And Mubarak’s government has also been doing it for us, when we render captives over to them.
I also posted this in the ATMB thread, but Slate had an interesting article on what “sexual assault” means and why that phrasing was used. It’s not like devilsknew or anyone else wondering is some sort of sick person for asking.
Of note:
I can imagine that this sort of thing happens a lot you get a mob together – be it at a frat house or a political demonstration. Mob mentality certainly seems to bring out the ruthlessness in people. Who can forget images of Reginald Denny’s beating caught on camera – the poor trucker who was the most famous victim of the '92 Rodney King verdict riots? In addition to Denny’s assault, over 50 people died in those riots, and the mob attacked children, women, the elderly…and looted and burned property belonging to their own people. I certainly wouldn’t have wanted to cover that story, whether I was a woman or man, white or black.
I’m relieved Logan is okay and am grateful to the heroes who saved her at the risk of their own safety.
My understanding was that Logan and her associates believed she had been targeted by pro-government elements as a conspicuous and uncooperative Western reporter, not that she was victimized by actual democracy demonstrators.
Egyptian women in the square had been saying throughout the uprising that the culture of the movement was dramatically unlike previous Egyptian street culture in which women were commonly subjected to lewd remarks and touching.
I think you made the wrong choice. That’s a fine post and it has this wonderful paragraph in it.
“Mob of 200 people” being hyperbole there, of course?
Hello Mr. Mapcase. I’ve no interest in a lengthy debate on your quote there, but I have an assertion for you to consider:
When someone takes a un-nuanced position regarding an aspect of human behavior it usually means they’re pushing an agenda, rather than seeking truth.
Contending that rape is always about power rather than sex is not a nuanced position.
And the notion that a pretty blonde reporter shouldn’t report from Muslim countries is?
Well, it’s not something I’ve ever expressed an opinion about, but FWIW IMO there are situations when it’s just fine to have a pretty blonde reporter report from a Muslim country.
In the original statement about the attack, CBS stated, “… she and her team and their security were surrounded by a dangerous element amidst the celebration. It was a mob of more than 200 people whipped into frenzy.” So if you want to assert hyperbole, lay it on CBS.
Actually it looks like the specific hyperbolic claim I was looking at came from Amanda Taub at wrongingrights.blogspot.
I can understand a description of her being “surrounded” by 200 people, as you quote from CBS, but not being “subject[ed]… to a prolonged beating and repeated sexual assaults” by 200 people, as Taub reformulates it.
What, were they lined up? Two hundred people can’t all get in shots on one target if they tried, without considerable time and organization.
Though I have to say that even the original mention of 200 people is suspect; exactly how could they tell that these two hundred were different from the tens or hundreds of thousands in the larger crowd at the moment?
It is entirely possible for 200 people to participate in assaulting a person, even if all 200 aren’t throwing punches and kicks. You have an inner core beating up the victim, while those around that core are both preventing the victim from fleeing, and preventing others from going to the aid of the victim.
Does that mean there were exactly 200 people involved? No. It’s obviously shorthand for “a lot of people, more than just a dozen or so.”
Given what has been reported - and that it took more than 20 people to extricate Ms. Logan from the situation - I could envision the mob abusing her to be in the triple digits. I’m not going to doubt the reality of the situation simply because no one has an exact count of the perpetrators.
Why is it important to focus on one phrase of that blog post with which you can possibly find fault, and which doesn’t change the gist of the points being made? It’s an intellectually dishonest way of arguing.
For what it’s worth, I think it’s perfectly natural to wonder whether “sexual assault” means “rape” _ not for prurient interest but to have an idea of what kind of trauma a person has endured.
The latest People magazine quotes an unnamed Logan friend as saying she was not raped. The friend says Logan almost certainly would have been raped if bystanders had not intervened to help her.