The real problem is this party of country bullshit. Shodan, you epitomize this with your moronic “neener neener” comment.
I think there are some moronic things Dems are doing, and there are plenty of moronic things the Repubs are doing.
There are people on both sides of the aisle that are blindly following their party, and this is the real danger. I’d love to do a social experiment where you reverse the stances of Kerry and Bush, and I bet some morons would tag right along.
Sh. Don’t pay any attention to that. Look over here! Steroids in professional sports! Bad, bad! Outrage! Ooo, shiny!
As the New Yorker reported, the Rendering system first put terrorists to trials in absence and then picked them up, or depending on the result of the trial, even got rid of them. Bush decided to get rid of many of the checks that were available before, giving us “gulags” and the spectacle of snatching people that before would have been declared innocent.
They are not guns, but people. Unlike a gun, they can choose what they do; they share the blame.
It is of vital importance that, at this point, we take a moment to remember that Clinton got a blowjob. Therefore, anything bad (however logicaly it may seem) that you may have to say about this administration is moot and can be written off as Loony Liberal hysteria.
I’m quite certain that many of them were indeed employed under CLinton. But then the Clinton administration didn’t:
Bush administration did. Had CLinton done any of that, I’d have the same objections.
Torture is an incredibly stupid option. Over and above the objection of “It’s fundementally wrong”, is the fact that information obtained through torture is unreliable and fucking useless. The torture itself becomes also a propeganda tool used against us.
so the balance sheet about using torture reads:
there isn’t a single positive outcome.
I’m quite certain that many of them were indeed employed under CLinton. But then the Clinton administration didn’t:
Bush administration did. Had CLinton done any of that, I’d have the same objections.
Torture is an incredibly stupid option. Over and above the objection of “It’s fundementally wrong”, is the fact that information obtained through torture is unreliable and fucking useless. The torture itself becomes also a propeganda tool used against us.
so the balance sheet about using torture reads:
there isn’t a single positive outcome.
fucking idiots.
Alright. That’s fine. They should receive a share of the blame for not coming forward. Except…have you noticed that people who come forward agains the administration really don’t fare all that well? Their spouses tend to get outed to the general public. They lose jobs. They’re ridiculed by the general media and made scapegoats by the military they serve in. The top brass is never made responsible for the orders given. “Share” seems to mean “shoulder” in Bush-speak.
Do I have to add “WHy do you hate America?” or an emoticon for people to make realize I’m doing a conservative spoof? Granted not much of a spoof. I hear that kind of shit every time some soldier says Iraq is going less then well.
Debating with some of these Bush supporters is like talking to an eight year old. Naive doesn’t even begin to explain their opinions. We already have one person dismissing a conspiracy theory because, well golly gee, those never occur. All people in gov’t are honest and only do what’s best for me and you. And then we have another person believing that every person we torture is a terrorist. Hello…most terrorist are already dead, remember they tend to blow themselves up? Now of course some of them are, but that doesn’t make up for torturing the innocent ones.
The thing I really don’t understand, is the willingness to trust and blindly follow ANY political party. I mean what, do you think Bush is Jesus or something? That would at least make sense because we already know how some of these evangelicals will blindly follow even the most ridiculous notions.
Wake the fuck up people. Most humans are dirtbags and politicians are indeed human, for the most part. Have you seen all the scandals, murders, rapes, molesters, thefts, lies, etc. that humans have perpetrated on each other? Expecting anything else out of Bushco or virtually any other power hungry politician is foolish at best, and just plain evil at worst.
Ok, now that I’ve offended most of the country, I’d like to finish by quoting the brilliant George Carlin.
“Some people are fucking stupid”
I’d almost buy the first statement, were it not for the enormous existing national debt. Conservatives liked to say that the surplus belonged to us, yet apparently the national debt was an orphan.
I don’t buy 9/11 as the excuse for racking up major deficits. Sure, the Afghan invasion had to be done. But not Iraq. And not while giving tax cuts to the wealthy. And not while adding a new prescription drug benefit (but oddly NOT authorizing Medicare to bargain for better prices).
And the Niger forgeries are not mere conspiracy theories. From the UPI
The investigation continues. We’ll see who has the last laugh. -
Golly, there’s so much anger here. Why not vote for a candidate that is guaranteed to have an effect on the terrorists, and who has the resources and network in place to crush the bad guys? A brave leader!
Ok, humor aside, I’m going to ask the Republicans here: Do you feel the war on terror, thus far, has accomplished enough to justify the price we’ve pain in money, lives, and world regard?
Have the numerous and well-publicized accounts of corruption in the Bush administration caused your “faith” in him to be shaken even a little bit?
I believe that Bush is a man with a plan. What it is, I don’t know. Likely none of us ever will. I only know the effects his action have had on my life and those of the rest of America from what I’ve seen in the media, and I don’t much care for the picture it paints. Kerry would have done something diffirent, because he is a diffirent person with diffirent advisors and goals. Better/worse can’t say. But it would not have lead us to the place we are today.
In essence, and because this is the Pit, I will conclude with: Fuck you both. Fuck you people who have no ability to objectively look at what Bush has done and draw your own conclusions. Fuck those people who blindly condemn EVERYTHING Bush does as part of some “evil conspiracy”. Do those happen? Yes, but making Bush into a monolithic Adversary for you to hate and paint yourselves as the heroes of the piece is a self-aggrandizing blowjob that you give to each other. Look at what he’s done. Get angry, even. Toss around as many fucks as you like. But please, for the love of intelligent debate, don’t just intentionally piss each other off without even tryhing to share information. I know it’s the Pit. I know it’s the padded room where you can beat the walls and not get hurt. But don’t do that and think you’ve made the things that got you into the room in the first place go away.
Or I could just be babbling incoherently. Maybe I’m ful of shit and self-importance. Feel free to call me on my flaws and skip this post. And go boil your head.
Clinton and Bush had many of the same situations confronting them, but approached them differently. Clinton gave terrorism a top priority, Bush gave that to war with Iraq. Government running a surplus is better than running a deficit when debt is as large as it is. Clinton at least made budget choices and fought hard with Congress to reduce spending. Bush never met a tab he did not want to pick up.
Not to expect much of any president when balancing a budget is just an excuse for poor GOP performance. Deficits go up for Reagan and Bushes every year, down every year for Carter and Clinton.
Bush is too lazy to plant evidence. That’s what he has Karl Rove to oversee.
The first link lead to a commentary about how republicans helped global warming. Same with the second and the third. Take a refresher course on reading comprehension. These do not claim that the Pres. is responsible for the hurricanes, they are saying that … (Can you complete the sentence?)
Bush: Everything went just fine, Turdy! Snuck in, planted the gun, just like you told me, snuck out and nobody saw a thing!
Rove: Did you remember…
Bush: Yes, I remembered to wipe off my fingerprints! Of course! Not as dumb as you…Hmmmmm.
Rove: What? What?
Bush: Can’t seem to find my wallet…
I voted against him both times he ran. I feel good about that.
35% bitches!
I’m starting to think they’re all here at the SDMB.
Dearie, no. Everybody knows that US Government agencies are practically infallible. If the prisoners weren’t guilty, why would anyone even bother picking them up ? :rolleyes:
Does the name Maher Arar ring a bell ? A Canadian citizen changing planes in the US, snapped up by an unnamed US Gvt. Agency and promptly shipped to Syria, where the Syrians promptly started to beat the shit out of him for a year or so, making him “confess” to terrorist training he never attended, among other things. Now, he was lucky. He was backed by a relatively powerful government that seems to give a shit and and so he got back. (I am sure some will be fast to point out that it was the Syrians that did the dirty work and that no US authority could have predicted the tragic, tragic outcome…)
I have no problem believing that a government agency without any oversight or accountability will promptly abuse the unlimited power it has been handed. You got the wrong guy ? Oops. Well, you can either admit mistake and release him - and if he wasn’t an enemy before, he sure is now - or you can wait and see if the problem goes away on its own, so to speak. It’s not as if he’s imbued with certain unalienable rights or anything…
This email may cheer you up: from a Senate Appropriations Committee staffer to other Senate staff
Yep. Me too, now that Harriet “Bush is the smartest man I’ve ever known” Meirs is back in her WH office.
That was the the one good thing I expected Bush to accomplish, and I think Roberts and Alito are just what the SCOTUS needs.