<minor hijack>
THEY GAVE CARMAN HIS OWN MOVIE?!?!?
WHAT WERE THEY THINKING?!
</minor hijack>
We now return you to your previously scheduled thread…
Hearing about these films makes me think about how much tripe the movie industry produces.
Does that count?
Once upon a time a literary critic came up to science fiction writer Theodore Sturgeon and commented, “Ninety percent of science fiction is crap.”
Sturgeon was quick, and answered him with what has come to be known as Sturgeon’s Law: “Ninety percent of anything is crap.”
Even when I was a Christian, and all the music I bought was on the Word and Dove labels, and all the books I read were either the Bible or Frank Peretti’s or Joseph Girzone’s latest masterpiece, I found Carman to be unfathomably bad. Really, embarrassingly, jaw-droppingly bad. My mother-in-law, though, loves him.
I think it is spelled ABSALOM!, but I could be mistaken.
I myself am waiting for Cartman the Champion.
FoG: Make you a deal. Seriously. I’ll see that movie if you read the James Morrow trilogy that deals with the same theme: Towing Jehovah, Blameless in Abaddon, and The Eternal Footman. You can probably get them at your local library.
Okay?
flowbark quotes the synopsis for Judgment:
I think I’ve already seen this plot in a movie before…
COURT REPORTER: Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothin’ but the truth?
GEORGE BURNS: So help me me.
JUDGE: So help you you?!
GEORGE BURNS: If it please the court, I’m God, your honor.
FriendOfGod - before I waste my time on a bad movie - Have any of the movies mentioned in the OP been reviewed somewhere so I could read the review? A well-known reviewer would be best, or else somewhere else with a list of reviews so I could read the reviewer’s opinion of movies that I have seen and then get an idea of the reviewer’s “movie IQ”.
Back in my teenage days, I saw Carman at Rupp Arena on a church trip. Even though I was quite the Christian at that time, I found his show to be excrement. He’s a middle-aged white guy who tries to be what some focus group must have told him teenagers think of as “cool”. His “rap” stylings threaten to undo everything the Beastie Boys have done for white rappers.
And Mr. T? Just think–if he had bought one or two fewer gold chains and invested the money instead, he might still be living the good life instead of coming out of hiding for long distance commercials and fundie indie films.
Dr. J
The Onion did a review of Left Behind. Kind of a summary with a bit of opinion. Go ahead and read it anyway, if you’re interested.
http://avclub.theonion.com/reviews/cinema/cinema_l/leftbehindthemovie01.html
**Esprix wrote:
Personally I’m waiting for “Dungeons & Dragons.” I’m sure it’ll change my life as well.**
Oh, but it will! The opportunity to see Jeremey Irons chew on the scenery in this movie is well worth the price of admission (well, Sunday matinee admission). He so completely over-acts the part of the Evil Villian, it more than makes up for the rest of the film.
**Gadarene wrote:
FoG: Make you a deal. Seriously. I’ll see that movie if you read the James Morrow trilogy that deals with the same theme: Towing Jehovah, Blameless in Abaddon, and The Eternal Footman. You can probably get them at your local library.
Okay?**
I made a similar bet with Foggie in the last The Last Temptation of Christ thread and was studiously ignored. He’ll probably do the same here.
**Foggie wrote:
So anyway, while I realize this isn’t really a “Great Debate”, it’s about a movie that contains a great debate,
and it is proselytizing so I figured this was the place for it. I hope you guys check it out, and I’d be genuinely curious what some of you think, pro or con.**
I’m curious, does the Fundamentalist Christian community really expect to make many converts by producing these movies?
With just a US release, I’d expect you’d get around 100 people who would actively convert to Christianity after seeing any of these films. Let’s say the studios spent 10 million a piece on these films (that’s pre & post production, too); winning 100 new converts per film means you’ve just spent $100,000 dollars to convert 1 person to Christianity.
Does that make much business sense? Would that money be better spent funding things like soup kitchens, half-way houses, all sorts of charties rather than providing entertainment for the people who are already Christian and the over-extended hope that a few people might change their lives and actively become Christian?
BTW, is anybody else out there thoroughly offended by the title of this thread and its implication that I’m not a Christian because I just don’t think? Screw you too, FoG.
minty green: No, it didn’t offend me and I didn’t receive at least make you think in the manner that you obviously did. It would have bothered me if I thought FoG intended to be offensive.
At least some optional movies to rent have been mentioned. I’ve had enough of gore and drug bust movies.
[Moderator Hat ON]
No screwing in GD, minty. Cool it with the insults.
[Moderator Hat OFF]
waterj2 said:
I’m aware that the percentage of people on this board who may actually see Judgment is small, but if even one sees it and it makes them think it will have been worth it.
For the record, the movie doesn’t “witness” to you or talk down to you at all. It just makes you think.
RickJay said:
Ah, while I certainly don’t know where on earth you get “Evil Jews” out of believing in a one world government conspiracy (???), I do know somewhat what you mean. Some Christians have even said: why are so many Christian movies focused on the end times? The answer is easy: the drama inherent in that time period is perfect for a good movie or book … but I agree it’s been done to death.
If you’re truly sick of it, of the movies I listed above the one I would recommend most probably is The Champion, which, thankfully, has nothing to do with the end times.
super_head said:
No it probably won’t, but it’s still a gripping film. The thing that makes the movie compelling is that you won’t see a lot of point for point rebuttal of everything, although there is some of that. But there is a much deeper underlying point being made that, en masse, rebuts the arguments. Again, it’s a thinking movie.
And no, I’m not going to give anything away ;).
magdalene said:
Well, that’s why I put the disclaimer in this thread: “or at least make you think”. And you’ve got to realize, I am a movie buff “generically”, and I enjoyed the movie a lot, not just as a Christian.
Oh, and Mr. T was fun as always (sorry just had to throw that in ;)).
rjung said:
Really? You’re so sure ahead of time how you would or wouldn’t be affected by something you haven’t seen?
Gadarene said:
You hit a weak spot … I like Sci Fi, at least up to a point. I looked at the three pages for it in the links you gave at amazon.com. Tell you what if you’re willing to make one change, you’re on. The change is: please pick only one of the three books. If I like it I’ll read the other two on my own. If I can’t stand it, I’m a free man ;). From looking at the amazon.com pages, it appears that the middle book is the one that mostly deals with God on trial, but I’ll let you pick.
Arnold said:
Unfortunately, Judgment hasn’t been reviewed anywhere I can see. I found two reviews for Carmen’s movie, although you will understandably see these as biased since they are from a Christian website, but it’s better than nothing:
http://movies.crosswalk.com/reviews/details/0,7388,4006,00.htm?
http://movies.crosswalk.com/reviews/details/0,7388,4026,00.htm?
As for Left Behind, there are dozens of reviews all over the web, very mixed. About half give the movie a thumbs down, and about half give it thumbs up.
Freyr said:
Each movie has a different purpose. I don’t think Carmen’s movie seems to have a huge soul winning purpose to it. It’s a faith based drama. There is zero proselytizing in it.
On the flip side, Left Behind seems to have several goals: entertain, educate about End Times events, and win souls. They have succeeded in all three! On the LB movie website, I’ve chatted with several of those who have given their hearts to Christ as a result of the movie. Truthfully, it would be worth ten times as much money as you quoted if just one person came to Christ.
Let me put it this way: I believe Christians should be involved in every aspect of culture, and thus money needs to be spent in every aspect of culture: from art, to film, to drama, you name it. It’s not an “either or” thing (ie, either spend money on the poor or movies), it’s a “both and” thing.
minty green said:
Ah … reading a little bit into it there, minty. No need to be so touchy. If you recommended a movie and said it might “make you think”, should I be offended and immediately believe that you are saying I DON’T think? You’re overreacting. I didn’t say you weren’t a Christian because you don’t think. I don’t even know you. I’m sure you’re a smart person. I am simply saying this movie will make you think. Nothing more, nothing less.
Edlyn said:
Thanks for seeing where I’m coming from. As for the movies being an option from gore and drug films, that’s something I think and hope will appeal to people whether Christian or not … Christian made movies can be entertaining yet safe.
Dang it, I knew I should have gone with something nicer than that. I apologize to both FoG and Gaudere. Sorry for the snotty words, ya’ll.
I’m sure FoG didn’t intend it to be offensive, Edlyn. I have followed and enjoyed the debates he started in the previous threads, as well as his contributions to those threads.
But assume I go over to the Left Behind message board and start a thread to recommend that the members read some Carl Sagan because it “might change your life or at least make you think.” Haven’t I just impliedly said someting negative about their cognitive abilities? I certainly think so.
FTR, I definitely do not think people believe in Christ because they haven’t done enough thinking. Nor do I believe that those of other faiths or no faith have done so out of ignorance. Would that all of us would grant each other that much.
IMHO, this thread belongs in IMHO. I don’t believe that GD is the place for recommending movies or giving opinions about them. For example, if I wanted to recommend my favorite movie of the year, “Traffic”, in a new thread, I would place it in IMHO. Now, if I wanted start a thread about the drug war and mention the movie “Traffic”, that could go in GD, but that would be something different.
I am not able to get out and see any movies right now, so I guess that I’ll have to pass on all of the above.
The site rottentomatoes.com tries to link to every critic on the web. The page for “Left Behind” shows 84% of critics givng negative reviews, and the positive reivews have not-so-ringing praise such as “Solid, unexceptional mix of thrills and human drama.” It should be pointed out that only a few religious critics are listed here. There are no reviews for “Judgement” yet and only one religious review for “Carman the Champion.”
FoG:
Fair 'nuff. 
Blameless in Abaddon it is. I think you’ll be able to pick up the storyline without reading the first in the trilogy, and you’re right in that this is the book that mostly deals with the “God on trial” theme.
Will Judgment be available at my local Blockbuster? If so, I’ll rent it and watch it this weekend, in between ACC Tournament games.
Lookin’ forward to getting your impression of the book, and sharing mine of the movie.
minty said:
Apology accepted
I genuinely would not have that reaction. I would think, “this guy thinks that this particular book will give us something to think about”. Whether I’d agree or not is another story, but I wouldn’t take offense at all.
ITR said:
The main reason I put it here is because I am emphasizing a movie that has a goal of promoting the Christian faith, which somewhat puts it in the “proselytizing” category. If I were just recommending Lord of the Rings or something, it wouldn’t be here.
Gadarene said:
I hate to say it but I don’t know if Judgment is at Blockbuster yet. It just came out during the past two to three weeks. I know that all the other Cloud Ten movies are now at Blockbuster, so I’m sure Judgment won’t be far behind. I’ll ask at the Judgment website and ask my local Blockbuster later tomorrow and report back :).
I’ll look for your book at my local library this weekend. This will be quite interesting :). Look forward to both our reviews!
Don’t forget Dante’s Inferno. FoG hasn’t seen that movie either…
-Ben