A poll and general discussion about interracial relationships

In answer to the new questions: I think my parents are less racist than most white people I know of their generation (they were born in 1959 and 1956). They are from Hawaii and while they themselves never dated anyone of a different race, they had a very racially and ethnically diverse group of friends always and raised us with no racial prejudices. I think my mom might have a little bit of a problem with us (I have two sisters) dating black men, because both my sisters have and they have said she seemed extra-uncomfortable about it, but she would never say anything incriminating because she knows damn well it’s wrong to hold a guy’s race against him.

It’s a moot point though because I barely see my parents and extended family.

I have poor tolerance for racism, and if my family persisted in making racist comments in front of me I might cut them off completely. It’s something that makes me see red.

And of course I don’t feel interracial dating is inappropriate by any measure, for me or any other person of any race.

Ah, I get it. Thanks for the response. I’d call that a cultural thing, then. The black women are not “marrying up” so much as marrying within their socio-cultural group, educated professionals. That makes sense to me.

Given what I know of SA history, I can understand that socially there’s still a certain amount of difficulty with the black man/white woman combination. I’d expect that to change in the future, though. At some point it’ll become “cool” and “edgy” and then it will become common.

Not sure why, but the only South Africans I’ve known in Australia have been Cape Coloured, I don’t think I’ve ever met one who’s entirely white or black. Thanks again, it’s easy to hear about life in the US or Britain, less common to hear from a place like SA.

  • How much would a negative reaction from a family member to you dating interracially impact your decision to continue dating a) the same individual, and b) any future individual of a different race?

My family doesn’t worry about stuff like that. I have mixed-race cousins, it’s not a big deal.

  • Do any of you feel that it’s completely inappropriate for you to date outside of your race (or for anyone to date outside of his or her own race)? There was some discussion earlier of the idea of black women perhaps getting the short end of the stick when black men date interracially, and I’d love to explore that further, particularly if it relates to other races, as well.

I don’t feel that it’s inappropriate in general, but it depends on the social/racial situation in your local environment. Certain races in certain areas are treated as “trophies”, and I don’t believe that kind of stereotyping is ever appropriate. So, yes, I find white women who only sleep with black men creepy, and I find white men who are only interested in Asian women creepy.

I also only seriously dated two guys, both of whom were white. I married the second one. I have, however, had casual dates, hookups, mutual crushes and noncommittal agreements with a fairly wide variety of people. (I guess I was never really all that into being exclusive as a teenager.) Neither of my parents would have been all that thrilled for me to bring home a person of another race, but some of it would be due to a cultural divide-- my mom was always fairly critical of boyfriends and friends until they got past the initial “cold foreigner” stage she always put on. It definitely made for interesting first impressions, and some friends never really got past the “your mom’s a weird foreigner” part of being friends with me. FTR, I’m white but don’t really use the designation for myself-- I normally identify as being of Icelandic descent to show that my skin color has little to do with my cultural outlook.

I find a lot of things attractive in men and women, and I don’t use skin color or culture as a marker for appropriate dating material, but sometimes the particular shade of skin in combination with other features makes a person more attractive as a whole, regardless of color. I think with me (initial attractiveness- appearance only), it’s the uniformity of tone and a bit of warmness to the skin-- I’ve been struck equally by this reaction with shades of alabaster, caramel, mocha and mahogany skin-- there’s something remarkable about someone with beautiful skin.

To expand on that last comment, I think if you’re ruling out potential partners based on their race, that’s bad.

Plenty of people in this thread have said they’ve only ever been with people from their own background, but that they wouldn’t have ruled out anyone based on race alone. I think that’s perfectly reasonable.

But I have met/talked to people who do rule out potentials based on race. If you’re ruling out anyone because they’re a different race to you: creepy. If you’re ruling out people because they’re not of whatever race you’ve decided is sexy, even if that’s different to your own race: creepy. Both attitudes are highly racist, in my opinion.

I’ve heard arguments that it’s based on aesthetics (“I only find black/white skin attractive”) but… well, that’s not very convincing. It sounds to me like an excuse, not a reason. There are attractive and unattractive people of all races, and the greater part of attraction comes from personality, not looks.

We’ve all met people who were physically attractive but who turned out to be unpleasant people: you can’t maintain a relationship based on looks alone. And I’ve met people who were physically plain but who were such lovely people that they became beautiful in my eyes. Attraction is only based on looks until you get to know a person: beyond that, looks are a secondary factor. Unless you’re incredibly shallow.

:dubious: I did say in the same post you quoted that I’ve dated Korean guys before, in college. My two serious relationships have been with white guys but that’s more of a matter of circumstance - the first one was when I was doing my MA, and the MA in Humanities program at UChicago is mostly white people, and the second was a fellow English teacher in Seoul, where again, the community is mostly white.

Similarly, I dated Korean guys in college because I attended college in Seoul, where 99% of the guys are Korean.

Ideally I’ve always wanted to marry a fellow Korean American - someone from a Korean background but culturally Americanized, like myself, but there aren’t a whole bunch of us around, unless you live somewhere like LA.

My preference isn’t for any kind of race, but for someone I can relate to. All my casual relationships with Korean guys ended badly because we had different expectations that stemmed from different cultural backgrounds. I started dating them because I found them attractive but once we were actually in a relationship it never worked out.

My parents have a HUGE problem with me dating someone who’s not Korean. They really believe that marriage involves a lot more than two individuals, and they desperately want a son in law that can hang out with our relatives and participate in Korean culture. They want a son in law that can fluently speak Korean with them (both my parents speak English very well, but they are much more comfortable with Korean).

Honestly, I understand where they’re coming from, but the problem is that the pool of candidates who fit this category but who ALSO can speak English fluently (a must for me; English is my first language) and is generally someone I’d be attracted to is very very small.

I don’t want to marry someone who is going to upset my parents, because I love them and I want them to be happy for me. But if push came to shove I would marry the person I loved despite my parents’ protests. Fortunately they have mellowed out a bit in the past few years. They still haven’t quite given up hope that I will magically find a Korean husband, but they are no longer opposed to my current boyfriend, who is Irish.

Just because I have not does not mean I would rule it out. I would probably not do well with it because of cultural differences but that is what dating is for. I have trouble finding men of my own race that I would date.

What I’m saying is I am not wearing a Burka for any man. I am not supporting a man that chooses not to work. I don’t want a player, a drunk, an abuser, an ego maniac, a slob, a person without morals. I would not give up my faith for a man or switch to his. I would not date a man with adult children at home. I would not date a felon again or anyone in a gang or organized crime. I would not date a politician. Of any race!

I have learned this the hard way. I have dated millionaires that are closet neo Nazi’s or total perv’s with bondage rooms. No thanks, I don’t need your dirty money. I have dated many types but I let the best one get away.

- How much would a negative reaction from a family member to you dating interracially impact your decision to continue dating a) the same individual, and b) any future individual of a different race?

It’s easy for me to say it wouldn’t matter to me, but perhaps I’ve not sufficiently appreciated this actually being a possibility. There are certain things in my life that I do purposely avoid bringing up to my parents because I know how strongly they would disapprove and don’t want to deal with it. Maybe if my family disapproved strongly of interracial dating, I’d have been discouraged from dating outside of my race. Then again, the thoughts in my head about whatever it is I think or how I spend my weekends are easily something I never have to share with them (outside of some mild-to-moderate tongue biting at Thanksgiving dinner); deliberately manipulating my love interests and/or hiding them in order to avoid scorn are much, much different, so maybe I would put my foot down. So, I don’t know how I’d treat the situation, even though I’d like to think my inner I-Do-What-I-Want would do what it wants. I have no problem doing whatever the hell I please despite people’s disapprovals, but for some reason, it’s a lot tougher with family. Hell, I haven’t even come out of the atheist closet yet, and I’ve been agnostic since I was 12 years old, and full-blown official atheist since 17.

In any case, in real life (hypothetical babbling aside) my family, fortunately, couldn’t care less about what race I’m dating if they tried. I have one sister who gets all “kill whitey” at times, but she’s very easy to ignore in that regard. The rest of my family doesn’t care, and my parents certainly don’t. Maybe because they’re not d-bags? Maybe because they had to deal with scorn out “outside” dating themselves? They’re the same race, but my grandmother nearly died 1,000 deaths when my mother dared married an American.
**There was some discussion earlier of the idea of black women perhaps getting the short end of the stick when black men date interracially, and I’d love to explore that further, particularly if it relates to other races, as well. **
This is why I agree with ReticulatingSplines when he says this poll would be interesting if divided by gender. Black, White and Latina (Latino/a not a race, I know, let’s not go there when you know damn well what I mean) women very often want to only date and sleep with men of their own race. My cite is the people I’ve known my entire life. For them, their race is the entire dating pool. For men, the dating pool is people. Men, of any race, will usually date/screw whoever they like or think is cute, and never even have any concern over the races that people of their own race are seeing. Very, very rarely have I heard a few black men whine that what he defined as “educated black women” were either fiercely single, or didn’t date black guys. Now of course, I’ve got my theories on their theories, which are a separate conversation entirely (or maybe not), I’m just saying this kind of gripe has been otherwise nonexistent among men in my admittedly limited personal experience. And while this kind of gripe is not common among women either, if I were to categorize these types of complaints by sex, I’d reckon 95% have come from women.

To this, I give you this, from another thread I saw in CS some months ago.

Yeah, what is it with Korean parents? I’m Korean but if I ever dated a Korean girl, her parents would quietly have me killed, because I am apparently anathema to their entire way of life. I don’t speak Korean and I hate Korean food. If you’re a foreigner and can’t speak Korean, oh well, but there’s a special place in hell reserved for a Korean who can’t speak his own language. And not liking the food? I’m going to have my own suite in that joint.

My parents are the same way, but they’re mellowing out a little too. That’s not to say they don’t have their obnoxious moments, though. My girlfriend right now is white, and one time we were having dinner together when my mom wistfully said, “I hope your sister finds a nice Korean boy, so we get at least one Korean in-law in the family,” right in front of her!

I’m pretty sure nobody has even informed my grandparents because they’d die of shock seeing me with a blond girl. And if they didn’t die, they’d probably disown me. But eh, it’s not like I’m missing out on a huge inheritance.

Not exactly, but you said this in a different post:

Just kinda made it seem like you dated the Korean guys because they were there, but the people you actually prefer are white. Of course, I could be misinterpreting. One of the white guys I dated in college asked if I had any issue with dating a white guy and I said something like, “Well I don’t really have any choice,” to which he grimaced a bit. I see how it came across to him that I was saying I don’t like white guys, but was forced into dating them based upon the highly white population of my college. What I really meant was that I of course had no problem dating white guys, and if I did, I’d have been assed out living and going to school where I did. I suppose the way I worded it wasn’t quite right.

Well shit, come to LA. The first apartment I ever had was in K-Town. :slight_smile:

I am sorry…as others have pointed out your poll i flawed…

I have dated…farked and would marry inter-racially…
jeez…diversity IS our strength…dont you all get it?

Finally! Someone on this board drunker than I am.

- How much would a negative reaction from a family member to you dating interracially impact your decision to continue dating a) the same individual, and b) any future individual of a different race?

This is a really good question. I probably have a bit of a different take than other responders. As I mentioned in my response to your previous questions upthread, my parents are an interracial couple. Because of the difficulties and outright racism they experienced when my siblings and I were children in the '60s and early to mid '70s, and even before they were married, they were extremely concerned with who we would choose to socialize with in our teens, and strongly discouraged dating for as long as they could. Their rationale was if we don’t date we won’t have to experience what they did.

Once it became obvious that my parents weren’t going to be able to control our every move 24 hours a day, my mother switched gears a little and decided if we were going to socialize at all, with the same or opposite sex, that it should be with black people. Somehow my mother convinced herself that we, who bore closer features and pigmentation to our father than to her, especially my sisters, would be welcomed and accepted better by blacks than whites. Both my sisters, however, had other things in mind, and dated white guys without my parent’s knowledge. My younger sister was able to hide that our mother is black from her friends for a surprisingly long time, maybe two years, before the inevitable slip-up happened, and her social life changed overnight.

I didn’t begin dating until college, I’m convinced, because of the years of emotional conflict and racial identity confusion my parents, in an attempt to protect us from making the mistakes they did, unknowingly afflicted me and my siblings with. One pronounced lasting effect is that none of my siblings or I have had children, and we’re all in our 40s. Another is although we all dated whites and blacks when we were younger, the 5 of us are each currently in long-term, committed relationships or marriages with people who are not of either race.

In recent years, now that my siblings and I are adults with lives of our own, both my mother and father have each, on different occasions, discussed with us how our lives probably would have been easier if they were both either black or white. It saddens me that they still feel this way because although being raised as a biracial kid in Kansas in the 1960s was pretty unique, to say the least, the experience has molded me into a person with, if not unique perspectives, perhaps a heightened sensitivity to racial issues, and definitely a strong desire to assist others who may be in conflict.
**

  • Do any of you feel that it’s completely inappropriate for you to date outside of your race (or for anyone to date outside of his or her own race)? There was some discussion earlier of the idea of black women perhaps getting the short end of the stick when black men date interracially, and I’d love to explore that further, particularly if it relates to other races, as well.**

As the child of two people who dated and married outside of their race, I don’t think it’s inappropriate, no. I do, however, believe that once the relationship crosses the threshold into the desire for permanence and couplehood planning, especially as relates to the prospect of children, it’s important to research the challenges other interracial couples experience that couples of the same race don’t.

Not at all, in either case. It would only impact my ability to maintain any contact with said family member. Racism is an unforgiveable no-no to me, no matter who from.

Definitely not. Hell, I don’t even think it’s inappropriate to date outside the species.

It’s a stupid argument, predicated on racism, IMO. What shorter end are they getting, exactly?

Would you date a man of a different faith absent a requirement that you switch?

No, just sloppier. Heavy is the head that wears the crown. :wink:

My love for my family is not unconditional. I expect decency and tolerance from them. If I don’t get it, bye bye family.

*- How much would a negative reaction from a family member to you dating interracially impact your decision to continue dating a) the same individual, and b) any future individual of a different race?
*
It is emphatically not acceptable to my family, nor is homosexuality. They would be considered sins on the same level. If I were to feel attraction to a person of another race, I would try to nip it in the bud because it just would not fly.

- Do any of you feel that it’s completely inappropriate for you to date outside of your race (or for anyone to date outside of his or her own race)?

I think it’s okay, but for me personally the price would be too high.

DG, how does your family define race (you’re white, as I recall)? As in, would they be okay with a Spanish guy? Greek? Turkish?

I am astonished that Olives is willing to not date whomever she likes, just because some insecure black women she met are butthurt about interracial dating.

There are plenty of awesome black men out there of every stripe that are happy to date black women. Most black men that marry, marry black women, although the beauty of the white woman don’t escape the black man, I am sure.

Olives, if those women can’t find a good black man, it isn’t because half of them are in jail. Let them either step their game up, or re-evaluate what they are willing to accept. It is not on you to have to ‘step aside’. Fuck that shit.