I'm going to the Bahamas!

The BBQ Pit
1

Yes, that’s right, ladies and gentlemen: I’m going on vacation. I’m headed for 4 days and 3 nights of relaxing on a cruise ship and seeing some foreign beaches. So why is this in the Pit? Because I’m not the only one going on this trip. Oh, no. My sister and her husband are coming.

Now, I love these two. They’re a fun time and we’re pretty close, I guess. Unlike many Dopers, I come from a stable, loving, normal household. So it’s not the presence that drives me crazy. It’s that they’re spending the money to go on this expensive trip. Money that they owe to my brother, my father, and me.

Thing is, I can’t say anything about it because we’re all surprising my father for his 50th birthday and it wouldn’t mean as much if all his kids weren’t there. So she’s semi-obligated to go, and while it wouldn’t be the end of the world if she could go, I certainly can’t be the reason she’s not going.

It’s not that I need the money. I’d rather her (and her toddler) have it until they’ve got some money saved, but to give it to the cruise line instead of your relatives just seems…wrong. On the one hand, if she comes on the cruise, then it’s a pretty flagrant in-your-face to all of us. On the other hand, if I tell her to keep the money, then who am I to say how she spends it? On someone else’s hand, if I demand my money from her, then I’m almost bankrupting her family.

I really want to call her up and say “Hey, did you come up with the money to come on the trip? Oh, you did? Swell. Give it to us. You’re staying home. Better luck next year.” But I can’t do that. So I’m telling you guys instead.

Oh well. At least I know it’s things like this that make me my parents’ favorite :wink:

2

Who decided to give him a cruise for his birthday? If you agreed with the decision, I’m not sure that you have a right to complain. Why not give him something that all of you can afford, and all can participate in?

3

It’s complicated. First, it was New Orleans. Then it was Tennessee. Then no one thought they could make it. Then it was a cruise. Then it was yes-no-yes-no from all the kids.

But to be clear, his husband is the one taking him on the cruise. The kids being there is a surprise. So it’s not like we’re all contributing to buying him a ticket. That’s already been taken care of. So by demanding some money from my sister, we wouldn’t be shouldering someone out of a gift contribution.

In order to convince myself of that, I’d have to believe that she and the brother-in-law are going “for dad”, when clearly it’s 10% dad, 90% simple vacation.

4

Who decided that, exactly? Who proposed that some or all of the kids would go on the cruise as a surprise? What part did you play in the decision?

Again, if this was partly your decision, then I don’t think you have much right to complain.

5

4 days/3 nights on a cruise ship? What’s that, maybe < $2K for a couple? OK, it’s not chump change, but it doesn’t sound like the kind of money you should be getting stressed out about either.

OK, we don’t know the full story of their finances and why they’ve borrowed from all their relatives. If they’re just generally financially irresponsible, then it’s kind of annoying. But if they’ve had a rough patch but are now doing OK and have reasonable prospects of paying the money back in the future, well, let them enjoy their vacation.

6

Simple rule of life: don’t lend money with the intention of ever seeing it again. When I loan anyone money, for whatever reason, I just assume I’ve given it to them as a gift. If I get it back, great! Otherwise every little thing they spend it on is going to eat you up.

7

Which would your FIL like more: having his kids there or knowing they paid the money back? If he’s like my folks, having the kids there will thrill him. Focus on how happy this surprise will make him. Think of it this way- they’re not giving it to the cruise line but using the cruise line to make dad happy.

8

How do you feel about telling your father that his daughter can’t join everyone at this special event because she needs to pay back your loan first?

9

Sounds like she’s kind of between a rock and a hard place, keeping-family-happy wise.

10

I think your problem is not with the money for the cruise itself, but apparently, that they are bad at properly repaying a loan, apparenlty caused by bad budgeting if they also don’t save.

I think that’s what you should talk over with them - if this is a situation they can change. If their wage is too low to either repay or save up, then your advice will be unhelpful; if they are the arrogant intentionally ignorant sort, talking will not help.

If they are just clueless, but you can talk with them, then adress this in a friendly manner, and explain that it’s not only about repaying your loan, but also that you think saving up is important, and that maybe they just need to know a few tips, like how to make a budget, or how to save money. I don’t know the details of the situation, you do, so you have to make the call.

11

Simpler rule of life: Never, never loan money to relatives. Someone always gets hurt/offended. Of course, the converse of that it: Never, never ask a relative for a loan. That’s what banks are for.

12

I agree with this, while still being sympathetic to the original complaint.

A friend of mine once owed me money for a year. It wasn’t huge, but it was a non negligible amount to me. Her family had had a series of unexpected bills. (Washing machine broke, one of the dogs needed expensive vet care.) Still, I was a little shocked to hear about her ski vacation, since money was apparently so tight.

To her credit, she did eventually pay me back without me mentioning it. (I had mentally written it off at that point.)

13

You can vent but unless your sister’s family is financially irresponsible, I think your feelings are beneath you.

If you have trouble enjoying the cruise because your sister came on the cruise despite owing you money, I think you probably have some issues you need to work out.

14

Even if she is going on this cruise 90% for her and 10% for your dad, chances are, she needs the holiday more than anyone else in the family. It’s stressful being broke all the time, owing people money, denying yourself things because people will judge you for spending on yourself when you owe so much to others.

Unless she has violated specific terms of paying back the loan, I’d cut her a little slack for the sake of a happy time for the family.

15

This is exactly why I had a contract with payment schedule drawn up when I borrowed money from my parents one time (hey, I was young and I needed liquidity, they were going to flat give it to me and I refused).

Chessic, your actual dilemma here is pretty simple: what’s more important, the money or your father’s happiness? You are not a mind reader, and you cannot know that the 90/10 split you imagine is actually the case unless they’ve said as much.

16

I have to agree with this. A few years ago my parents celebrated their 50th anniversary by bringing the entire family on a cruise. (At their own expense.) What they’ll remember for the rest of their lives is not how the money was spent, but how great it was to have the entire family together, an increasingly rare event.

This is not about you, it’s about your father.

17

“Surprise, Dad! Your family’s all here to enjoy your birthday cruise with you! Well, everyone except Sally and Bob. We told them not to come. But here’s some of the money they owe you! Isn’t that better? Happy Birthday!!”

I don’t know your Dad, CS, but I can’t imagine this is what he would prefer. You should let this one go, for his sake. Just have fun on the cruise, treasure the time with your family, and don’t begrudge Sis for doing the same.

18

This is why my first rule when I set out on my own was to always be in a position where I didn’t have to borrow money or if I did to make sure it was from a financial institution not a friend or family member.

Forgive your sister’s debt to you and then forget about it (except the part about not loaning people money, that is key). Enjoy th cruise with your family around you.

19

This pretty much says it all. Your situation, OP, is one of the reasons everyone says don’t lend to or borrow money from family or friends - you don’t want to be watching every penny they spend that isn’t paying you back, but you don’t know all their circumstances, either - they might want very much to pay you back but critical expenses keep coming up or something. It just makes everything unpleasant. I also agree that your sister is a “damned if she does, damned if she doesn’t” situation, too - she might not want to spend money she can’t afford on a cruise, either, but that’s what the family decided.

20

I do that, but it still offends me to see Mom toss away 600€ on a pair of glasses. If you can’t make ends meet without “borrowing” from relatives despite having no debt and a good income, you shouldn’t be buying Dior frames.