My 9th grader started high school yesterday. Today she was suspended for having a knife.
It is one of those Swiss Army types, which she has at her desk at home. She mentioned to a friend in 1st period that she had it, someone overheard and told on her. 3rd period she was called to the offices, where security was called to take it from her and measure it. There will be a hearing before a 3 member panel on the 21st, but she is out of school until then at least.
Mr. L is freaking, saying we need to get character references,write a speech, hire an attorney and so forth. He also feels that since I did not become upset on the telephone with the principal, and that our daughter was not crying in the office, that this is a mark against us as we showed no remorse or concern. Both my daughters and I are extremely calm people, and do not get upset easily. I realize the seriousness and I feel that once the panel understands that this was a simple mistake (she does not carry a knife by habit, she does, however, have a pacifier with her at all times), that she will be allowed back to school. This is a good kid who still has a blankie and sleeps with stuffed animals. The blade on the knife is 2-1/8 inches, and no, she should not have had it with her.
Suggestions? Should I gather references together? call an attorney? cry at the hearing? Anyone have any experience with something like this?
These are strange times. I nearly always had a Swiss army knife on me when I was growing up, and wouldn’t have thought twice about using it to say open a bottle of soda on school grounds. But things have changed, and yes I understand the concerns. I really hope they keep your child’s best interest in mind and do not try to make an example of her. Good luck.
Last year my brother (8th grade) checked out a book from the school library. When he opened the book in class he found some really nasty, threatening things written in it about several students as well as some disturbing drawings. He gave the book to his teacher.
As a reward for doing the right thing he was suspended for a school for a year. His pockets, locker and book bag were searched. He was brought to the police station and questioned before our parents could even get there. He was terrified because they told him that he was probably going to go to Juvie.
It took about two weeks to clear the whole mess up.
I guess what I am trying to say is you should take it very seriously. What she did was not just against school rules. It was also a crime. She could have been arrested. It is possible they won’t let her return to school this year.
If I were you I would call a lawyer. It might help things from getting to out of control.
Your daughter sounds like a walking contradiction. That knife and pacifier/blankie combination sounds quite extreme. Has she given you a reason for having the knife on her person in school?
Of course, as Cecil put it recently…
In that light. Fight the good fight. Rip the principal and staff a new one. Read the schoolboard the riot act.
(Pssst… I’m sure it’s nothing, but just in case, have your daughter talk to a specialist.)
Frankly, I think that this whole No Tolerance, or Very Little Tolerance policy thing is pure bs. What is she going to do with a knife blade that’s under 2 inches? I mean, you can’t really go on a killing spree like that… if there’s more than one person around, then they could just tackle you and voila, it’s over.
There was a slashing incident at my school a couple months ago. A girl had a pocket knife (I forget the blade length… 4 inches maybe) and slashed another girl. The school realized that the victim wouldn’t even have scars, so all they did was ask the attacker (it wasn’t really, they were already in a fight when the knife appeared) to transfer out of my school. I think that’s a good idea, I mean, neither girl was traumatized, and though the media blew it way out of proportion, no one complained about the punishment of either girl.
But when a kid gets suspended for a tiny utility knife, then that’s just insane.
In the school district here there would be a hearing as it sounds like you are going to get, but it’s a moot point. She’d be expelled for the remainder of the year.
I’m sure it’s not what you want to hear, but you may want to start looking into private schools or purchasing a home school curriculum.
My first year teaching, one of my 3rd graders brought a pocketknife to school. He’d brought it, turned out, because he didn’t have scissors. I never saw the knife; it was after school, when he was showing it off on the school bus, that he got caught.
He was immediately suspended, at age 8, for an innocent mistake. Zero tolerance, again. I have mixed feelings about the whole thing, as there’s been such an increase in violence and threatening situations that a message does need to be conveyed–as well as butts need to be covered.
For your daughter, a one-day suspension would be understandable. It was a more or less innocent mistake, although she probably should have known better. If they want to do anything more drastic than a day, I’d fight it. A one-day suspension won’t ruin her reputation or her future, at least it shouldn’t.
If you get a lawyer, try to find one who seems like a reasonable negotiator. You want to make sure that your daughter’s procedural rights are protected, and that would be the reason to get a lawyer. The only danger is that in some cases, the involvement of a lawyer can really escalate the situation. (And yes IAAL, so I can say mean things about them. Also, I am not giving legal advice–merely practical advice). Some lawyers will fight about everything, important or not, and the real issues will be lost. Sometimes school officials (and other people), faced with a lawyer who is too confrontational, entrench. Again, the real issues are lost.
Do they have knives in the school’s cafeteria? If so, why aren’t they considered weapons? As far as I’m concerned, a Swiss Army knife is a tool. It’s not a weapon unless it’s used like one. A knife or fork from the cafeteria could inflict just as much damage. So could a sharp pencil.
If the school’s position is that any knife, no matter how small, is a weapon, then they should remove all the knives from the cafeteria too. I understand the need to keep children safe, but we need to use a little logic too. Kids get injured and killed in bus accidents every year, but schools still use them…
No, she shouldn’t have had it with her, but the punishment should not be blown out of proportion either. Hire a lawyer and speak to the school board. Maybe if you’re lucky they’ll see how silly absolute rules can be in certain contexts.
I wish you luck in fighting against the knife suspension, but I must air my concern about your daughter always having a pacifier on hand. Now, I’m not expert on drugs, but I do watch 20/20 and Dateline and understand that one of the affects of the drug Ecstasy is a clenching of the jaw and that kids who use Ecstasy chew on pacifiers to help fight that reaction.
I don’t wish to make any accusations against your daughter, I’m sure she’s a lovely young woman. But the mention of the pacifier made me raise my eyebrows.
A crime? Really? Unless she actually threatened someone (did she?) or the laws of that particular state or municipality specifically prohibit carrying pocket knives on school property, I don’t think you can call it a “crime”.
I graduated from high school in 1992 and carried a pocket knife to school (and then college) nearly every day. And I used it in right in front of teachers when it was useful. No one ever made a fuss about it. Then again, I never went around saying, “Psst, want to see my knife?” It was a tool, not a weapon or a toy to be played with.
IMHO, zero tolerance requires zero thought, and that’s why the weak-minded like it.
I am not sure about the laws everywhere mrblue, but it is a illegal where I live to bring any weapon on school property. You can be arrested for it and people have. I guess I should have qualified my statement.
I use to carry a swiss army knife to school too (1n 93). I don’t see the harm in it. How else are you going to cut your apple during lunch?
I remember back in Spring of 200, during my Senior English class, at one point my teacher had trouble getting something or other opened, and she asked the class if anyone happened to have a Swiss Army Knife.
~long pause~
“Ma’am, you trying to get us in trouble or something?”
“No, I’m dead serious. Do any of you have a Swiss Army Knife or something?”
Well, I always brought my Leatherman with me, actually it was a “Micra” mini that went on my key chain. If you saw me fidgeting with my keys, you saw it. So, I whipped it out and let her borrow it. No complaints.
This past May, a friend of mine happen to have her same class, and he had a “mini” keychain swiss army knife. He got suspended for the rest of the school year (read: expelled) after she saw it dangling on his key chain.
I’ve yet to figure out why she reacted in that fashion to his little key-chain SAK, and didn’t with my keychain-leatherman. I guess because she asked specifically.
I too am confused by the ‘pacifier’ reference. I read it as perhaps being a stuffed animal or other object of security [and even this seemed strange for a 9th grader] because it simply didn’t make sense to me. Are we indeed talking about an infant’s pacifier?
You don’t say what you mean by ‘suspended.’ People here are talking about Zero Tolerance, but if she just got a few days of in-school suspension, I’d say just take the suspension and move on.
I know it sounds crazy to a lot of people here that students aren’t allowed to carry knives. But there are a lot of deeply unbalanced kids in my school, and most acts of violence by students are not premeditated, but carried out in a moment of passion with whatever weapons happen to be handy. I’d prefer they didn’t have a nice sharp knife on them when it happens.
But most teachers understand that the pocketknife is more likely to be a lapse of memory than a threat of violence, and I doubt your daughter is going to get a reputation as a thug. I assume the rule is in her handbook, so unless it’s an extremely harsh suspension, I’d accept it gracefully and move on.
To begin with I think you are responding correctly. “Don’t Panic”. In spite of what they are portrayed to be, most administrators are rational human beings. They must, however, play by the rules set down by the local and state school boards and the state department of education, which can be a royal pain. The rules (and in most states, the law) states no knives in school. If they limited it to four inch blades those kids who slash with razor blades will contend that the razor blades are not four inches, so the administration is forced to bust a kid with a Swiss Army Knife.
The principal in charge will probably know the difference. He will also take into consideration you’re daughter’s background–no trouble, right? and recommendations of teachers. This is where your husband could well be right. You might get letters from her previous year’s teachers and principals as references.
I would be hesitant to go the lawyer route. At this point in the school year, school officials don’t really want a legal case and would just as soon have it be a “…and don’t ever do anything like this again” response.
I might recommend that you call the school’s counseling office and see what the counselor recommends. Generally speaking they (the counselors)are student advocates and also know what is happening in the minds of the administration.
Understood, and I don’t mean to pick on you, but I expect that whereever you live the law would be more specific than the word “weapon”. After all, a baseball bat can be a pretty lethal weapon, but it’s hard to imagine making it illegal to have one at school under any circumstances. And no doubt teachers are allowed to have utility knives of some sort.
A suspension in this case seems rather harsh, assuming (as the OP implies) the child had no prior record of being threatening, the knife was for the most part harmless, and the incident in question was completely innocent in nature. Personally I don’t care if it is the rule that the child be suspended–there are exceptions to every rule, and it’s wrong to teach kids to blindly follow every one without exception. Laws are based on interpretation, and if school is supposed to teach students how to live in the real world, a school’s rules should be modeled in the same way. If the intent of the rule against knives is to protect students, then it should be enforced to that end. Punishing students who have made an honest (and reasonable) mistake in the same way as students who intend malice is unfair.
In re: the pacifier–it could also just be a signifier object denoting hipsterdom among her social circle. That kind of infantile stuff used to show up on MTV (aka the Teen Style Handbook) all the time. I thought it had gone out of style by now, but maybe it’s in again…
Anyway, it doesn’t necessarily mean that your daughter is an Ecstasy addict or in need of psychological intervention. It could also be an example of how the adolescent mind makes no damn sense to anybody not currently in posession of one.
As you can see mrblue, the law isn’t much more specific then weapon. I was talking about students and weapons rather then teachers or cafeteria staff. You can see the exception for them. But, for a student almost any sharp pointed object can be called a weapon.