(This is where the conversation got a little… I don’t know, sad…)
JC: “One of the problems we have as Democrats is that we always get hit with the ‘tax and spend’ label. For example, the tax cuts. Everyone is asking us ‘are you going to repeal the tax cuts?’, and we are, but as soon as we propose something, the Republicans are going to hit back with their ‘tax and spend’ message, so we have to fight against that, which is extremely difficult because we are, in fact, raising taxes and increasing spending.”
(He seemed genuinely perplexed and concerned about this, almost defeatist. But it was late and, I’m sure, everyone was tired.)
JT: “Well, if you are going to let the opposition literally set the terms of the debate, you’ll always find yourself in a losing position. When they accuse of you being ‘tax and spend’, and you defend yourself on those terms, you already lost as you accepted their parameters and the validity, moral and intellectual, to their arguments. Why not work to change the terms of the debate?”
JC: (amused) “Like what?”
JT: “Well, take ‘tax and spend’. I would counter it with, say, ‘invest and build’ with my message being ‘There was a time in America where we were capable of great projects, where we would invest and build in the Panama Canal, we invested and built the Apollo Project, we invested and built the Manhattan Project, invested and built the Interstate Road System, our education system, etc, etc, etc. But since the conservative mantra of ‘tax and spend’ became the norm since the 1980s, we no longer do great things. What is the greatest thing America achieved since 1980? Collapse of the Soviet Union? They largely did it to themselves, so it can’t count. The Internet? Started in 1960, in the age of ‘invest and build’, so it doesn’t count. Facebook? Is Facebook really the greatest thing America has produced since Reagan took office? ‘Tax and spend’ is killing what is great about America, our civic duty to ourselves and our country’s potential – let’s get back, all of us, to investing and building.”