YOU NONSMOKERS LEAVE ME THE HECK ALONE!

[Sentinel]

If I am correct alcoholism was not considered a disease until fairly recently – like within the last 8 or 10 years. Up until that time, alcoholics were considered to be people of poor moral fiber who could not ‘hold their liquor.’

Would it not be fair to state that nicotine addiction is quite similar? As I have stated, it is one of the most addicting drugs known.

coldfire
Thanks for the suggestion, moron, I just went out and bought a carton and hope to soon sit next to you in a bar that I may share my second hand smoke with you.

[WallyM7]

Like I said:

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL

[pldennison]

If I am correct alcoholism was not considered a disease until fairly recently – like within the last 8 or 10 years. Up until that time, alcoholics were considered to be people of poor moral fiber who could not ‘hold their liquor.’

Oh, bullshit. You better have a cite for this one. The medical models both for addiction and for the action of alcohol on the brain have been known for some time.

(Sidenote: Did you know that, among an experimental group given alcohol, and a control group given scented water they were told was alcohol, the control group began to exhibit the classic signs of drunkenness like slurred speech, giggliness, sleepiness, loss of motor control, etc.? As outlined in Buzz: The Science and Lore of Alcohol and Caffeine, by Stephen Braun.)

Anyway, the simple fact remains that you do not have permission to smoke in my lungs, and repeating ad nauseum the logical fallacy that, since I don’t complain about X, Y and Z I am not entitled to complain about A doesn’t change that fact. Smoke if you have to, but bloody well be courteous about it, obey “No Smoking” signs, and ask in enclosed spaces whether anybody minds. Christ almighty, you’d think those would be obvious.

[Highlander]

Worst case of anal-cranial stenosis I’ve seen in a long time.

[Sentinel]

Shit-for-brains if you had read my initial posts you might have discovered that I do just as you ranted but nonsmokers having sat their fat asses down wind of me - and I in a designated smoking area – bitched about my smoking.

I’ve had nonsmokers sit in smoking areas and bitch at me for smoking and I’m real tired of all of those fucking, obnoxious ads on television making fun of smokers. There are quite a few other equally dangerous things going on which affect everyone and my point is that no one bitches about them to the extent that they bitch about smokers.

In ref to the stigma of alcoholics in the past prove me wrong asshole. Call up any chapter of AA and ask when alcoholism switched from being a condition of moral insufficiency to a disease. Having worked with alcoholics off and on for about 20 years, I think I might know a bit about it and am aware of the current change in opinions. as I said – prove me wrong, shitface.

I have absolutely no problem with people not smoking and, even before the current rage about smoking, knew of people allergic to tobacco smoke and acted accordingly. However, when I follow the current laws and still get bitched at, it gripes my ass.

Plus, in many an establishment there might be no smoking, but it is perfectly acceptable for people to load up on booze and wobble on their merry way with no one making acid comments about them.

You don’t like my smoke? Then stay the fuck out of it so long as I am following the current laws. I hate to say this to you morons, but smoking is not going to go away any time soon.

Did you also know that your side note was one of a couple of hundred experiments of similar ilk and that not all of the placebo subjects responded with ‘drunkenness’? Various tests have been performed with mixed drinks containing no alcohol but a substance designed to give that ‘burn’ a drinker gets and some people got drunk on that stuff.

So what? People have been given sugar pills under the guise of it being a miracle drug and have gotten better. Those forms of experiments only determine the various levels of susceptibility and have been used in attempting to determine the innate ability of the human species to ‘heal itself’ as well as to delve into various forms of psychiatric problems.

There have been medical models for the effects of alcohol for ages BUT the general public and most of the medical fields still considered it a sign of weakness if a man could not hold his drink. Unless you have been to AA meetings and DETOX training courses – like I have – you don’t know what you’re talking about.

WallyM7: If you don’t like what I write, then don’t fucking read it, fuckwad! What a dipshit! You must be one of those guys who just has to poke your nose into things and piss everyone off in your neighborhood until someone belts you one.

[pldennison]

Shit-for-brains

You misspelled “Phil.” Are you even capable of responding to people without calling them profane names, or is that kind of courtesy simply beyond you? Which leads to:

if you had read my initial posts you might have discovered that I do just as you ranted

Ranted? Let’s go to the tape: “Smoke if you have to, but bloody well be courteous about it, obey “No Smoking” signs, and ask in enclosed spaces whether anybody minds.”

Oooooh, stand back, he could blow at any time! :rolleyes: Anyway, if you actually behave that way, you’re in a unique class of smokers comprising about 0.01% of the population.

but nonsmokers having sat their fat asses down wind of me - and I in a designated smoking area – bitched about my smoking.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I’ve had to stand in the rain because some jackass walked into a full bus shelter and lit up, and I prefer not to choke to death if I can avoid it. I’ve had to stop visiting my mother’s house because she and her chimney of a boyfriend seem not to give a shit that my wife has asthma.

I’ll take listening to some nagging prick over severe asthma attacks or choking fits any day–you want to trade? No? I didn’t think so, you self-righteous schwanz. If the worst that happens to you as a result of the actions of a nonsmoker is some annoying bitching, count your lucky fucking stars.

In ref to the stigma of alcoholics in the past prove me wrong asshole. Call up any chapter of AA and ask when alcoholism switched from being a condition of moral insufficiency to a disease. Having worked with alcoholics off and on for about 20 years, I think I might know a bit about it and am aware of the current change in opinions. as I said – prove me wrong, shitface.

You made the assertion, doofus–YOU prove it. And I don’t want “Because I’m some dork on the Internet and I say so.” Cites, boy, cites–show me medical literature or pscyhological literature from the last 20 years that ascribes alcoholism to moral weakness. Show me.

Plus, in many an establishment there might be no smoking, but it is perfectly acceptable for people to load up on booze and wobble on their merry way with no one making acid comments about them.

Yeah, right. Nobody ever says anything about public drunkenness or DUI. It’s not like every July 4th and Memorial Day and Labor Day we are inundated with MADD PSAs and news stories about random stops; or like binge drinking on college campuses is one of the biggest ongoing news stories of the last few years. :rolleyes:

[vanilla]

Amen Phil!(oops, sorry)
I know the bus stop situation. I try coughing, or saying excuse me, could my son breath here? but they don’t seem to comprehend that not all folks Like breathing smoke.

[WallyM7]

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL.

[PeeQueue]

This would probably make a good Great Debate if it wasn’t for…

Anyway, I’m a smoker, although I’ll probably quit soon. All I would ask of non-smokers is that they don’t make snide remarks to me when we’re outside or in those few remaining specially designated smoking areas inside. Or give me those dirty looks. I won’t smoke in their homes, on airplanes, inside at work, or in their cars. I will try to blow it away from them when outside, or in an establishment that allows smoking. So don’t look at me like I’m a lower form of life because I have this habit. Is that too much to ask?

PeeQueue

[PeeQueue]

This would probably make a good Great Debate if it wasn’t for…

Anyway, I’m a smoker, although I’ll probably quit soon. All I would ask of non-smokers is that they don’t make snide remarks to me when we’re outside or in those few remaining specially designated smoking areas inside. Or give me those dirty looks. I won’t smoke in their homes, on airplanes, inside at work, or in their cars. I will try to blow it away from them when outside, or in an establishment that allows smoking. So don’t look at me like I’m a lower form of life because I have this habit. Is that too much to ask?

PeeQueue

[Sentinel]

http://www.alcoholismhelp.com/help/editor/031698.html

Go there. Read it.

pldennison

You misspelled “Phil.” Are you even capable of responding to people without calling them profane names, or is that kind of courtesy simply beyond you?

WallyM7We’re dealing with a Grade A asshole here. - Ignore the prick and he will go away

.

ColdfireWhat an ass. - I think you’re a huge asshole anyway. - white trash with absolutely no manners whatsoever. - Putz - you sure as hell are annoying.

OPALCAT you’re so full of shit **

Sorry if I offended your sensibilities, but I respond in the way I am approached.

The anti-drunk stuff is mainly on television and it has begun to take a back seat to antismoking. People still drink though, don’t they? Granted, it has made many people think before hopping into a car and driving home while impaired. Still, no one forbids alcohol consumption in most places with the exception of the ones they have done so in for years.

My beef is – mind your own fucking business if I happen to be smoking where smoking is allowed. I don’t want to hear not-so-private discussions about what a mindless, inconsiderate crud I am because I puff and you do not. You don’t like the smell of smoke, well I don’t like the perfume you wear.

I don’t bitch at you when you wobble out of a bar and throw up on my shoes, I don’t gripe, piss and moan at you when you come to work with something like walking pneumonia and thoughtlessly spread it around like candy, and I don’t make nasty remarks when you try to fumigate me at a stop light with your oil burning car or try to blast my ears out because you hate mufflers on your ‘hawg’.

If I see you tooting a joint, I don’t give a shit and if you snort a bit of coke, I don’t care so long as you don’t fuck with me. I understand certain areas of separation between smokers and nonsmokers but so long as I follow the laws – shut the fuck up and don’t sit in my smoking area and bitch and don’t sit down wind of me. Use some friggin’ brains.

Most ex-smokers bitch, piss and moan for the ‘Carrie Nation’ syndrome anyhow. SHE couldn’t drink and therefor did not want to be tempted by it so she managed to get prohibition going. Ex-smokers have the ‘taste’ and they don’t want to be reminded of it so they think everyone else should stop because of their lingering urges.

Even recovering alcoholics aren’t that fanatical.

[Sentinel]

Sorry, I screwed up the quotes, but those were statements from the people named, directed towards myself.

[pldennison]

Sorry if I offended your sensibilities, but I respond in the way I am approached.

Let’s see, you quoted Opal, Wally and Coldfire. Which one of those was from me to merit the response? That’s right-none of them.

The anti-drunk stuff is mainly on television

And billboards and radio and print . . . I see it everywhere.

and it has begun to take a back seat to antismoking.

In your opinion.

People still drink though, don’t they? Granted, it has made many people think before hopping into a car and driving home while impaired. Still, no one forbids alcohol consumption in most places with the exception of the ones they have done so in for years.

That’s probably because standing in a room consuming a beer doesn’t get the others drunk, but standing in a room smoking will always fill their lungs with smoke. No matter how you approach it, it’s apples and oranges.

You don’t like the smell of smoke, well I don’t like the perfume you wear.

I don’t wear perfume, or cologne, except on very rare occasions. You ready to trade the nagging for the asthma attacks yet, so you can see what the other side of the coin is like?

I don’t bitch at you when you wobble out of a bar and throw up on my shoes,

I don’t go to bars; they’re full of smokers.

I don’t gripe, piss and moan at you when you come to work with something like walking pneumonia and thoughtlessly spread it around like candy,

I’ve never had anything worse than the flu, and when I’m sick, I call in sick. WHy the hell would I want to be at work if I’m sick?

and I don’t make nasty remarks when you try to fumigate me at a stop light with your oil burning car or try to blast my ears out because you hate mufflers on your ‘hawg’.

Also not me. My car is an in-great-condition 1995, and passed every emissions test by several orders of magnitude below the maximum, in Cleveland, which has some of the most stringent emissions standards in the region.

If I see you tooting a joint,

Never even tried it.

I don’t give a shit and if you snort a bit of coke,

Oh, brother. If I’ve never smoked pot, I’ve certainly never done coke.

I understand certain areas of separation between smokers and nonsmokers but so long as I follow the laws – shut the fuck up and don’t sit in my smoking area and bitch and don’t sit down wind of me. Use some friggin’ brains.

I bet you don’t butt 'em out right in the street or dump your ashtray in the parking lot either, huh, Mr. Courtesy?

[pldennison]

Oh, BTW, a list of “Myths and Facts” from an alcoholism help website is not medical or psychological literature, and doesn’t even itself claim to be reflective of popular opinion. Sheesh.

[Sentinel]

Actually, no I don’t empty ashtrays out in a parking lot, finding that offensive when someone else does it, and I very rarely ‘butt’ my smoke out in the street because I smoke filtered cigarettes and the filters hang around forever.

Who else but alcoholics would know how alcoholics were treated?

And the ‘you’ in my posts was for people in general and if you don’t work when sick, you are in the minority. You ought to be down here in flue season when almost everyone walks around infecting everyone else.

Plus, your asthma sensitivity places you in the roughly 8 to 10% of the general population. I suppose the rest of the population have to be careful that they don’t do anything which might trigger an attack for you? Since you have the condition, it is up to you to avoid places where things might trigger it.

I have an allergy to a certain chemical in some cough medicines and it is up to me to avoid those which have it in them, not bitch, piss and moan about all of those that do.

I would assume that your condition is sensitive to sulfur dioxide also, so do you avoid major cities because of the automobile pollution or actively complain about it to everyone who walks by?

[pldennison]

Plus, your asthma sensitivity places you in the roughly 8 to 10% of the general population. I suppose the rest of the population have to be careful that they don’t do anything which might trigger an attack for you? Since you have the condition, it is up to you to avoid places where things might trigger it.

First of all, it’s my wife with asthma, not me. Second of all, is she supposed to pull a Kreskin and predict who is going to smoke and where, or just stay in the house all the time.

I would assume that your condition is sensitive to sulfur dioxide also, so do you avoid major cities because of the automobile pollution or actively complain about it to everyone who walks by?

We LIVE in a major city. She has never had an attack triggered by automobile traffic with the possible exception of being stuck behind a non-natural-gas RTA vehicle or a diesel truck.

[Coldfire]

Phil, why don’t you and I get out of here and drink a few beers or something?
We’re wasting our time with this idiot.

He still doesn’t understand that people are basically fine with the OP (which is: “If I smoke in a designated area, don’t harrass me about it” - fine), but would like to strangle him for all the other nonsense he keeps vomiting at us.

[Sentinel]

Coldfire:

Leave then. I’m sure as shit not forcing you to stay. Besides – read my latest post up above where I simply state my basic beefs.

I find it offensive to me and other smokers that nonsmokers make such a fuss over what we do when there are so many other equally hazardous things going on that no one says a peep about. In my opinion, the whole no smoking thing has been turned into something about as fanatical as when the entire country decided that almost everyone who worked with kids or hung around kids was molesting them and started a witch hunt.

[WallyM7]

Sentinel\MarkSerlin\NITWATCH\Rainbowcr|et al is a complete and total fucking moron.

Stop talking to the cretin and he’ll be forced to invent another screen name. Eventually, he’ll give up and fuck off. Maybe if we’re lucky, he’ll commit suicide.

[andros]

Sentinel:

Without too much dissembling, if you don’t mind, could you please answer a couple questions for me?

1. Do you believe that smoking is hazardous to the smoker’s health?

2. Do you believe that so-called “second-hand” smoke–that is, smoke both from burning tobacco and exhaled from a smoker’s lungs–is hazardous to the health of those who inhale it?