But, Veb, is it really prudent to label person as a racist because they said “The Word In Question” once? Just once?
Toon’s is Jewish by heritage, but not a practicioner of the faith. I’m fairly certain it’s why he was so deeply offended and the woman was so thunderstruck when she realized what she said.
Abby
What I find most offensive about this woman’s remark is not the fact that she used a particular word, but that she would blurt out such a ridiculous, hateful thing with no provocation.
In other words, I consider it a measure of her level of bigotry that the mere fact that the very sight of a group of Orthodox Jews would make her come out with a blanket statement like that.
Words, in themselves, mean nothing. Many people routinely insult each other as a show of affection. It rolls right off because it’s all good-natured and understood. Therefore, the unspoken intent is what requires our attention and analysis. Of course, we weren’t there, but judging from the story in the OP, it seems clear to me that this woman’s feelings toward Jews in general is a hateful, ignorant one.
I don’t care about words, I care about the feelings that inspire those words.
Okay, maybe you folks can help me out here and please take this as a chance to eradicate ignorance in someone who wants to learn.
My confusion comes in because there is a Jewish race and many forms of Jewish religion. Orthodox Hasidic Jews practice one form of Judism. Could it be that it was this form of religion that annoyed her, not the race? Or is it automatically tied in deeper than that?
Scientologists drive me nuts. So I could be fairly accused of being prejudice against that religion, but I’m not considered racist because that religion doesn’t have any real racial component to it.
So if I said (and I’m not familiar at all with the following beliefs so take this as example only) “I think Orthodox Jews are nuts but Reform Jews seem to have some solid ideas.” Would I safely escape the anti-semetic label?
I wasn’t able to get back here to see these responses until just now. While this is the Pit, and I was mightily tempted to really let loose,I realized with the help of a very dear friend that indulging rage makes me no better than the woman I complained about, so instead I will attempt to address some of the remarks in a more straightforward manner.
MGibson. The idea that a degrading comment like that is tiny isn’t the point. It may be small to you, however I was sitting there. And, to address another point raised, this is not the first time she has been coarse in her hatred of Jews in my town. She grew up here, the Hasidic community was literally FOUNDED in the mid 1970’s, and has grown ever since. This is just the first time she has used what I feel is an ugly racist slur. And yes, it does make her an anti-semite. The only upside is that she’s so cocksure of her hatred and how acceptable it must be, that she verbalized it to a relative stranger. She just forgot I was a Jew. She knows I am, not many Non-Jews wear an earring of a Star of David in their left ear, do they?
How beautiful. And, painfully accurate. May I use that as my new sig line?
This articulates the core of my distress. Feel what you want, think what you want, I don’t care- it’s everyone’s right. And, of course, SAY what you want, this is America not Amerikka. That doesn’t mean I can’t be hurt by the words. Or, want to lash out here, where it’s safe.
That’s because you’re not a Jew. And I must admit, it’s possible that you don’t have the same visceral reactions even when someone DOES insult your particular ethnicity or religion. That’s great. I do find it sad that you feel you are able to pass judgement on the legitimacy of my reactions, however- without knowing much about me.
That’s not really what I said though,is it? I didn’t say I’ve been avoiding her, did I? In fact, I cannot. I serve under her as a Lt. I’m not so entirely selfish that I’d leave the volunteer public service because of her. I did mention THAT in my O.P. It’s interesting that you find my reaction presumptuous. Please elighten us all, how many blatantly racist remarks does she get to make that are " free and clear" before I am allowed to THINK she is a racist or Anti-Semite? 2? 5? 10? Does she get to spew hatred and filth, and not be judged until she does something physical to show her loathing of Jews? I’m curious as to how this sliding scale works. Perhaps you’d be so good as to inform those of us who didn’t realize that saying something face to face to another person doesn’t count in any way. Me, I’m rather curious to learn. :rolleyes:
It all comes down to what each person feels is prudent. If your tolerance for this kind of self expression allows you to listen to it, and not care, then I supposed we now know a lot more about you than we did 24 hours ago. You’re surely entitled to that !!! Just as I am entitled to be horrified by the very concept that " a few remarks don’t make a racist".
To my way of thinking, ( and, just look at the structure of this sentence… my personal way of thinking, right? ) there’s no middle ground. If you express distaste for someone, personally or by ethnicity, or sexual orientation or anything else, then fine- you’ve laid yourself on the line and made your stand. At least I know now what I am dealing with.
Understanding that mechanism and being able to exist living with it without being upset are too very different things. Just as now I understand your mindset more than I did before. Just means I have no respect at all for you.
You know, SPOOFE, I was sorely tempted to write something violently threatening just to see if it’d shake you, and perhaps make you see a slice of what I felt. However, to be very honest, I’d rather believe that you know what I’ve felt here, and know exactly what I am talking about, and you just are goading me by saying these things. And you’re just not worth the warn. So, even though this is the Pit, you go on and attack me all you wish.
essvee, I got a laugh out of this thread, thanks. And, you’re on the money. 
As for the other posters who have suggested how to deal with her as a person, instead of as a racist, I’m not sure what to do. Believe it or not, I am VERY tempted to go and talk to the Rabbi down the street. I’m not a member of that Temple, but he knows me, and would sit and listen.
I just caught what AbbySthrnAccent said here at the bottom. Right you are ! It’s not a religious opposed to ethnic thing, it’s a common decenty and respect thing.
I am NOT trying to be some agonizingly righteous P.C. Police here. She hurt me in a fundamental way. Now I have to deal with her as a professional.
Cartooniverse
YES, you have indeed hit the core issue. As she verbally backpedalled frantically, she made it clear that she was really just addressing THIS small group of Hasidic Jews. Not the Reformed Jews that live in town, or the Conservative Jews.
I’ve actually got a LOT of negative thoughts about this community of jews, to be honest. Not because they are Jews, however. But, because there is rampant in-breeding, horrific birth defect ratios, and THEY ARE RELIGIOUS FANATICS… ok? Doesn’t MATTER if they are Jews like I’m a Jew, they are the lunatic FRINGE. So, fine, we can talk all day about exclusionary religious zealots, neat and keen.
That’s not what she said. She was short, and blunt. It wasn’t an intellectual discussion on the schtetl mentality, it was pure loathing.
Just to add this bit of perspective, in the eyes of the people she was attacking, I’M NOT A JEW. They see any other part of Juadism as a falsehood. Interesting…but, then I’d rather not totally highjack my own thread 
Cartooniverse
'Toon, I’m not familiar with your posts and excuse me if you’ve already stated his earlier in the thread but are you Jewish? If so I can understand your reaction, if not then I’d agree with Marc & Spoofe. I mean, “Those hebes drive me nuts” - hardly Mein Kampf is it? Is this really enough to make you think about quitting your volunteer job?
Oops, now I feel silly :o
Gomez,
It’s going to get worse for you I’m afraid. Grab something with caffine in it. Drink it down. Feeling better? Ok, here we go…
So yes, he is Jewish but he wouldn’t be consider as such by Orthodox Hasidic Jews.
I always try to down a couple of soft drinks before I post in the morning.
I think the proper reply to the woman in the OP is “Well, shalom to you too. Bay-bee.”
But it could just be me.
In the words of William Shakespeare
“Aww fuck!”
That’s what I get for skim reading. In my defence I’m typing this at work with a killer hangover whilst taking phonecalls at the same time but even so I deserve everything I get after that.
Some comments:
I don’t think one bigoted comment necessarily makes a person a bigot. But if that comment describes that person’s feelings to be bigoted, then one might judge that person as such. If this person says that just seeing some Jews in a car - who she has never met and who have done her no harm, and who might, for all she knows, be the sweetest people on Earth - drives her nuts, she is in effect declaring that she is a bigot.
I would question the statement by CrankyAsAnOldMan that
What is the distinction that is being drawn here?
Also, from Cartooniverse this:
What is your basis for these statements? Do you have any solid basis for these assertions? They seem pretty bigoted in their own right.
As for suggestions about what to do, I would disagree with the various suggestions. None have a high likelihood of accomplishing anything. What they will accomplish is to cause you to focus on it even more, and get even more upset. I say forget about it.
I’m not Jewish, but my father’s side of the family is, and I would be past mortified if someone said something like that in my presence. And I would let her know, too.
I’ve gotten my butt toasted for skim-reading too sometimes. Don’t sweat it. As for my cultural and religious affiliations, others already answered the question
I may be upset, but I’m not gonna lash out at someone for an honest mistake.
Izzyr, I based that rather judgemental statement on countless incidents face to face, that have led me to believe that like any seriously cloistered religious sect, they are fanatical in their beliefs that they and only they are loved by their God. However, that’s an entirely OTHER thread.
Cartooniverse, or as they call me around the Shul, “Rabbi Peter”
I would suggest, if I might, that you would need to have an in depth discussion of their actual beliefs before determining that. But I am even more curious about your first two statements (about “rampant in-breeding, horrific birth defect ratios”).
BTW, would this community be located in Monroe?
I hope I didn’t miss it,(most likely I did) I didn’t remember Toon stating he was Jewish in the OP. Hell in that case I might have thrown her from the vehicle. I will not tolerate ANY racial slurs of any kind. I have asked people to leave my home for using the ‘N’ word.
Like 'Toon those people would probably consider me a Christian. I’m very Jewish, but not religious.
Email me please.
LNO, this quote is also from that article:
I find this truly appalling. It’s false logic. And, this has NOTHING to do with the use of the word “queer”, so everyone simmer the fuck down.
I don’t even find a whiff of pride in the use of the word “heeb” (sic) as a title for a publication. I’m pretty openminded, and it only ONLY smacks of exclusionary self-hatred and embarassment.
I think it’s a despicable choice, IMHO.
I didn’t intend to misrepresent the article in any way- it seemed that quoting the opening paragraph conveyed the same thought (that of appropriating an offensive word for the group’s own use).
How is it false logic?