My mum actually had DNA testing done a few years ago when she tracked down her biological father. Since he wasn’t sure he was her father, but stongly suspected (looong story involving deception, adoption, intrigue and emigration to Australia), he agreed that genetic testing would be sensible. In that case, both people were involved, and both sent individual samples to one of these testing places. I believe their GPs collected the samples. I have no idea if there are any places that take samples taken on the sly, though! Hmmm, now that would be an interesting xmas pressie for my husband.
I didn’t say this earlier, but maybe I should now.
My cousin has kind of the opposite problem in that she’s married with kids, and it’s her husband who doesn’t want to mingle with her family. Cousin’s parents live a distance away, mother doesn’t drive, father somewhat disabled, so cousin and kids go visit them… Cousin’s husband is quiet, sensitive, introverted and will go visit on Christmas and Thanksgiving, for cousin and kids sake, and that’s IT.
Cousin’s husband has plenty of excuses. He works long hours, six days a week, and spends his one day off resting, working on his hobbies, and watching football. Cousin’s parents treated her badly in the past and he will never forget, or forgive, though he is very polite. He is uncomfortable at cousin’s family gatherings, anyway, doesn’t like hubub, doesn’t like trying to make conversation with people he doesn’t know that well, and usually brings a book, sits in the corner reading and wishing he could go home. (He’s not rude, he will talk to anyone who engages him in conversation, will go out and play catch with any kids there, he will join in card or board games. But twice a year, Christmas and Thanksgiving.) The man simply isn’t social, doesn’t want to be bothered, sees no reason to hang out with people just for the sake of hanging out…My cousin understands this and if she and the kids want to go to someone’s birthday at her mom’s, if relatives come in from out of town to visit mom and dad, if they’re all invited to a school play - cousin and the kids will go without the husband. That’s just the way he is, there’s no ill feeling…But she says the maddening thing is, if they show up without her husband, someone ALWAYS says, “why, where is Fred? Didn’t Fred come with you???” … She was always making excuses. Oh, Fred’s sick. Fred’s working overtime. Fred has to take a night class. Finally, she got fed up and now she says, “no, Fred’s at home relaxing. Fred doesn’t care to socialize after a long day at work. Fred sends his regards and best wishes, but if anyone wants to see him, you are more than welcome to drop by our house with a one-hour warning phone call.” … That usually shuts them up. It’s just easier and less stressful to leave Fred at home. Until the next gathering…“why, where is Fred???”
So I’m saying that’s how some men are, and it’s really nothing personal… It’s different for Neeps’ situation when there is a child involved. Her f-i-l is failing Grandfatherhood 101 badly! When children are involved, it has to be about them so they have some kind of childhood memories of a loving family. Just saying some people are just…different.
Neeps, you extended the invitation and he has declined. I would have your husband reiterate to your MIL, that she’s welcome even if FIL doesn’t want to attend. Just keep inviting him to your house for family events. You can’t make anyone do something they don’t want to. And I would also say that it’s not your position to try and “fix” things or become the family detective to figure it all out. That’s your husband’s role if he desires it. but it doesn’t sound like he want’s to do that, except just be sad about it.
Congrats on the new parenthood and best wishes in making your own family traditions.
It sounds like he as a somewhat similar personality type. I think the difference is that he seems to make the effort for the big things and for his kids, but not for the wider family. My FIL will not make an effort for his kids (and now grandkid).
I didn’t go into this story earlier, but we had similar problems with my BIL (husband’s older bother) at our wedding 4 years ago. We knew he hated social events, so tried to make it as low key for him as possible. Didn’t ask him to be best man, although my husband did this for him and would have loved his brother to be there for him. The short version is that he came to the wedding, didn’t speak to anyone, acted like he was at a funeral, and left early, taking his parents with him. It was so noticable that all our friends and my family were asking us what was wrong with him.
My husband is a very sensitive person, and it really upset him that his brother couldn’t make an effort for one day, or even offer congratulations. Our honeymoon was spent with my husband angsting about what was wrong, and when we got back he tried to talk to his brother about it. Big mistake. He got completely shut out, and they didn’t speak for 2 years. All my husband wanted to know was that it didn’t have anything to do with me or us getting married, but he couldn’t even get that out of him. It really cut him up, made him depressed, and was the first event that made my husband sit up and realise that he couldn’t get what he really wanted from his family (emotional support) and he just had to accept that. It sounds so obvious (you can’t change other people, only the way you react to them), but it was something my husband had never come across (I have an alcoholic father - it was a lesson I learnt in my teen years, unfortunately).
You know, I have no good memories of my own grandparents. I’m sure this isn’t uncommon, and it didn’t really affect my life, but looking back on it now, I’m sad for my parents, that they didn’t get the happy family that they should have got, and got no support through the really tough things that happened to them when we were children (I had cancer as a baby, and my sister was stillborn). In a way, I can count my blessings, as one set of grandparents are totally there for us and my son.
Thanks everyone for listening to me whinge. I really needed a little perspective on this. I can only hope I can help my husband find a little too.
Some women are like that, too. I have zero interest in spending time with most of my husband’s family. He has one sister whom I’ll spend time with, but the rest of them I’m not comfortable being around.
I dunno… if I were the child, I don’t think I’d want someone pretending to love me, I think that’d be worse.
This.
Very well stated, Cat.
I used to be like that, and still have to fight it a bit every day. It sounds like a combination of introversion and shyness. For me it was comforting to just keep to myself and not interact, and very uncomfortable to be in a large crowd where people might ask me personal questions.
Some people probably took it personally, but there was no reason for them to. It wasn’t that I disliked them, I think it was more that I disliked myself in those situations.
I still liked getting invited to things, even though I’d turn most of them down.
I’m a bit like that - introverted, shy, suffering from social anxiety. It doesn’t extend to my immediate family and small family gatherings, though (we’re talking 7 people for christmas).
If you had children, would you extend your exclusion zone and put them on the outside of it? That’s where I stop being able to understand. Why have kids if you are going to push them away at every turn…I just don’t get it.
I now believe that he never really wanted kids. Things he’s said over the years all sort of add up in my mind, and now that we are in the position we are in, I can only come to that conclusion. This is why I so firmly support anyone who has decided that having kids is not for them. Who wants more miserable families in the future?
That’s such a sucky situation for you and your husband, Neeps. Spoiling your wedding like that.
Wish you two could have put it out of your mind on your honeymoon.
And I think “he never really wanted kids” is at the heart of this. I don’t think MY father wanted kids, but years ago that’s what you did, get married and start cranking them out. I think being responsible for supporting us weighed heavily on dad, it was go to work, work, come home, eat, sleep. Repeat. Dad was never happier than when he retired and could concentrate on cars full time, and we kids were out of the house.
Stories like this make me feel lucky that I have a close-knit, loving family, parents, grandparents, cousins, aunts, uncles, and so on. Well, just one grandparent left, but she was the best grandma a kid could want, and grandpa was the same.
Neeps, I’m sorry you have to go through this mess. Have a Merry Christmas with those you love, and take lots of pictures. Maybe you could write down, for a baby book, how the little ones’ first Christmas went. I was almost a year old and my mom says I was just as fascinated by the bright wrappings and bows, as I was the gifts!
Thanks. To be fair, we were too busy enjoying ourselves at our wedding to pay too much heed to his family. And once again, my family more than made up for his (no, they’re not that perfect, but in comparison, they know how to be sociable and celebrate life’s big events). It was only after the wedding that it started gnawing at my husband, especially after all the questions asking what was wrong with his brother.
Sounds about the same as my FIL. Not that he’s happy just now, but I think he really resented the obligations that came with having a family. There have also been conversations overheard between him and his other son (the wedding spoiler) where they have been really down on people who have chosen to have children. My BIL and his wife made it clear that they don’t want kids, and from the sounds of it, my FIL would have chosen this had he had the choice (or maybe he had kids because his wife wanted them - we’ll never know).
Not at all. I was a little standoffish with my nieces and nephews when they were babies, but that’s because I was a little afraid of breaking them.
I am more comfortable with my family than I used to be, but back then I always felt a little on the outside. Now I’m the ring leader.
Thanks, Baker. If nothing else, I think dealing with my husband’s family is making me appreciate mine all the more. Not that we’re perfect, far from it. But at least we can all talk and support one and other. Also, having a child myself has really given me a whole new appreciation for my family and reminded me what is really important in life. Sounds corny, but it’s true!
Thanks, dude. 
Something else has occurred to me; I’m not sure it’s fair to judge older guys by today’s standards for how fathers are supposed to behave. There are men in their sixties and seventies today who have never cooked a meal, cleaned a room, or changed a baby, but were good husbands and fathers by the standards of the time. A lot of people did have kids without a thought for whether they really were interested in kids or not; it was simply the default. If you compound this with an antisocial nature, I suspect you’ll get someone very close to the OP’s father-in-law.
I’m also the type that, when I go up to see my family, I’m more likely to take a standoffish approach. It’s mostly becuase everyone else is a talker, while I am really not. I prefer to talk to people one on one. In groups, it takes me too long to think of what I want to say, and someone else has already started in.
I basically just show up and listen, people watch, and, if I need to, spend some of the time by myself, or at least one on one with someone else, doing something I enjoy, rather than just talking.
When I was in my 20’s, I went to visit my grandmother while she was still healthy, mobile, and able to entertain. She had 10 kids, and didn’t start until she was 24, I think. She delayed marriage and kids as long as possible, and used going to college as an excuse to delay things. She wasn’t a serious student, she really goofed off the entire time.
So during my visit, we had many conversations and I finally got to know my grandma a little. She told me she never liked having kids. Even though she had 10. She liked sex a LOT, though, and loved her husband very much. So they had a lot of sex, and being good Catholics, dealt with all the kids that came with all the nookie. My mom always told me about how little parenting she and her siblings had, and how they pretty much all looked out for each other. Grandma’s confession explained a whole lot. I think she was trying to tell me she was cool with my decision not to have kids, and wished she could have made that decision for herself in 1940.
It sounds like Neeps’ FIL may have similar feelings, though even grumpier about it.