It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[QUOTE=Vihaga]
Here’s why I do it. In many people’s opinions, a Halloween party doesn’t feel as festive if no one wears a costume, a funeral doesn’t feel as somber if everyone’s wearing Hawaiian shirts, a play isn’t immersive if the actors aren’t wearing costumes, and a religious ceremony doesn’t feel as religious if the pope is wearing jeans. In many occasions in society, the feel of a given event is enhanced if the guests as well as the hosts participate and contribute to it. Refusing to participate in the host’s planned version of the event is rude. Whether it’s a beach party, a masquerade ball, or a hoedown, disdaining the stated intent of an invitation that you accepted is not polite. If I accept an invitation, I try to contribute to the festivities, which includes enhancing the mood by dressing appropriately. As a result, if I’m not feeling festive or I am not interested in what will be happening, I simply decline the invitation. If I’m only going out of obligation, I obviously care enough about the person throwing the party to fake it convincingly.
To me, it sounds like you want to go to any event you choose without giving even the slightest amount of thought to how your presence contributes to (or detracts from) the event. I’m sure most of us have been to concerts or sporting events with bad crowds, family events with bad relatives, and parties with boring and unpleasant guest lists. It sucks, and being part of the failure of an event is an insult to the host.
[/QUOTE]
Well put.
It is not a matter of enforced conformity, like wearing a uniform, because you are not forced to go to the event. It is more a matter of politeness, in dressing in whatever costume is suitable for the particular event.
[QUOTE=PaulParkhead]
It’s just that we can make awful mistakes.
[/QUOTE]
Of course. I don’t think anyone has said differently.
One can’t help but think that there are a few hypocrites out there with regards to appearance. I am not accusing anyone in this thread of this, although I was once this person myself. Old worn floodpants, tee shirt with holes in it, ratty shoes, six-month-old haircut cut by the cheapest barber he could find, three days beard growth. Can you picture this guy? “Hey man, looks are superficial, people should like me for who I am! Everyone is so materialist and elitist! People are too hung up on looks!”
Do you know someone like that? Tell him that you know a woman who likes him.
“Is she hot? I only go out with chicks who are hot.”
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
You are so not invited to my wedding.
As if someone’s going to talk me into having one. 
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
So a host may never hold a costume ball or theme party, because to do so is “imposing conditions” and “putting themselves ahead of their guests”? :dubious:
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
What the hell are you talking about? Is this a whoosh? A WEDDING of all things isn’t about the people getting married? That’s like really one of the few events that actually IS about the people throwing it. Regular “parties” are for the guests - but something like a wedding or graduation is about someone in particular.
I have never before encountered the viewpoint that “asking people to wear something nice to a WEDDING is rude.” I think that is completely ridiculous. Then don’t go, and screw you for making a big deal out of nothing.* If you want to be a lazy slob go ahead. Most guys don’t like wearing ties. Some women, including myself, don’t think dresses are very comfortable. But putting effort into looking nice for a special event is not pulling teeth and it’s not rude.
*again, not YOU, but you in general
[QUOTE=Jodi]
No, it isn’t. People size each other up all the time, constantly; we all do, even those who profess that they don’t. “Functioning human society” still requires assessments of who is friendly, attractive, trustworthy, as well as assessment of who is mean, not our type, not to be trusted. What baffles me is the assumption that any of us owe it to anyone else to look beyond what we choose to appear to be in order to discover some “character” that magically will be different than how we choose to appear. Very few people do that, because very few people have that kind of time.
[/QUOTE]
Note the word CHOICE. Its often bad (but not always) to make judgements about someone over something they don’t have a choice about. Black young man = dangerous is not a fair judgement. Nor is handicapped = stupid. Fat does not equal lazy. But we make choices in how we dress and present ourselves to the world. If we’ve chosen to not dress appropriately for an occation, that says a lot about our character. If we’ve chosen not to be neat in our appearance, that is communicating something about ourselves to the world around us.
[QUOTE=Dangerosa]
Note the word CHOICE. <snip>If we’ve chosen to not dress appropriately for an occation, that says a lot about our character. If we’ve chosen not to be neat in our appearance, that is communicating something about ourselves to the world around us.
[/QUOTE]
Exactly!
There’s a false dichotomy being represented here. Not wearing a suit does not equal “dressing like a slob.” You can be neatly and nicely dressed without wearing a striped confomity noose around your neck.
[QUOTE=Malthus]
So a host may never hold a costume ball or theme party, because to do so is “imposing conditions” and “putting themselves ahead of their guests”? :dubious:
[/QUOTE]
They can still have costume parties or whatever. It’s only rude if they make participation madatory. They should let people know they’re welcome whether they dress up or not.
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
Are you wearing socks and birkenstocks right now?
[QUOTE=Dangerosa]
Note the word CHOICE. Its often bad (but not always) to make judgements about someone over something they don’t have a choice about. Black young man = dangerous is not a fair judgement. Nor is handicapped = stupid. Fat does not equal lazy. But we make choices in how we dress and present ourselves to the world. If we’ve chosen to not dress appropriately for an occation, that says a lot about our character. If we’ve chosen not to be neat in our appearance, that is communicating something about ourselves to the world around us.
[/QUOTE]
I don’t like your use of the word “appropriate.” That amounts to assuming your own conclusion. It is a matter of opinion whether not wearing a suit is “inappropriate.” My position is that it’s inappropriate to make that kind of demand on a guest.
[QUOTE=lobstermobster]
Are you wearing socks and birkenstocks right now?
[/QUOTE]
I have no idea what this means.
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
I have no idea what this means.
[/QUOTE]
birkenstocks, the big flat hippie paddles people strap to their feet. And socks.
[QUOTE=myskepticsight]
What the hell are you talking about? Is this a whoosh? A WEDDING of all things isn’t about the people getting married?
[/quote]
No, it’s about inviting guests to witness and share it. The notion that weddings should primarily serve the people getting married is toxic and false.
[QUOTE=lobstermobster]
birkenstocks, the big flat hippie paddles people strap to their feet. And socks.
[/QUOTE]
Do you have a webcam in my house somewhere?
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
Well, this just isn’t true. It’s about them all right. And I’ll tell you why-- the only people who are really going to remember the wedding, who are going to look at pictures of it for the rest of their lives, are going to regale their children with tales of it, are the people getting married that day. It’s a once in a lifetime moment for them (they hope), and it will be part of their life history. That’s why it’s ABOUT THEM. Not because they have the right to be tyrants, or because they’re self-absorbed assholes. Beacuse it’s a big deal and a social ritual that we all acknowledge as a singular, meaningiful event in a person’s life. The couple keep srecords of it and looks back on it. You can be part of it if you choose. Why not be nice about it and try to let them have it how they want it? Within reasonable limits, of course. I don’t think telling people it’s cocktail attire is unreasonable, though.
Don’t we all go along with things, conform to social expectations, when we don’t want to? It seems like that’s sort of the basis of civilized society. Of course it can go too far, but not in this case. It’s juvenile of WhyNot’s husband to refuse to dress nicely to someone else’s wedding, because… he will forget the wedding, for the most part, within a week. The couple getting married will remember it forever. Why should one of their memories have to be the groom’s BIL dressing like a slob?
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
Well, this just isn’t true. It’s about them all right. And I’ll tell you why-- the only people who are really going to remember the wedding, who are going to look at pictures of it for the rest of their lives, are going to regale their children with tales of it, are the people getting married that day. It’s a once in a lifetime moment for them (they hope), and it will be part of their life history. That’s why it’s ABOUT THEM. Not because they have the right to be tyrants, or because they’re self-absorbed assholes. Beacuse it’s a big deal and a social ritual that we all acknowledge as a singular, meaningiful event in a person’s life. The couple keeps records of it and looks back on it. You can be part of it if you choose. Why not be nice about it and try to let them have it how they want it? Within reasonable limits, of course. I don’t think telling people it’s cocktail attire is unreasonable, though.
Don’t we all go along with things, conform to social expectations, when we don’t want to? It seems like that’s sort of the basis of civilized society. Of course it can go too far, but not in this case. It’s juvenile of WhyNot’s husband to refuse to dress nicely to someone else’s wedding, because… he will forget the wedding, for the most part, within a week. The couple getting married will remember it forever. Why should one of their memories have to be the groom’s BIL dressing like a slob? They might want to forget it, but then there’ll be those damned pictures.
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
Well, this just isn’t true. It’s about them all right. And I’ll tell you why-- the only people who are really going to remember the wedding, who are going to look at pictures of it for the rest of their lives, are going to regale their children with tales of it, are the people getting married that day. It’s a once in a lifetime moment for them (they hope), and it will be part of their life history. That’s why it’s ABOUT THEM. Not because they have the right to be tyrants, or because they’re self-absorbed assholes. Beacuse it’s a big deal and a social ritual that we all acknowledge as a singular, meaningiful event in a person’s life. The couple keep srecords of it and looks back on it. You can be part of it if you choose. Why not be nice about it and try to let them have it how they want it? Within reasonable limits, of course. I don’t think telling people it’s cocktail attire is unreasonable, though.
Don’t we all go along with things, conform to social expectations, when we don’t want to? It seems like that’s sort of the basis of civilized society. Of course it can go too far, but not in this case. It’s juvenile of WhyNot’s husband to refuse to dress nicely to someone else’s wedding, because… he will forget the wedding, for the most part, within a week. The couple getting married will remember it forever. Why should one of their memories have to be the groom’s BIL dressing like a slob?
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
I’m rooting for a guy to stand up against the tyranny of being dressed by his wife like a 5 year old.
[/QUOTE]
:rolleyes: And suddenly all becomes clear. Dude, if you loathe dressing up so much, cowboy up and don’t do it. It’s not our fault that you feel henpecked by your wife or whatever. Neither is it the fault of the people who so ungraciously chose to get married and invite their friends and family.
Most weddings have dress codes. Deal with it, or don’t go. Problem solved.
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
It’s not ABOUT them. Weddings are about the guests, not the couple getting married. It’s irrelevant what the couple wants. Their job is to make their guests feel welcome and comfortable. Hosts should never put themselves ahead of their guests or impose conditions for attendance.
[/QUOTE]
:dubious:
Says who?
The wedding is ALL ABOUT the couple getting married. The guests are there to share in their joy and wish them well in their life together, but the fact remains that a wedding is a wedding, whether it consists of the bride and groom and the officiant, or the bride and groom and officiant and 5000 assembled spectators including full bridal party.
Two of my friends are about to get married in a yoga-inspired ceremony. Nevermind that I’m about as flexible as a 2x4… I’m going to go, dress myself up in the most colourful beaded thing I can find in Little India, and I’m going to do my bestest attempt at a Downward Dog or whatever other hippy dippy karmic nonsense they choose to involve in their ceremony. And why am I doing that? Because I sincerely believe that they’d be the first ones to don full scuba gear if I was to get married underwater, or show up in clown suits if I decided to have a circus wedding, or get dressed to the nines if I go formal - and then head home and thankfully change back into their comfy casual Birkenstocks.
It’s their freakin’ day, and they can do whatever they damn well like with it. My choice is simple: put up, or shut up.