Writers Guild of America goes on strike (5/2/23) tentative deal (9/25/23) Now accepted (10/9/23)

(I guess this thread is about AI now.)

Ok, it doesn’t even succeed as absurdist comedy. It’s just terrible. But that’s my opinion. The fact is, the studios aren’t interested in absurdist takes on their shows. They want a filmable 22 minute script that people will want to watch. This isn’t that.

I know shitting on Friends is a popular thing for people on this board to do when they want to seem smarter than they are. “I would never sully my brain with such plebian entertainment as ‘Friends’. In fact I do not own a—how do you say it----te-le-vision. Now excuse me, I must catch the Viscounts zeppelin on which I shall discuss philosophy with Wittgenstein and Russell.” But the fact is writing a watchable episode of Friends is hard. Try it. You have established characters who have to react to things in a consistent way, while telling a story that threads the needle between familiar and novel.

I think AI will eventually become a boon for lawyers and high school students who would rather meet their friends by the creek than write a paper on Rosa Parks. But it will never master creative writing. It does not have memory, experience, or imagination. It does not know what it likes because it doesn’t have likes. And no matter how fast or accurate it gets, it will never be human.

At no point did I say anything that you are arguing towards me about. Someone asked if anyone had tried to use ChatGPT to generate a script. I said I had, and provided one example. That’s it. I never said ChatGPT could produce production-level scripts. I never said mine was a production-level script. I merely said I’d love to see the cast act out the little vignette I had. Keep flailing at that straw man of yours all that you want, but you are arguing alone.

You don’t enjoy the unintended humor in those outputs. I get it. You’ve made that very clear. I find them laugh-out-loud hilarious, and remain flabbergasted that a current AI can write them as comprehendably and cohesively as they do. In fact, here are more I generated back in December.

Write a script for an episode of Mister Roger’s Neighborhood where Mister Rogers gets in a bar fight with Bob Ross and is arrested by Andy Taylor

Summary

INT. MISTER ROGERS’ NEIGHBORHOOD - DAY

Mister Rogers is sitting on his couch, surrounded by his puppet friends, when a knock on the door is heard.

Mister Rogers: (smiling) Oh, I wonder who could that be?

He opens the door to reveal Bob Ross, the happy little painter.

Bob Ross: (smiling) Hello, Mister Rogers. I thought I’d drop by and say hi.

Mister Rogers: (smiling) Well, hello there, Bob. It’s so nice to see you.

Bob Ross: (smiling) Yeah, it’s great to see you too.

Suddenly, Bob Ross’ smile turns into a scowl.

Bob Ross: (angrily) But I have to say, I’m not too happy with you, Mister Rogers.

Mister Rogers: (confused) Why, whatever do you mean?

Bob Ross: (angrily) You know exactly what I mean. You’ve been stealing my ideas for your show.

Mister Rogers: (surprised) Stealing your ideas? That’s not true, Bob. I would never do that.

Bob Ross: (angrily) Oh, really? Then explain why you have a pet goldfish named Goldie, just like I do.

Mister Rogers: (stammering) Well, that’s just a coincidence. I didn’t even know you had a goldfish named Goldie.

Bob Ross: (enraged) Enough with the lies, Mister Rogers. You’re a plagiarist and I won’t stand for it any longer.

Mister Rogers: (sternly) Now hold on a minute, Bob. I don’t appreciate you accusing me of something I didn’t do.

Bob Ross: (furious) I don’t care what you appreciate. I’m going to teach you a lesson.

With that, Bob Ross lunges at Mister Rogers, tackling him to the ground. The two men begin to fight, with Bob Ross throwing punches and Mister Rogers trying to defend himself.

Just then, the door bursts open and Andy Taylor, the town sheriff, enters the room.

Andy Taylor: (yelling) Stop right there! This is the law, and I’m arresting both of you for disturbing the peace.

Mister Rogers and Bob Ross freeze in their tracks, realizing they’ve gone too far.

Andy Taylor: (to Mister Rogers and Bob Ross) You two have some explaining to do down at the station.

Mister Rogers and Bob Ross look at each other sheepishly, knowing they’ve let their emotions get the best of them.

Mister Rogers: (to Bob Ross) I’m sorry, Bob. I never meant to upset you.

Bob Ross: (to Mister Rogers) I’m sorry too, Mister Rogers. I let my anger get the best of me.

Andy Taylor: (to Mister Rogers and Bob Ross) Come on, let’s go.

Mister Rogers and Bob Ross follow Andy Taylor out of the room, with their puppet friends watching in shock and disappointment.

Moral of the story: It’s important to communicate and resolve conflicts peacefully, instead of resorting to violence.

Write a script for an episode of Rick and Morty where Rick comes out of the closet

Summary

Title: “Coming Out of the Closet Dimension”

Scene: Rick’s garage, Rick is tinkering with a new invention

Rick: (to himself) I can’t believe I’ve been hiding this for so long. I’m tired of living a lie. I need to tell them.

Morty: (enters the garage) Hey, Rick, what are you working on?

Rick: (nervously) Uh, just a new invention, Morty. Listen, I need to talk to you and your family.

Morty: (confused) Okay, Rick. Is everything alright?

Rick: (deep breath) Yes and no, Morty. You see, I’ve been keeping a secret from you all. I’m gay.

Morty: (surprised) Oh, Rick. That’s… that’s great. I’m happy for you.

Rick: (relieved) Really, Morty? You’re not upset or disgusted?

Morty: (smiling) No way, Rick. I love you no matter what. And I’m sure the rest of the family will feel the same way.

Rick: (tearful) Thank you, Morty. That means a lot to me.

Morty: (hugs Rick) Come on, let’s go tell the family.

Scene: The family is gathered in the living room

Morty: (to the family) Hey, everyone, Rick has something to tell you.

Rick: (standing up) I’m gay. (looks around nervously)

Beth: (smiling) That’s great, Rick. We love you no matter what.

Summer: (excited) Oh my gosh, does this mean we can go to pride parades with you?

Jerry: (awkwardly) Uh, yeah, sure. That’s great, Rick.

Rick: (tearful) Thank you, everyone. I’m so relieved you’re accepting of me.

Morty: (to Rick) See, Rick. We’re your family and we support you no matter what.

Rick: (smiling) Thanks, Morty. Let’s go on an adventure and celebrate my coming out.

Scene: Rick, Morty, and the rest of the family are having a blast at a pride parade.

Rick: (to Morty) Thanks for being there for me, Morty. I couldn’t have done it without you.

Morty: (smiling) Anytime, Rick. You’re like a crazy, old grandfather to me.

Rick: (laughs) And you’re like the annoying, little grandson I never knew I wanted.

The End.

Write a transcript for an Andy Griffith Show episode where Andy and his friends stage an intervention for Opie about his chronic masturbation.

Summary

Andy: Opie, we need to talk to you about something serious.

Opie: What is it, Pa?

Andy: We’ve noticed that you’ve been spending a lot of time alone in your room lately, and we’re worried about you.

Opie: Why? I’m just playing with my toys.

Andy: Opie, we’re not talking about toys. We’re talking about something called chronic masturbation.

Opie: What’s that?

Andy: It’s when a person spends too much time touching themselves in a private area of their body. It’s not healthy, and it’s not normal.

Opie: But I don’t know what you’re talking about.

Andy: We’re talking about your behavior, Opie. And we’re here to help you stop.

Barney: Yeah, Opie. We’re all worried about you.

Aunt Bee: It’s not natural for a young boy to be spending so much time by himself.

Opie: But I don’t know what you’re talking about.

Andy: Opie, we’re not judging you. We just want you to know that there’s help available if you need it.

Opie: But I don’t need help.

Andy: Opie, please. We’re just trying to look out for your best interests.

Opie: Okay, okay. I’ll try to stop.

Andy: That’s all we can ask for. Let’s all work together to help you overcome this problem.

Opie: I’ll do my best.

Andy: That’s all we can ask for. Let’s all work together to help you overcome this problem.

Write a script of an anime about epileptic squirrels.

Summary

“Epileptic Squirrels”

Narrator: In a world filled with strange and wondrous creatures, one group stands out - the epileptic squirrels.

Scene 1:

We see a group of squirrels running and playing in a forest.

Narrator: These squirrels may look like any other squirrels, but they have a special condition - epilepsy.

Suddenly, one of the squirrels falls to the ground, convulsing.

Narrator: When they have a seizure, they lose control of their body and can’t move or speak.

The other squirrels rush to help, bringing the convulsing squirrel some water and calming it down.

Narrator: Despite their condition, the epileptic squirrels have learned to live with their seizures and even support each other through them.

Scene 2:

We see the squirrels gathering food and storing it for the winter.

Narrator: The squirrels have to be extra careful in preparing for the cold season, as their seizures can be triggered by stress or lack of food.

One of the squirrels has a seizure while collecting nuts, but the others quickly come to its aid and make sure it has enough to eat.

Narrator: Despite their challenges, the epileptic squirrels continue to thrive and live their lives to the fullest.

Scene 3:

We see the squirrels enjoying a sunny day in the forest, playing and laughing together.

Narrator: The epileptic squirrels may face hardships, but they never lose their sense of community and joy. They are a true inspiration to us all.

Write a script for an episode of V: the series.

Summary

INT. V MOTHERSHIP - COMMAND CENTER

Lisa, the Visitor leader, sits at the main console. She looks up as Diana enters.

Lisa: Diana, what news do you bring?

Diana: The resistance has discovered our true nature and is planning an attack on the ship.

Lisa: We must be prepared. Gather all available soldiers and activate the defense systems.

Diana: Yes, Lisa.

Lisa: And Diana, make sure to send a team to capture the human, Julie Parrish. She is the leader of the resistance and must be stopped at all costs.

Diana: I will see to it personally.

INT. RESISTANCE HIDEOUT

Julie and her team are frantically preparing for the attack.

Julie: We have to move fast. The Visitors are planning to strike first.

Ham: Julie, we can’t take on their entire army. We need backup.

Julie: I know, but we don’t have any other choice. We have to fight for our freedom.

Mike: We’re ready. Let’s do this.

INT. V MOTHERSHIP - COMMAND CENTER

Lisa and Diana are strategizing with their soldiers.

Lisa: We will surround the resistance hideout and take them out quickly and efficiently.

Diana: And I will personally capture Julie and bring her to you.

Lisa: Excellent. Begin the attack.

INT. RESISTANCE HIDEOUT

The resistance team fights valiantly against the Visitor soldiers, but they are vastly outnumbered.

Julie: We can’t hold them off much longer. We have to retreat.

Ham: But where can we go?

Mike: The tunnels. We can use the tunnels to escape.

The team quickly makes their way to the tunnels, but Diana is hot on their trail.

Diana: Give up, Julie. You cannot escape.

Julie: I’ll never give up. I will fight for my freedom until the end.

Diana and Julie engage in a fierce hand-to-hand combat, but Diana ultimately overpowers Julie and takes her captive.

INT. V MOTHERSHIP - COMMAND CENTER

Lisa stands over Julie, who is tied up and restrained.

Lisa: You have caused us much trouble, Julie. But now, you will pay for your actions.

Julie: You may have captured me, but the resistance will never stop fighting. We will never give up.

Lisa: We shall see. Take her away.

The Visitor soldiers drag Julie away as she continues to defiantly stare at Lisa.

Lisa: The resistance may have temporarily halted our plans, but we will not be defeated. We will continue to strive for domination over this planet.

The episode ends with a chilling shot of Lisa’s determined face as the camera fades to black.

Write the script for a musical about Yoda

Summary

(Note: This script is a rough outline and could be fleshed out further with more songs and dialogue)

Act 1:

(Opening number: “The Force is Strong”)

Narrator: In a galaxy far, far away, the forces of good and evil are constantly at odds. At the heart of this struggle is the Jedi Order, guardians of peace and justice in the galaxy. One such Jedi is a small, wise, and powerful being named Yoda.

(Song: “Yoda’s Theme”)

Yoda: I am Yoda, small and green, but do not let my size deceive.
For I am one of the greatest Jedi, ever to have lived, you’ll see.
I have trained many a young padawan, to become Jedi knights,
And now it’s time for me to train you, if you’re ready to fight.

(Scene: Yoda is training Luke Skywalker on Dagobah)

Yoda: (to Luke) You must unlearn what you have learned. Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is.

(Song: “Unlearn What You Have Learned”)

Luke: I’ve always relied on my size and strength,
But now I see that’s not the way.
I must unlearn what I’ve learned,
And let go of what I think I know.

Yoda: You must embrace the Force within,
And let it guide your every step.
Only then will you be ready,
To face the challenges that lie ahead.

Act 2:

(Song: “The Dark Side Calls”)

Darth Vader: (singing) The dark side calls to me,
I cannot resist its power.
I will embrace the darkness,
And rule the galaxy in hour.

Yoda: (to Luke) Beware of the dark side, Luke. Anger, fear, aggression. The dark side of the Force are they. Easily they flow, quick to join you in a fight. If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny.

(Scene: Yoda and Luke are confronted by Darth Vader)

Darth Vader: I am your father, Luke. Join me and we can rule the galaxy together.

Yoda: (to Luke) You must make the choice, Luke. The good path or the dark.

(Song: “The Choice”)

Luke: I don’t know what to do,
The dark side is so alluring.
But I know in my heart,
That the good path is enduring.

Yoda: Trust in the Force, Luke,
And let it guide your way.
The choice is yours,
But choose wisely, my young Jedi.

(Scene: Luke chooses to turn away from the dark side and defeats Darth Vader)

Act 3:

(Song: “Yoda’s Farewell”)

Yoda: (to Luke) It is time for me to leave this world, my young padawan.
But know that the Force will always be with you.
Remember all that I have taught you,
And use it to bring peace and justice to the galaxy.

Luke: I will honor your teachings, Master Yoda.
I will carry on your legacy.
Thank you for everything.

“Write the script for a sitcom about Gilgamesh”

Summary

(Opening shot: A shot of the exterior of a small, run-down apartment building. Cut to a shot of the inside of the apartment, where we see Gilgamesh, a lanky young man with messy hair and a perpetual look of confusion on his face, sitting on the couch and staring blankly at the TV.)

Gilgamesh: (sighing) Another day, another epic quest for me to fumble my way through.

(Cut to a shot of the door opening and a woman, Enkidu, entering the apartment. She is a tough, no-nonsense type with short hair and a stern expression.)

Enkidu: Hey Gil, you ready for your shift at the bar tonight?

Gilgamesh: (groaning) Do I have to? Can’t I just stay here and watch reruns of “The Mythical Adventures of Hercules”?

Enkidu: (rolling her eyes) No, you can’t. You need to pay rent, and the only way you’re going to do that is by working.

Gilgamesh: (pouting) Fine. But if I have to deal with one more drunken demigod trying to pick a fight with me, I’m quitting.

(Cut to a shot of Gilgamesh and Enkidu walking into the bar, where they are greeted by their boss, the gruff and impatient Utnapishtim.)

Utnapishtim: (yelling) Gilgamesh, Enkidu, get your butts in gear! We’ve got a full house tonight and I need you two to be on your A-game.

Gilgamesh: (nervously) Yes, sir. We’ll do our best.

(As the night wears on, Gilgamesh and Enkidu struggle to keep up with the demands of the crowded bar. Gilgamesh spills drinks, drops trays, and generally makes a mess of things, while Enkidu tries to keep things running smoothly.)

Enkidu: (frustrated) Gil, can you please focus for just one minute?

Gilgamesh: (sheepishly) Sorry, I’m just a little overwhelmed.

Enkidu: (sighing) It’s okay. Just try to stay calm and pay attention to what you’re doing.

(As the night comes to a close, Gilgamesh finally gets the hang of things and manages to finish his shift without any major mishaps. He and Enkidu collapse onto the couch, exhausted.)

Gilgamesh: (smiling) Thanks for sticking with me, Enkidu. I couldn’t have done it without you.

Enkidu: (laughing) No problem. Just don’t get too cocky. There’s always tomorrow night to worry about.

(Cut to the closing shot of Gilgamesh and Enkidu sitting on the couch, smiling and laughing at the TV.)

Yes, those are all very cute. But they aren’t anything that anyone would want to watch.

I do have to apologize to you though. I replied to you but I was mostly responding to @k9bfriender

Irrespective of what you (generic you) personally want your retirement fund to do, or what your interpretation is of what it’s doing, why should society as a whole think that your preferences about your retirement fund are more important or higher-priority than workers’ preferences about their employment?

If striking workers are to be characterized as just a bunch of useless whiners demanding that their wishes be satisfied at other people’s expense, ISTM that that goes double for retirees whining that the companies they’ve put money into should do whatever makes the most money for their lazy-codger asses, and to hell with the workforce. At least the workers are earning that money by their efforts, not just sitting around living on unearned income from investments.

Sure, everybody’s got the right to advocate for their own financial self-interest, but no one group’s financial self-interest should be automatically prioritized over everyone else’s. If writers wanting higher salaries and more job security are just being selfish and greedy, then retirees wanting higher corporate profits to increase their retirement fund payouts are just being selfish and greedy too.

According to GRR Martin, they haven’t:
https://georgerrmartin.com/notablog/2023/05/08/writers-on-set/

He doesn’t explicitly say so, but given the complete lack of any mention of AI, clearly he thinks that is not the most important issue here.

In short, GRR thinks that mini-rooms completely killed the opportunity for advancement for writers. Instead of being on set, interacting with the actors and production crew, and generally taking part in the whole production, they’re literally stuck in a room, disconnected from everything. And when they’re finished, they leave and go do something else. No opportunity to gain relevant skills and take on more ambitious roles.

It seems shortsighted on the part of the producers. The mini-room approach might be a bit cheaper, but you aren’t training the next generation of people.

…GRR Martin literally talks about “the so-called “mini rooms” that the Guild is hoping to abolish” which means they have adapted because they really didn’t have a choice, but they aren’t a good thing for the industry, and the guild is fighting to get rid of them for all of the reasons I outlined in the post you quoted from.

I never argued that it was. I spent a long time talking about it though because some people had the impression that the writers room was just writers “literally stuck in a room, disconnected from everything”, and that an AI could easily replace it. I pointed out over a series of posts that writers are “on set, interacting with the actors and production crew, and generally taking part in the whole production”.

Sucking it up isn’t really “adaption”, IMO. Adaption would be finding workarounds for the restrictions in their environment. It doesn’t seem like that’s happened. And maybe I missed it, but you didn’t seem to get into any specifics for why mini-rooms in particular are bad for the industry.

GRRM seems to think that’s not happening, or at least not happening nearly to the same extent as it used to (i.e., when he was in the midst of it). For example:

In many cases they won’t be asked to set even when the episodes they wrote are being filmed. (They may be ALLOWED on set, if the showrunner and execs are cool with that, but only as a visitor, with no authority, no role. And no pay, of course. They may even be told they are not allowed to speak to the actors).

That doesn’t sound like a really high level of interaction to me.

In case it’s not obvious, I’m not arguing here that AI is an easy drop-in here. Quite the opposite: if GRRM is to be believed, producers have kinda screwed themselves with the creation of these mini-rooms, and need to take several steps back and give the writers a greater role in production.

I am curious what forces drove them in this direction. “Capitalism bad” isn’t very informative. But I can imagine that the people in charge might see an advantage in a “modular” system where they can spin up a small group of writers, have them churn out some work, then dismiss them just as easily. Maybe convenient in the short term, but at the expense of your talent base in the long term.

…it was a single sentence response that you’ve taken out of context. Mini-rooms exist. They’ve existed for a while. Writers have been complaining about them for a while. Its one of the many things that the writers have compromised on since the start of the pandemic. And its one of the many reasons why they’ve decided to take strike action.

Because I didn’t need too.

Do you know what “in many cases” means?

And do you understand that my posts were talking about the “traditional model” prior to the start of the pandemic when the studios made their move to try to get writers banned from set?

I’ve already laid out the timeline.

Its not just GRRM. And it isn’t just mini-rooms. Its every other writer in the guild. Its why they have gone on strike. And I’ve laid that all out already at length.

Then I suggest you read what John Rogers had to say that I’ve already quoted from at length. Its the very same reason why Elon Musk can’t help from fucking up, why Zuckerberg spent billions on the “metaverse”, why Uber still can’t make a profit unless they fiddle the books.

Just read what the writers have to say. The executives are entirely disconnected from the creative process. They don’t understand it, they’ve never taken part in it, they wouldn’t know a writer from a gaffer. Its all numbers to them. From today:

That fits in exactly with the scenario I laid out in an earlier post which was based on everything we’ve observed over the last few years, and everything the writers have been telling us.

It isn’t rational. It isn’t a “modular system”, the executives aren’t actually smart enough to come up with a working system. Its the same thing as “pivot to video.” Its the same thing that bought down Buzzfeed News, that bought down Vice. It a handful of people who don’t actually understand anything who have been given millions of dollars to extract as much wealth as they can before everything falls over.

You either don’t understand how artificial intelligence works, or you don’t understand how human intelligence works. This is factually, objectively, and incontrovertibly false.

I don’t see how it was a very good response to what I said either.

Other than getting a couple of poorly veiled insults in because I dared to say bad things about Friends, nothing you said related to what I said.

I will respond to this, though.

Never is a long, long, long time. Anyone thinking that what ChatGPT, a generalized AI, is putting out, and thinking that that is the limit is seriously underestimating things like progress.

AIs are getting better, every day. AI’s are also getting more specialized. What you saw came from a general chatbot, not an AI specialized in writing scripts.

Are you sure that what you say will be true in 5 years? 10 years? 20? Forever’s a long, long time.

Actually, high school students should be learning to use AI to leverage their abilities. Those who learn to work with AI will do far better than those who think that it will never be useful.

It’ll never be human, sure. But that doesn’t mean that it won’t one day be better than humans. If you want to say that it won’t be better than humans in the next 5 years, then that’s a reasonable prediction. The further out you go, the less reasonable that prediction is.

Im not going to spend much more time arguing about this. If AI ever writes a filmable TV script, get back to me.

Are you under the impression that the AI retains the art that it looked at in its memory?

I mean, there’s a lot of differences between eyes to brain and picture to neural net, but fundamentally, both act by changing the weights in the neurons, causing it to learn.

I mean, the whole point of a neural net is that it is based on how humans learn. It’s not an exact copy, but it uses the same principles.

While there is some nuance there, I wouldn’t say it’s nearly as “factually, objectively, and incontrovertibly false” as you are stating.

Sure, I’ll bookmark this.

And maybe then you can apologize for the insults as well.

No, I won’t be doing that.

I don’t know what’s going on with the two of you, but I am officially banning the two of you from this thread for 48 hours. No warning issued, but that should give each of you enough time to cool down.

If you feel a need to have a go at each other, do so in the Pit, not in MPSIMS.

In the sense that both are actions in this universe that involve matter and energy, sure, they’re fundamentally the same. But @Sam_Stone made the absurd claim that an AI’s art process was “no different” from a human’s.

I’m not surprised that people are unaware of the difference between language-model AIs and human intelligence. It’s a bit dispiriting that someone ignorant of this difference would so confidently opine on the subject.

You can start by Googling “difference between ChatGPT and human intelligence,” or any number of similar search terms; or you can start here:

Before you come back pointing out that there are SOME similarities (spoiler: I never said otherwise), remember that I’m disputing the idea that they are “no different.” THAT is the ridiculously ignorant claim.

I think when I say the process is the same, people would be capable of recognizing the context in which I said it.

No, the brain and an AI are not identical. One uses digital data, the other is analog. One of them is sequential, the other recurrent. One has specialized architecture for many different things, while the other is general. One of them is a fully connected network, and the other isn’t. One of them has physical neurons, and in the other neurons are basically virtual, with the parameters being more like synapses. I could go on listing differences all day. Of course.

But I was talking about the process of learning, and in that the two work the same way - instead of memorizing and storing content, they simply update the weights of the connections between neurons in a neural network. There’s no plagiarism. There’s no verbatim copy.

When a human looks at a painting by a master, the human can’t just reproduce it identically. They can remmeber what it looks like, but a lot of that memory is symbolic. We substitute actual patterns with simplified object representations and copnnections between them. That’s what AI does as well.

Someone who studies artists their entire life will definitely be impacted by those artists, and critics will often point out influences and similarities between two artists. That’s not plagiarism. AIs do the same thing. They look at all the data, update their weights trillions of times, and out of that comes the ability to build unique new images that are influenced by artists of the past, but are not direct copies of anything. There is no cut and pasting of image files or portions of image files. There is no storage of the images the AI looks at (sometimes very small bits may show up in the data, but not whole images).

That’s how AI’s and humans function in the same way - in the context of learning from ingesting data. The process in both is fundamentally the same.

After saying they were “no different,” you listed a lot of differences, but you left out some key ones:
-One is an individual with rights, the other is property.
-One has a lived experience with quality, the other is a complex set of algorithms.
-One has the ability to earn a livelihood to feed herself, the other is a capital investment.

These are not trivial differences. I think that people would be capable of recognizing the context in which they operate.

The fundamental property of consciousness and its concomitant moral implications may not be so easily discarded.

We are talking specifically about plagiarism. I simply pointed out that for the purposes of determining if an AI is plagiarizing something by looking at it and then drawing something similar,

I pointed out that the process of learning in an AI is the same as it is in humans in that both are just updating a neural net with numbers, and not actually copying anything. We don’t consider that plagiarism in humans, even though many human artists lean heavily on others from the past. So why should we consider it plagiarism if an AI does the same thing? Now, if you want to propose new laws that prevent AIs from scraping public data, that’s a different matter. But it should fit under a different category than plagiarism.

Using your life experiences and your own human brain to create a new work is very different from using a piece of technology to create a pastiche. The element of consciousness is what you’re eliding.

If what you’re hanging your hat on is that the word “plagiarism” isn’t precisely the correct term, okay, I won’t die on that hill. But it sure as hell isn’t “no different” from a human’s creation of new art.