Do you fight with your spouse/loved one?

In My Humble Opinion
1

I need fighting techniques. Give me your fight stories, your near-divorce battles, and how you resolved them.
I have to learn how to fight.

Background: I’m a miserable fighter. When I was married, I was married to a conflict-avoider, and I tend towards that way, too. We had a total of about 3 fights in the 5 years we were together. Needless to say, I’m just flat out bad at it. I get nervous and usually end up not making any sense and/or in tears.

The current almost-Mr. Athena, on the other hand, loves a good fight. He’d have made a good lawyer. He’s really, really good at fighting and winning, and has been that way most of his life.

So, like many other couples, on occasion we fight. Overall, I think it’s a good thing since in my previous relationship the lack of conflict led to lots and lots of stuff being just not discussed. But at the same time, it’s horribly draining to both of us. We both end up upset, scared, and usually offended by the other’s words. God knows what will happen if we ever have to actually come to a conclusion on something after a fight - we usually fight about incredibly stupid things, and when we calm down after a day or so we realize that we really don’t need to come to some sort of brilliant resolution to whether or not we should put the groceries away immediately upon returning from the store or wait and relax for a few minutes.

After the last round, we’ve come to the conclusion that we really, really need to learn how to fight a little more productively. I don’t see a problem with fighting, per se, but when it degenerates to name-calling and one-upping the other one we rarely get to actually come to resolution on whatever topic we’re fighting about. Someday, we’ll need to do this, and I aim to start practicing now.

Any helpful hints? Good fight stories? Books I should read? How do you all resolve issues that, at the time, make you think divorce and/or murder would be a reasonable solution?

2

Hmmm…are you sure you’re talking about fighting? Because how people define “fighting” varies. I grew up in a noisy & fractious (but very close) family. We did a lot of debating, a lot of arguing, we’d disagree with each other just for the Hell of it, because we all like to argue. We think it’s fun, & sometimes thought-provoking. There’s never any physical violence, & the name-calling is lighthearted & playful. (My dad’s favorite term of endearment for me is “Worthless”, but we all know I’m his favorite.)
OTOH, my BF has a very formal relationship with his family. (His dad’s French, with that very stiff Gallic politeness.) They never raise their voices at each other, not that I’ve ever seen. They always seem to be holding each other at arm’s length.
Anyway, what he thinks of as “fighting” & what I consider to be fighting are 2 different things. Whenever I tell my BF something that he doesn’t want to hear, he says I’m yelling at him, even if I’m using a perfectly normal tone of voice. He is uncomfortable with disagreement, even about abstract stuff that has zero impact on our daily lives.

What I will tell you is what I wish he understood: I can disagree with someone’s opinion & it doesn’t mean that I don’t like them. Just 'cause I don’t like what you’re saying doesn’t mean I don’t like you. It’s OK to argue sometimes…when he starts in on you, stick up for yourself!! Tell him why you think it IS important to put the groceries away immediately (or whatever). Give as good as you get. If he yells or calls you names, tell him not to talk to you that way. DON’T yell back, or call him a worse name.

If all else fails, call me & we’ll double-date. I’ll argue with almost-Mr. Athena, & you & almost-Mr. Fantasia can agree all evening. :wink:

3

Thanks for replying, Stella. I was beginning to think that maybe we are the only couple who fight.

I like the double date idea. I’ve often thought that I should hire one of my friends as my representative when we get into fights. I just hate this fighting stuff.

On to the real meat: I think we both think we’re fighting, because we both tend to get mad and get our feelings hurt. But I am like almost-Mr. Fantasia, in that I often accuse almost-Mr. Athena of yelling at me when he’s not. The crux is that I think sometimes he thinks the same of me. He told me today that he thinks what’s going on is that we both offend the other, but don’t realize that the other person is offended until much later on in the discussion/argument, at which point we’ve both regressed to yelling obsenities at each other. OK, not really obsenities, but they might as well be for all the good they do.

<sigh> If I could break it down into just what goes wrong in the fights, I’d be halfway towards fixing it, and probably not posting my problems on a public message board like this. I can read all your advice and it all sounds perfectly reasonable until we’re actually in a fight, then it seems virtually impossible to do.

Maybe we oughta trade boyfriends…

4

My husband and I fight all the time. We’ve been married 12 years, and STILL we haven’t learned how to fight “right”. I have a tendency to think I hear him saying things that he doesn’t say. I am tempted to tape record our arguments. I also have a tendency to interrupt him, because he has these long drawn out pauses. I would like to respond immediately, and when I can’t, I forget what I wanted to say, which gets me pissed off. He is very good at debating, and almost always wins an argument. I hate conflict, and would rather avoid the issue altogether, or end it quickly. I even apologize when I don’t think I’m wrong, just so he’ll shut up about it. He would rather repeat things endlessly, in an effort to “resolve” the issue.

I hate conflict.

But we always end the fight before we go to sleep.

5

Depends how you define “fight”. My wife and I squabble, crab, bitch, snipe, what-have-you, all the time. Some of our friends are appalled, but we have found that having this type of “friendly” fight, prevents issues from building and leading to a nasty fight. Think of it as a pressure switch. There are no hurt feelings after, no messes to clean. Just cleared air, which is what you want to accomplish. In 8+ years of marriage, I could count on 1 hand the number of really serious, take-no-prisoners fights we’ve had. Also, using this method we never go to bed angry. Maybe not for everyone, but we find it effective.

6

Fighting. Oh boy. Dude and I fight like crazy. All the time. Not really the productive kind, usually. When he tells me my faults, I’m supposed to take these as constructive pearls o’ wisdom, and when I defend myself and point out some of his faults, he invariably says …“there you go again… saying mean things. Nothing constructive about that” … except of course, his isn’t as plainly worded as that.

And he thinks I’m a really smart person, he tells me I’m so much smarter that he is that it is unbelievable, and that I have this utterly fantabulous memory – unless we are fighting. Then I’m wrong about everything, and I don’t remember anything correctly. Sometimes I say “I’m sorry.” – so it sounds like I’m sorry that I’ve supposedly wronged him, but, I am thinking, ‘I am sorry we met… that you were born… that I was born…’

Grrr…

I hate conflict, but I would rather screech at each other for a few hours than let issues build and not speak to each other for a day or so. I always want to try to end the fight or come to some sort of resolution before going to bed – but he doesn’t. He “doesn’t want to talk about it anymore.”

And then he goes and lays down and falls asleep. Always. Leaving me to spend an evening/night stewing, roaming about the house and thinking about all of those nice, sharp, shiny knives in the kitchen drawer. Of course I wouldn’t… but I’ll just say that I wouldn’t want to go to sleep with me that mad and roaming around the house all night.

All of that to say… try to find someone who wants to resolve things the same way you do… either ‘not talk about it anymore until we cool down’ or ‘talk about it until we work it out’. Because being mixed on that can be a real mess…

And try saying ‘I feel that you are being mean’ rather than ‘stop being mean to me all the time’ – this sort of lets people know what’s up without a direct placement of blame on them. But you really both have to try to do that for it to work.

Also, don’t storm out of one room, go into another and lock the door behind you… unless you want it broken down. I could do this, I’m sure, and he would never follow me, but, the one time he did it to me, I asked to be let in, then demanded, then beat on the door, and was just about to go outside for the axe to ‘open it’ when he decided it might be best to let me in. It offends people when you walk away from them.

Hmm… probably lots more than you wanted to know… let me know if any of it makes any sense…

7

My wife and I argue from time to time. She says that I save up things she does that bother me or make me mad, and then I unload them all at once on her. She’s right, but I do that because I know if I bring up any of these things, there’s a good chance it will turn into a fight (no real discussion or problem solving will occur until after she’s calmed down) and I’d rather have one big fight every month or so than a dozen little ones.

I guess that would be my advice - save up your ammunition for when you really need it or the other person is mad already, and then unload it all at once.

8

My wife and I fight from time to time: I think it’s unavoidable in any ralationship where two people pool their resources towards any long-term endeavor, be it a marriage, a business, or a patnership of any kind. In order too keep it civil, I try to attack the other persons’ position in the argument rather than attack the persons themselves. This is difficult when the other side of the argument is based on “feelings”, and you’re arguing facts.

It’s been pointed out to me, generally by women, that feelings carry every bit as much weight as facts when arguing within a marriage. Whaddya think?

9

Well, DUH!!!

10

A topic near and dear to my heart since I’m in the middle of a divorce. One of our biggest trouble areas was our inability to fight productively. Like you, I was a conflice avoider. The more the temperature went up, the more I clamped down. When asked by a counsellor “What kind of animal is Lee?” my wife responded “A turtle. When things get rough he retreats into his shell and won’t come out until the coast is clear.” That was me in a nutshell (turtleshell?). Conflict? Not going to have any part of it. It isn’t worth the mental or physical energy. WRONG! Here’s some “rules” that my therapist gave me.

Some rules for fighting:

  1. Decide what you’re fighting about. Only handle one issue at a time or you’ll get nothing out of it.
  2. No name calling. Its unproductive and hurtful. The idea isn’t to hurt your partner, but to get stuff out there and settle it.
  3. No physical violence. Ever. No exceptions.
  4. No leaving the ring in a huff and slamming the door.
  5. Know when you’ve lost and then give up the point. This can be a real killer.
  6. When you’ve covered whatever it was you had to say end the arguement. It takes two for the excercise. This can be another real killer if your partner wants to keep at it.
  7. At the end of the arguement, tell each other how much you love each other. I used to always end with “I still love you.”
11

Stella,
“Duh”?? Even when you’re arguing, say, about the allocation of funds or some other tangible thing?

12

Eohippus, when I argue with my SO, I am almost ALWAYS arguing about my feelings (I’m also aware that he isn’t). Even when the argument is about tangible things, the reason I am upset is because I’m feeling <insert feeling here>; unappreciated, ignored, like my opinion isn’t being valued, etc. The tangible thing is easily worked out; the feelings that caused conflict for me are not as easy to fix. Just the simple fact of having feelings acknowledged as just as important as facts would go a long way to solving a lot of male-female conflicts, I suspect.

13

Boy do we fight. It gets nasty. Mostly because we fight the exact same way!! We use the same tried&true techniques on each other, which we aren’t used to having happen to us. We’re used to dominating arguments with SOs by being able to point out to the other person “Oh really? Well earlier you said xxxxxx…andnow you say yyyyy…so which is it?” Shit like that. We fight nasty and it hasn’t been pretty because I hold it against myself and then get defensive too easily, while he likes to bring up the past and use it like he’s fighting with barbed wire!

We don’t mind a good back-and-forth, but recently it has become intolerable. It’s turned way too personal and we’re taking each other too seriously to the point of where its no fun to be around each other anymore. It sucks. But we’re working on it. We’ve gotten to the point where we can at least admit that we’re both terrible listeners.

:slight_smile:

14

If you don’t like to fight, then don’t. Don’t ignore problems, but find a very different way to deal with them. Some people enjoy hashing things out in one big blow out; others use different methods. You have to find a method for solving problems that both you and your SO find effective. It sounds like the traditional style fight dosent work for you, and if it hasnt’t so far, it isn’t going to start to. Remember that you can always refuse to get entangled is this style of fight if you don’t like it, can’t express yourself properly, etc. It isn’t fair to you, puts you at a disadvantage.

My husband and I hardly ever fight, but here are some other things we do that I think help us solve conflicts. Obviously, every couple is different, but this is waht works for us.

  1. Everyone has the right to be angry.

  2. NO one has the right to take anger out at someone, even if the other person caused it. You do have the right to address the problems that made you angry, and demand that some sort of solution be worked out so that the situation does not reoccur. But it is your job to keep yourself under control. The temptation to be mean, to be hurtful, to punish, is strong, but a lover is not a child, and it is not your job to make sure they get what they deserve–it is your job to make them understand what they need to understand so that it dosen’t happen again. Refusing to take your anger out on the other person is important. For one thing, the other person tends to respond in kind. Take the time to cool down before you talk things out. There is no issue that can’t wait 15 minutes, and few that can’t wait 15 hours.

  3. Remember that anger dosent have to be anybody’s fault. I get furious at my husband everytime I clean house. I am not really mad at him, I am just mad over the fact that in this cold and heartless universe time has to be wasted on chores. But there is some deep human instinct that when anger is floating around, you look for a target. Once I am done cleaning, anger is gone and I feel better. But it took me a year to figure this out. You may find you and/or your SO have similiar “anger spots”. It is important to learn to recognize these, and learn to avoid each other or something.

  4. Pick your battles. This is a big one for me. You can only have one fight at a time, and the more things you bring up, the less impact each one has.

  5. Remember the good things you and he do. When your SO accuses you of not doing something, don’t bring up all the things he dosen’t do, bring up all the things that you do do. And when you are mad at him for not doing something, try and put it in perspective. I don’t mean that you should concentrate on appriciating the 10% of the housework he does while you do the other 90% with a smile, but I do think that all of us tend to underappriciate our SOs.

  6. If the real problem is emotional, address that on it’s own, and not while fighting–you can not force someone to be more affectionate, or whatever. But I do tell my SO when I am feeling unloved or ignored, and I tell him when I start to feel that way, not later. Learning to do that has helped a great deal.

  7. A few doays later, when all is sweet again, go over the fight, learn what it looked like from your partner’s perspective. Approach this with an honestly curious attitude, as a chance to get to know a side of your mate you rarely see, NOT as a way to fight again. We do this whenever we have a major ‘discussion’ and it seems to help.

  8. Name calling is just unacceptable in my book. Different people are different, but I could not stand it, myself. You’ve mentioned it several times in your posts, so I have to guess it it bothering you too. I would recomemnd a house rule whereby a) the fight ends when the first name is called and b) the person who called the other a name loses (and has to apologize). Then forget about the fight untli a few days later when you can talk through it.

15

Well, there is much good advice here already, but I thought I’d put in my two cents anyway. From observing my parents and through fights with my BF I can tell you a few thigs that work for us.

  1. Try not to raise your voice, but keep a civil tone so its more like a discussion, all parties appriciate this in my understanding
  2. No name calling or insults
  3. Don’t use the terms Never or Always, this is rarely the case. Some things just seem that way to us, but are usually not that way.
  4. Use the phrase “When you say <blank> (Or when you do <blank>), it makes me feel <blank>” this is more constructive and less critical of the other person, and less likely to make them feel defensive. You are taking responsibility for your own feelings as well.
  5. If you can’t resolve the issue, agree to disagree. Sometimes we cannot come to a compromise, so just agree to leave that issue alone.
  6. Try to end with hugs or declarations of affection to make each other feel better and not hold grudges.

This has helped our family and my relationship with my BF. I hope this is of some help along with everything else said here. Also, keep in mind, everyone is different, so pick what you think will work for you.

16

Good stories, all. Interesting that so many of us fight, and so many have problems with it.

Manda JO I like the bit about “the fight ends when the first name is called.” The trick (for me and Mr. Athena, at least) is identifying the name-calling. There’s certain things he does that set me off, and I’m guessing I do things that set him off. Not so much name calling, but invalidating the other person’s opinion or fighting style. Grrrrr…

Eohippus I think there’s PLENTY of tangible things that feelings and emotions have to be considered. Example: Me and Mr. Athena once had a fight over him spending large amounts of money on his new hobby, astronomy. He went through a phase where he’d buy a telescope, try it out, take it back, and buy a new, more expensive one. It started to get to me, and we had a minor fight over it. When it came right down to things, what was bothering me was that I was worried he was spending money he didn’t have, and not putting away money to pay taxes, pay off credit cards, etc. I also worried that he was being “flighty” - buying bigger and better simply because it was out there, not because he really needed it. He addressed both of my feelings - worry over money, and feeling that he was flighty - and we resolved the issue. At the beginning of the argument, it looked like a “tangible” argument - “Why are you spending money you don’t have?!?” and in reality what needed to happen was a little more communication about his money situation and the specifics of why he was unhappy with one telescope and wanted another.

In my experience, almost all disagreements are based on feelings. I feel he spends too much money, he feels that she spends too much time on the phone, she feels that he doesn’t express enough thanks when he’s given gifts, etc. etc. But then again, I’m one o’ those mushy women types.

17

Wow. I think we fought before we met. Unfortunately for me after ten years I cannot distinguish between ‘hurt feelings’ and ‘anger’ as in ‘Well why are you so mad?’ ‘I’m not mad my feelings are hurt!’ ‘You’re acting mad’ ‘Because I’m getting mad!’ ‘Why?’ Urrgh.

When things are tough we band together like nobodies business. Alcoholism, deaths in the family, negotiating to buy back a bit of the family property. We are quite a good team. We really try not to fight. But some days just look out. We are currently in a zone where the slightest bump in the road will end up as a major misunderstanding. I tend to raise my voice without realizing it. By the time my lovely SO points this out, though, it is literally the end of the conversation. Whatever we were discussing, once I ‘yell’ it becomes about me. Why do I have to yell? Frankly I do not realize it when my voice goes up an octave. I come from a large family, and dinnertime conversation could get rowdy indeed. I guess I do raise my voice, probably by habit. My SO throws things. I have replaced the TV remote twice and gone through three cordless phones in five years. I cannot equate breaking things with yelling. She does. We go to ‘relationship training’ every few months: structured dialog, the ‘I’ message, etc. but we get lazy and orbit around misunderstandings for hours. But we really do love each other.

Sorry for the blather, but you are by no means alone. We work on it every day, and mostly enjoy each others company. We long-distance dated for two years, lived together for five years, and have been married for three years. She is my best friend. I wish she would chill out on this ‘feelings’ tangent. Unfortunately my way of getting in touch with my feelings involves onanism which she just doesn’t understand. We have agreed to disagree on so many things, and I would be with no other. If all of this seems confusing believe me, it is. Good luck to you.

18

This sounds really stupid, straight outta freakin’ Men are from Mars, but my husband and I find that it works: say, “I feel. . .” a lot, and ask, “Do you feel . . . ?” often as well.

As many have said, the fight is always about emotions. If the fight was about practical matters, it wouldn’t be a fight; it would be a discussion and nobody would be yelling. The thing is not to be afraid to admit that it’s emotional, and take care to examine and express your feelings.

Take my advice with a grain or two salt . . . I have, uh, what, a year and a half of marriage under my belt? But many more years of fighting. . .

19

Sorry, dustMagnate, but I don’t understand it either. What is an “onanism”?
(bad pun warning - what do you call the head of a large appliance company? A fridge magnate :D)

20

Featherlou + Athena–
Yeah, you’re right. Which are, BTW, my usual words at the end of one of our marital disputes. Probably the reason we’ve lasted 17 yrs.