You do NOT need a $1000 dog.

The BBQ Pit
81

Huh? OK, you didn’t tell us how we should spend our money, you told us how we shouldn’t spend our money. So sorry that I missed the subtle distinction.

Every dog I’ve owned has been spayed or nuetered. None of them has had puppies. I am not part of the problem. I wanted to raise a dog from a little puppy. I donate money to the shelter every year.

Answer me this. What is helping more dogs, someone who gets a pound dog every several years or someone who buys a purebred from a breeder and donates money to the shelter every year for several years?

Haj

82

False dichotomy. The person that gives money and adopts from the shelter is helping the most. As for me telling you how NOT to spend your money, that’s not even what I’m doing, except indirectly: I’m telling you that you ought not help breeders stay in business, which is what you do when you give them your money.

Kiger, I’ve got less than no interest in show-quality dogs. Reducing living animals to a hobby on a par with stamp collecting is not a reason I’ll accept for making what I consider a less-than-ethical decision.

And Intent, dogs at the shelter are there for all kinds of reasons: their owner was neglecting them, their owner refused to learn basic obedience for their animal, they were one of many puppies in a litter and the owner couldn’t (or wouldn’t) find homes for them all. We had one dog come in recently because a disabled boy wasn’t remembering to fill his water dish and the mother decided to teach her son a lesson by bringing his dog to the shelter.

Dogs brought in for serious reasons – aggression, for example – are much less likely to be made available for adoption. When you’re euthanizing 70% of the animals that come in, the silver lining is that it’s only the best 30% of animals that make it into adoptions in the first place. These include healthy, adorable, friendly animals, and also include older animals that are accustomed to a family environment and that already have training.

In case it’s not clear, I’m not calling for the outlawing of breeding (although differential licensing is a fantastic idea IMO). It ought to be legal, in the same way that buying stock in Walmart ought to be legal. Just because it’s legal doesn’t mean I think it’s a good idea.

Daniel

83

My dad used to breed dogs. He killed a lot of them that weren’t advancing the breed. I don’t have the ability to kill dogs, therefore I don’t breed. It’s almost like the people who like dogs the most are the worst people to breed them.
No, the worst would be people who don’t like dogs and DO like money. But I would think the best breeders would be somewhere in the middle of the pack.

84

http://www.petfinder.com/pet.cgi?action=3&type=Dog

This is a list of 205 purebred dog breeds available for adoption. Thousands of purebred animals are destroyed every year at animal shelters. So go spend a grand getting a dog at a breeder and then think about the purebred dog that you could have saved from death.

85

I looked at the chow chows in my area. Every single one of them was a mix, not a purebred in the bunch. Most of them were sent away from their families for aggressive behavior or are listed as not being good with children. Sorry, that’s not an option for me.

Haj

86

Lots of rescue groups will transport animals; surely for less than the cost of a purebred dog you could arrange for transport. How large an area were you looking at? Did you check out Chow Chow Rescue?

Daniel

87

Just because a dog is “purebred” with AKC papers doen’t mean it’s well-bred. Doing your homework, researching breeders, and then spending a grand on a pup from a good breeder vastly increases the chance you’ll ge the latter. Plenty of “purebred” dogs in rescues or at animal shelters have serious medical problems or unstable/incorrect-for-breed temperments because they were bred by unknowlegable people. I can’t fault someone who decides that if they want (for example) a Sheltie, they’re going to do their level best to insure the dog they get is a GOOD Sheltie, and not risk adopting a poorly-conformed, sickly, or hyperactive and overly-nervous critter which just happens to possess some AKC papers.

88

Same holds true for my breed–there are (count 'em) three actual likely purebreds, all of which have been in rescue for quite a while, and are being fostered by friends of mine. There are around two dozen dogs listed under my breed, but five of them are the same dog, one of the ones being fostered by a friend. She hasn’t been adopted yet becuase she’s got a tremendous prey drive, and really needs to be hunting boar, as the breed is intended to do–she would be a perfect example of the breed doing what it was created for, but the rescue person in charge of her case will not allow her to go into a hunting home :rolleyes: . So she sits in limbo in rescue waiting for a pet home that doesn’t mind that she’s not good with kids, and likes to eat any small furry animal that moves. The rest are mixes, or random dogs who bear zero resemblance to the breed they’re listed under. Something like putting up a picture of a GSD mix and labeling it a greyhound.

~mixie

89

When I was looking for my puppy I did see them as well as this place which was based a few miles away from me at the time. By the way, the guy who runs that rescue is also a breeder.

Here’s the thing. I wanted to raise a puppy. I wanted to have the best possible chance of a healthy dog. In my dog’s lineage there are no hip or eye entroption problems. I spent months researching breeders waiting for the right dog. I would have been fine if it had happened to come from a rescue but it didn’t.

I am all for people getting rescue dogs. I fully support the good work that people at shelters do and I put my money where my mouth is. Saying that I am even partially responsible for those poor pups in the shelter is insulting and not supported by the facts.

Haj

90

Oh GOD absolutely, Porcupine - in fact when I first wrote that post, I’d written AKC, CKC, UKC… and then realised that people could think fo the CKC as the Continental and decided to spell 'em all out.

A LOT of people got duped by people selling puppies as CKC registered (people assumed they meant the Canadian Kennel Club)… Ayee.

I will remind, once again, everyone to remember that REGISTRATION DOES NOT GUARANTEE QUALITY IN ANY WAY.

You have to find that subset of super wonderful breeders and work with them. They’re the ones with the nasty contracts, the spay/neuter agreements that require you to make a huge-ass deposit that you will get back once you supply the proof the dog has been altered… yeah, those. :slight_smile: Those who breed for themselves, to better the breed, and who truly enjoy their dogs. Those who lose money at it.

And AGAIN: Purebred animals are not animals “where both parents were of the same breed” - they are registered with valid registry bodies which hold studbooks and such.

In fact, most animals listed as “purebred” on a number of adoption sites are NOT. Rescue groups see that waaaay too often…

91

I took a look at petfinder

The dogs listed as Nova Scotia Duck tolling retrievers are ALL very obviously MIXES.

There is NO WAY IN HELL those are tollers. In fact, when you dig deeper, you realise the shelters marked them off as “mixes” in the end… even in the list that was posted here on the boards (as a link) made them out to be “purebred” dogs. None of those dogs actually look like tollers, spare perhaps the aussies listed in the first two postings - and this happens a lot - bi-color tailed aussies being thought of as Tollers - but the red is way too red, and the rear angulation is all wrong (same as the tailset), and that’s always a giveaway.

In fact, we DO have a toller rescue. We’ve seen about 5 dogs come through the North American Rescue in the last 10 years or so. As breeds gain in popularity, though, you see more and more people breeding them to “cash in” on the popularity. These are the idiots who need to be educated.

92

Okay … I’m going to duck as soon as I post this because I’m sure people will be flaming me as soon as I hit “submit” … but I had a horrible experience at a shelter and I would never (NEVER) adopt another dog from that type of organization. I apologize … this is long …

Three years ago, my husband and I wanted a puppy. To be honest, I had my heart set on a pug … and we were in the process of researching local breeders. My well-meaning co-workers bitched and moaned and complained (very similar to this thread) that I was propagating a terrible system by buying a pure-bred dog … and guilted me into going to the local no-kill shelter.

We adopted a beautiful shepard mix … who the shelter assured us was housebroken, child-friendly, well-trained, etc. Something didn’t seem right from the get-go … Missy was a little … flighty I suppose … I called the shelter for support … they THEN admitted she’d been abused … but STILL assured me that she’d been trained and socizlied at the shelter by their “professionals.”

Within six months, Missy had bitten my husband on leg … bit me on the thigh … and (the last straw) bit my teenage step-daughter on top of the head. Enough, I said. I called the shelter … they refused to take her back and said it was our fault … that it MUST have been something we did.

I demanded to talk to their director … I told her that I would have the dog put down if they did not take it back or agree to help in SOME way … as there was something WRONG with the dog. She was NOT agressive … or mean … but would just randomly snap and bite. They agreeded to take her back and “work with her some more” … but were OBVIOUSLY pissed at me and they were just SURE that I was doing something wrong even though they admitted Missy had been abused by previous owners.

Now, during this time, my co-workers, who’d berated and bitched me into doing this in the FIRST place admitted that they, too, occasionally had bad experiences … but swore that I should just go back out there and pick out ANOTHER one.

Okay … make me the biggest bitch on the planet … but I’ve got kids in my house … two godchildren … three step-daughters … and I’m DONE taking chances and I’m DONE bringing home other people’s problems!!!

Now, the payoff to this story? I called the shelter back two weeks later to see how their “training” with Missy was going … know what? She’d ALREADY been placed with another home … a home with TWO TODDLERS. WTF?

We interviewed various breeders (as I had originally planned) and now have two beautiful, well-manned, healthy miniature schnauzers. Yes, they are pure-bred … and no, that’s no guarantee that I won’t ever have problems. But I’ll never be put in a position again where I’ll accept a dog into my home that has an unknown history and may or may not put my family at risk. Yes, it’s my money … and yes, I’ll buy what I please … but more than that it’s MY decision to make an informed choice.

93

Leukemia is contagious?! :eek:

94

FeLeuk most certainly is…

Feline Leukemia isn’t quite the same as the human variety. First of all, it’s viral…

From Cornell’s Feline Center website: The feline leukemia virus is excreted in saliva and tears and possibly the urine and feces of infected cats. Prolonged, extensive cat-to-cat contact is required for efficient spread, because the virus is rapidly inactivated by warmth and drying.

95

Feline Leukemia Virus is.

96

Curses! Foiled again! :wink:

97

That’s great logic. Similar to that, Once I met a black man and he robbed me. I would never trust another black man again.

98

Irish Rogue, your experience is terrible, and I often refer people away from a local no-kill shelter that sounds almost as bad as the one you went to, and I regularly field phone calls from folks who are frothing-at-the-mouth angry at something they’ve witnessed at that shelter, and I regularly refer those people to the Department of Agriculture, who can actually do something with the complaint. I am baffled that this particular no-kill shelter is still around, that the state has failed in all its efforts to shut the hellhole down.

I believe your story. I just don’t think it’s remotely rational to stay away from all shelters because of it. “The cat,” said Mark Twain, “having sat upon a hot stove lid, will not sit upon a hot stove lid again. Nor upon a cold stove lid.” You’ve learned the wrong lesson: the lesson to learn is that you should research the source of any pet.

Our shelter, for example, does temperament testing on every animal before going into adoptions. We categorically refuse to adopt out any animal that has a history, either observed or reported, of aggression toward people or animals. This protects adopters; protects us (for liability reasons); and protects other animals at the shelter, inasmuch as it maintains our high reputation for good animals. You’ll understand why it burns me up to hear of other shelters adopting out sickly or aggressive animals: it leads to cases like yours, and ends up hurting shelter animals in general.

But you could have had the same experience if you’d bought from a breeder without researching the breeder. This is no reason to blame shelter animals.

Hajario, I think I don’t have much left to say to you on this subject. It may be that I’m too emotionally close to this work to evaluate your individual case rationally; with that, I’ll have to agree to disagree with you on the ethics of purchasing an animal from a breeder, an act that I find morally repugnant.

Daniel

99

You see blood gushing out of YOUR kid’s head … AFTER being lied to … THEN come back here and tell me that I’m not being logical, okay?

Keep in mind that our local shelter:

a) A managed to get me to pay $175 to adopt a dog, which then proceeded to BITE three out of five members of our family! The ONLY reason it didn’t bite the other two was that they were to AFRAID to go around it!

b) Lied to my FACE and told me the dog was friendly, well-trained, etc. … the admitted it was abused and had social issues AFTER I got it home and had problems …

c) Initially REFUSED to help me with this situation … even after ADMITTING they’d convinced an unsuspecting family to take a hostile animal …

d) AGAIN lied to my face and claimed they were going to give her more “social counseling” …

and then

e) Turned around and convinced ANOTHER family 2 weeks later to give them ANOTHER $175 for this SAME dog!

I’m telling you this … anyone can do whatever they wish with their money and their time. If you want to adopt, then good for you … and I’ll wish you nothing but sunshine and happiness. But I will NEVER again be guilted into doing something I don’t feel comfortable with. It was a terrible experience.

100

I would agree with your posting … except that we did research it. It’s not like we walked in one Saturday morning and walked out with a dog that afternoon. First off, there’s only one no-kill shelter in our area. So, there wasn’t much researching to be done as far as comparing and contrasting different agencies. We went to visit this location five times before ever signing anything … spoke with different volunteers, etc.

Like the good shelters, this one also claims to never give a pet to a family before “socializing it” … before making sure it’s healthy … so, if I’m a little gun-shy, then it’s understandable. I mean, let’s be honest … it’s not like a shelter’s staff is going to say, “Yeah, you’re right … these are some messed up animals … and they may not be right for you.” They’re trying to move these animals out of their buildings and into homes. I had to fill out a REAM of paperwork … and then wait nearly a week before they approved me … all so that they could give me a dog that wasn’t suited for anyone’s family … let alone ours.

I’m sure there are good shelters out there … and I’m sure that 99% of the people will tell you their success stories of beloved family pets. I, unfortunately, am of that 1% that will tell you that it didn’t go well, that it was an emotionally painful time for my family, and that I simply won’t do it again.

But again … I wish nothing but the best for those that do. It’s a noble thing to bring an unwanted pet into your home. I wish them the best.