Yeah I looked, it doesn't mean I'm a fucking scuzzball

[casdave]

Staring isn’t against the law - it just is in poor taste in many cases. And I reserve the right to think so, and form opinions about people who do it.

But to do so (stare) in some environments is to invite trouble, either violence from the partner of the stared at, or dismissal from employment for alleged sexual harassment - and yes that latter can start the process of searching for reasons to examine a persons behaviour in minute detail in such a way as to interpret every action and deed in a negative light - and with little or no real evidence, basically similar to the communist witchunts in the 50’s.

Basically it would seem that the layer of civilisation is only veneer thin, a look is harmless, what goes on in your head when you are looked at is your problem, not mine.

You have the right to think what you want, and so have I but there are those who would wish to trample on my rights merely because I am male and therefore every thought I have must have a sexual motivation in the eyes of the paranoid.

I can’t hold a door open for someone passing through if they happen to be female just in case someone interprets my motives incorrectly, I can’t criticise a woman or praise her without considering the nuances that may extend beyond a professional capacity.

Men and women are conditioned from adolescance to react in a particular way with the opposite sex, through media especially.
It is in the interests of advertisers to keep this going as a conditioned public is more easily manipulated into purchasing products not on their practical or intrinsic attributes but on their percieved merits which are very often closely associated with the conditioned sexual response.

Women look at themselves in a certain way, deciding what looks good on them by the reaction of their peers, male and female, yet they think they are ‘doing it for themselves’.
Men are the same, they look because they are supposed to.

(not all men, of course, but most of them)

A few words of re-education is not going to undo a lifetime of continuing conditioning, you may think that someone is leering but that is your interpretation, you may be right but you don’t know for sure.

The man who draws conclusions from the way a woman presents herself may well be totally off target, but as long as it does not amount to overt intimidation or action then you should not be so self-conscious.

I get some of the most evil looks from the scum I work with(maybe I should not describe prisoners that way) but I ignore them and get on with my job, it’s called growing a shell.

[Superdude]

*Originally posted by Geobabe *
[BFTR, as everyone who has ever been to a Dopefest with me can attest, I like it when men look at my tits–hell, I spent half the night at ChiDope flashing my cleavage. **

And I have some very interesting pictures of your cleavage…Hell, I spent half the night wishing for a better view. Those damn clothes kept getting in the way.

[Arden_Ranger]

*Originally posted by Revtim *
**Geeze, dentarthurdent, didn’t anyone ever tell you that you have to chirp like a bat and use sonor to get a mental picture of the female, then force yourself to not even acknowledge her presence with your eyes? Even a nanosecond glance lowers their opinion of you!

Unless, of course, you look like Brad Pitt. Then feel free to squeeze her hooters a couple times and go “honk honk!” **

I would just like to say that’s not true for everybody. I like getting admiring looks and I don’t care what the looker looks like. Admiration is admiration and is appreciated as such.

I’m not even adverse to a leer depending on my mood. Frankly they’re almost expected in the bars around here.

Of course, that’s just me.

[abuse_angel]

Part of it actually goes further, some posters here have stated they object to certain sorts of stare, why ? Because they don’t appreciate what they think the person is thinking.

Either grow a shell or don’t go out, but don’t even think of restricting my right to look and think.

the problem i have is that i know for a fact the men in my neighborhood are thinking i’m a hooker. i have no idea why, i swear to god i don’t dress or look like one, but enough of them have propositioned me that i know the look before they ask.

i think i have a right to be insulted by that.

a simple look is fine, something that isn’t rude or disgusting or implies that the looker is thinking, “how much?” anything more and i have a right to be disgusted and a little bit scared. (i did have one of these men follow me on my way to work, and another followed me while walking to lunch. and i was dressed conservatively, working in a church at the time.)

[More_Cowbell]

I have a friend who is very “blessed” but usually didn’t show off her inter-boobular groove as a matter or personal choice. But you still couldn’t miss these two. We are out at a bar one night and this guy came up and starts to talk to her. Well, not to her, but to them. (She was wearing a sweater, no cleavage showing.) After a few sentences, she gently reached up under his chin, corrected his line of sight as to look into her eyes, said “They won’t answer you back” and just walked away. It was quite awesome.

It is difficult not to stare at breasts, and if their is cleavage-a-poppin, it makes it all the more challenging. As an experiment in self discovery, I tried walking through the airport and NOT look at women’s breasts. I amazed myself on how very difficult it was. My neck started to hurt because eventually I had to look over their heads not to even glance at them.

Leering is bad, staring is bad and talking to them directly is unforgivable. But a once over glance is almost unavoidable. I don’t think it’s personal (at least not for me), it’s just almost impossible not to.

[yosemite]

*Originally posted by casdave *
But to do so (stare) in some environments is to invite trouble, either violence from the partner of the stared at, or dismissal from employment for alleged sexual harassment - and yes that latter can start the process of searching for reasons to examine a persons behaviour in minute detail in such a way as to interpret every action and deed in a negative light - and with little or no real evidence, basically similar to the communist witchunts in the 50’s.

Yeesh. Take that up with the PC Police. Hint: I am not the PC Police.

Basically it would seem that the layer of civilisation is only veneer thin, a look is harmless, what goes on in your head when you are looked at is your problem, not mine.

With all due respect, I have owned these breasts for a long time, and I have seen a certain pattern developing in regards to how some people react to them. I hasten to add - I am rather a clueless, oblivious person, always missing obvious passes (so my friends tell me) and I often have my head in my clouds. But please do me the respect of believing me when I assure you that I can tell when someone is boring holes through my breasts, like they are on fire. I am pretty dense, so a person has to be supremely unsubtle to get my attention. And when someone is this unsubtle, NO, I don’t like it, and YES, I think they are a scuzbag.

You have the right to think what you want, and so have I but there are those who would wish to trample on my rights merely because I am male and therefore every thought I have must have a sexual motivation in the eyes of the paranoid.

Sheesh. Whatever. Take it up with the people who want to “trample on your rights”. I don’t think I am trying to do that merely because I form a negative opinion about someone who is STARING at my chest.

I can’t hold a door open for someone passing through if they happen to be female just in case someone interprets my motives incorrectly, I can’t criticise a woman or praise her without considering the nuances that may extend beyond a professional capacity.

My sympathies. Really. Some people overreact, and that’s a shame. I personally don’t care who opens the door for me, and I don’t get offended if they do.

Women look at themselves in a certain way, deciding what looks good on them by the reaction of their peers, male and female, yet they think they are ‘doing it for themselves’.
Men are the same, they look because they are supposed to.

(not all men, of course, but most of them)

Oh yeah. That big ugly bulky sweater I was wearing just soooo sexy. Hubba hubba. :rolleyes: And I’d like to point out that there is a distinction between “look”, which implies a harmless glance, and “bore holes through my breasts”.

I don’t care if people look. But I don’t like being visually dissected, and I can tell when it is being done to me, since it is supremely unsubtle. It is not a “glance”, it is not a “look”. It is the most intense stare directed at my breasts. I believe that anyone who is this tacky does not deserve much respect from me.

A few words of re-education is not going to undo a lifetime of continuing conditioning, you may think that someone is leering but that is your interpretation, you may be right but you don’t know for sure.

In some cases, perhaps a “look” can be misinterpreted. But a steady, intent STARE that lasts a long time is pretty deliberate. Or repeated “look” and “look again” and “gotta look again” can be pretty unsubtle. And if I feel less respect for someone who has me squirming under their “your breasts are on fire” stare, that’s too frickin’ bad. I am not trying to pass any laws, but I am still entitled to my opinions and feelings about such a creepy person.

I get some of the most evil looks from the scum I work with(maybe I should not describe prisoners that way) but I ignore them and get on with my job, it’s called growing a shell.

So what’s your point? I’m not a shrinking violet. I function in society, I don’t freak out when someone looks at me. I don’t wear certain revealing clothes because I feel “self conscious” when I do. That’s my choice, I am not to grieved about limiting my wardrobe. Certainly no one is suggesting I change my wardrobe to give everyone more to look at? (I thought not! )

I still go outside, I cope, and I don’t like the scuzbags who stare at me like my breasts are on fire. I don’t like a lot of things I see when I leave my front door, am I not entitled to express my dislike? It’s not the same as expecting the things I dislike to autmatically be obliterated from the Earth. It’s just that I am entitled to an opinion, as everyone is. And I don’t like, nor respect, men that stare at my breasts like they are on fire. It’s quite simple, really.