true in mine, up until recently.
Naturally, I didn’t think consciously that I didn’t deserve this man who was so nice to me, but I somehow managed to sabotage my relationship with every nice guy who came along. The jerks, naturally, I kept around longer, usually until they got rid of me. (Ouch. I can’t believe I just admitted that in public.)
I sabotaged by not letting the nice guys do nice things for me. It’s extremely frustrating, apparently, to like a woman and try to be nice to her, only to have all your nice gestures rebuffed. I have managed to mostly stop doing this, which makes my husband (the King of Nice Guys, I believe) very happy.
I’m afraid this isn’t all that helpful to the nice guys out there, though. I had to get to a better mental place all by myself, and if anyone had suggested to me flat out that I thought I didn’t deserve them being nice, I would have bristled in a way that makes porcupines look soft and cuddly.
A lot of chicks are psychologically screwed and masochistic. HEAPS have low self esteem. Of course these types are so much more appealing to guys than ballsy confident women who can’t be bossed around and aren’t looking for a protector.
Here I am, thinking that the world is full of interesting, different individuals, but really, the human race is only a binary concept, with behaviours, desires, opinions, etc all dependent on chromosomes, genetalia or gender. Stupid me, what was I thinking ?
Last night on the news they said that a recent survey (yes, another one) showed that 76% of men would not get serious about a woman who had sex on the first date.
Good to see that the sexual double-standard is still with us. Morons.
I read the first article completely and kind of skimmed the other two (short attention span…) but Surprise) I kind of agree. Except that the term “nice guy” could have been interchanged with “door mat” Respoect is a huge factor in dating. If a guy fore goes concert tickets to move my crap from another guys apt, well what a great guy but it doesn’t guarentee a romantic relationship is going to ensue…as a matter of fact at that vulnberable point, I would probably be in no condition to start a relationship anyway so it would probably ensure there would be no relatiosnhip other than a friendship.
If a man doesn’t respect himself how is a woman supposed to respect him? Same goes for a woman…if a girl doesn’t respect herself a guy won’t either. I think “acting” like you don’t like someone is kind of bullshit. You shouldn’t play head games but at the same time, kind of keep it in check…don’t say too much too fast, that overwhelms anyone and if a girl thinks she’s got a guy bagged she stops trying.
The quickest way to chase me away is to be too much too fast. Too possessive, too jealous, around too often…but I hate players too. I want a guy who is independent and has his own life and his own things going on but I don’t want him romancing half of the other women in town the same way, I want to feel
special. Is that what you were asking?
You haven’t actually met any real men, have you? Sounds to me like you’ve been hanging out with post-pubescent boys too much. Real men adore “ballsy confident women who can’t be bossed around”. Post-pubescent boys don’t.
I’m still scratching my head over this one. Does this mean the “sexual revolution” is over? Does this mean that more men are waiting to have sex? Would 76% of women “not get serious” about a man who had sex on the first date?
Like I say, I’m still stumped about this one. Not enough information to “prove” that double standards still exist, IMHO.
For example, i’d be willing to bet that many of these same men are happy to have sex on the first date. And i’d also wager that plenty of these same men would not see their own willingness to do this as any impediment to their ability to be a good long-term boyfriend or husband.
That is, i believe it is a double-standard when people draw a direct link between a woman’s willingness to have sex and her potential as a long-term mate, but do not make the same connection when it comes to men.
I suppose you’re right, mhendo. What I was thinking was, if 76% of women said the same about men, then it wouldn’t be so much of a double-standard as a comment about the value of sex in a relationship. Personally, I’m surprised 76% of men said that myself, but, hey, I’m a bit hazy on the concept of “first date,” let alone “sex on the first date.”
Degrance I would suggest that all that those studies prove is that studies are very poor indicators of what people really want. I frankly think that that kind of study is doomed to failure because so many of us don’t know what the hell we want. For example, I’ve had to realize that, despite how much I care for my SO, the relationship that I’m in is not what I want. But if someone had taken a study of me back in April, I would have said it was what I wanted. These things change too easily.
wolfgrrl said " My theory has always been that we’re drawn to jerks because we know what we’re getting."
While I don’t think that’s quite true (well, I hope not!) I think it points in the direction of the truth. MY theories about what women would find appealing in men (as a guy, mind you, but this is based on what I’ve heard from women on this board and elsewhere) are:
Honesty
Confidence
Assertiveness
Respectful
Not necessarily in that order, yes, and there are of course many other qualities that I’ve left out, but I’m using these to make a point: those jerks that you see “getting all the women” may be assholes, but let’s face it; they satisfy three out of four of the above criteria. Nice Guys satisfy NONE of the above. They are wimps with no self-esteem, and they are not respectful. That’s right, a Nice Guy is NOT being respectful. Respect is not just about opening doors and not swearing in polite company; it’s about recognizing the other individual’s personhood and requisite ability to take care of themselves and not need to be sheltered from Evil, like, oh, profanity or puddles in the street. Nice Guys don’t have the same kind of disrespect as an Asshole, but it’s there; it’s just more insidious.
I disagree. While jerks might be “assertive,” I would not say they have the characteristics of “honesty,” “confidence,” and “respectfulness.”
People with real confidence do not need to push people around, that in fact is a sign of an inferiority complex, which you often see in bullies. As for “respectfulness,” how could you say they respect women? Surely they don’t think women need to be sheltered - in fact, they almost try to manipulate women by stomping on their self-respect. Women with low self-esteem are a lot more easy to control than ones with high self-esteem. They are far less respectful to women than nice guys.
I apologize for this in advance; I can’t help myself:
Jean: Girls flirt with the dangerous guy, but they don’t bring him home… I married a good guy. Logan: I can be the good guy. Jean: Logan, good guys stick around.
Women often say that they can spot confidence when they see it, and that this is why they’re drawn to jerks. I think these women give themselves too much credit. A female friend of mine opined that women think they can spot a confident man, but often mistake aggressiveness and bravado for true confidence.
No way Melanie. Psychologically screwed women are a turn off to men, they are trouble and its just not attractive.
re the broader topic “women dont like nice guys” bit I dont buy it at all and I think the guys that say this are just being whiney bitches. Everyone likes nice people if the nice is real and not a codeword for manipulative bullshit. Nice is good.
